Arch-Enemies That No Longer Fit the Role

[manymade1]

Over recent years, I've noticed a lot of villains that used to fit the arch-enemy role have kind of segued out. Different factors include them turning more good than bad, other villains taking over the role, etc.

Who are some examples of villains that can no longer be seen as an arch-enemy?

Magneto is the first person to come to mind for me, and I would argue he's the definitive example. Even back in the day, he tended to flip flop but at this point, for every story where he's been the villain, he has 5x as many stories where he's a good guy. I guess the problem is that given his character, it really wouldn't make any sense for him to stay bad. His cause has always been noble, and he's a very human character, so it's almost unrealistic for him to continue to be bad.

Sabertooth is another example. His rivalry with Wolverine seems to mostly have been left in the past.

[Frontier]

I'm pretty sure Sabertooth still hates Wolverines guts with a passion. I think they did a mini about him leading a kill squad to take him out when they got a whiff he might be alive again.

Loki hasn't really been Thor's Archenemy in a long time but nobody's really taken his spot either.

[Riv86672]

Red Skull and Captain America?

I’m not 100% sure on that one so asking as well as suggesting. I can’t remember the last time the two really clashed in any kind of major plot line/issues long/huge payoff/w. consequences event.

[Raye]

I'm pretty sure Sabertooth still hates Wolverines guts with a passion. I think they did a mini about him leading a kill squad to take him out when they got a whiff he might be alive again.

Loki hasn't really been Thor's Archenemy in a long time but nobody's really taken his spot either.

As mentioned above, I think Malekith and to an extent Gorr (he can't really be used recurringly tho) were set up as his replacements, I know Malekith got killed, but like Loki hasn't been killed and/or imprisoned tons of times, he'll escape, that's part of the deal. And if not, there is still time to address who takes his spot, with the whole roles deal that was set up, it seems like something that will have to be sort of officially filled at some point, even it hasn't been revealed yet. Cates did set up Sif as Heimdall's replacement in terms of role, so he seems to be continuing that aspect. (tho yeah, that's one that kinda needed to be filled for like, practical reasons) but i mean it's been 10 years, and it's worked out alright without him as the big bad. I'm not sure it's something that really NEEDS to be filled, in terms of just comics recently. I think the idea of a personal recurring nemesis that they fight more often than not has just kind of fallen out of fashion somewhat. There are some recurring villains still, sure, but it's somethig you see less of, and with Thor, he corner of the universe he occupies has the potential to be so large, because of all the relams, and he can go cosmic or whatever, that he's very easy to come up with new baddies for.

I think everyone i could think of has been covered pretty much, there are some that haven't really changed in such a way that they can't be a bad guy for a hero, but they just aren't used a lot, like Mordo for Strange just isn't used a lot these days, but he does still come up on occasion.

Red Skull, i mean he died, which means he's not being used, sure. But he died while fighting Cap (well, Stevil technically, but still) while in the middle of an elaborate plot to take control of Cap, so i dunno if that counts for him not being his nemesis, since i think it's clear that if he got resurrected, which seems like it may be happening, they'd be right back to fighting.

[Snoop Dogg]

Ross was always Bruce and the Hulks' archenemy. Leader or Abomination or whatnot aren't personal enough. Not like it matters, since modern Hulk writers are generally not interested in firing those guns anyway.

[babyblob]

Venom is by far not Spiderman's Arch enemy any more. I mean the two have worked together several times. With the whole Superior Spiderman thing I wouldnt put Doc Ock as a Spiderman Arch enemy but that will most likely change now that old Doc Ock is back.

[LifeIsILL]

Juggernaut and X-Men

[Michael Watkins]

Juggernaut and X-Men

He would be more popular if he had started out as, say, a Thor villain.

[Toxin45]

Ross was always Bruce and the Hulks' archenemy. Leader or Abomination or whatnot aren't personal enough. Not like it matters, since modern Hulk writers are generally not interested in firing those guns anyway.

Ross lost that status when he became anti-hero though

[Raye]

I don't think being an anti-hero necessarily disqualifies him, because he could still be an antagonist to Bruce specifically, because he has always genuinely believed the was doing the right thing when he was going after Hulk. Nemesis does not necessarily have to equal a villain, as long as they are in opposition to each other.

[Tien Long]

Venom is by far not Spiderman's Arch enemy any more. I mean the two have worked together several times. With the whole Superior Spiderman thing I wouldnt put Doc Ock as a Spiderman Arch enemy but that will most likely change now that old Doc Ock is back.

The first "villain" that came to mind. Yes, he started out as Spider-Man's evil mirror image, but over the decades that has certainly changed into something different. After all of the team-up's and fighting against symbiotes, these two have changed a lot. Rereading Absolute Carnage, I feel that Spider-Man and Venom can no longer be called bitter enemies, but rather unlikely allies. Hell, they're approaching a brotherly type of relationship.

[Silver Fang]

I'm gonna say Jobbertooth as well. Because Wolverine does not see him as an "arch foe", some much as a repeated annoyance. And that's exactly how he's written. Logan doesn't fear or worry about him. Any so-called "rivalry" they have is just one-sided hating on on Jobber's part. And one-sided beat downs on Logan's part.

Hell, i'll go so far as to say Jobbertooth doesn't even deserve his alias anymore. Give the name "Sabretooth" to someone who's actually strong.

When it's so one-sided, arch nemesis doesn't seem to fit, so much as "pest."

[Doombot]

I'm gonna say Jobbertooth as well. Because Wolverine does not see him as an "arch foe", some much as a repeated annoyance. And that's exactly how he's written. Logan doesn't fear or worry about him. Any so-called "rivalry" they have is just one-sided hating on on Jobber's part. And one-sided beat downs on Logan's part.

Hell, i'll go so far as to say Jobbertooth doesn't even deserve his alias anymore. Give the name "Sabretooth" to someone who actually is fierce & dangerous.

When it's so one-sided, arch nemesis doesn't seem to fit, so much as "pest."

It's too bad, as Sabretooth was cool cool back in the day. He should be a terrifying person to encounter. But to be honest, I don't know why Wolverine would ever worry about anything as he's virtually invincible these days.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

I'm gonna say Jobbertooth as well. Because Wolverine does not see him as an "arch foe", some much as a repeated annoyance. And that's exactly how he's written. Logan doesn't fear or worry about him. Any so-called "rivalry" they have is just one-sided hating on on Jobber's part. And one-sided beat downs on Logan's part.

Hell, i'll go so far as to say Jobbertooth doesn't even deserve his alias anymore. Give the name "Sabretooth" to someone who's actually strong.

Sabretooth is poised for a big role in HOX/POX and currently he seems intent on hating all of Krakoa, rather than just Logan.

When it's so one-sided, arch nemesis doesn't seem to fit, so much as "pest."

Claremont really did want Sabretooth to be Wolverine's Arch-Enemy and he saw Sabretooth as Wolverine's superior and maybe Logan's true Dad or whatnot. The thing is that never entirely went into the comics because Wolverine broke out and became a big star, and Sabretooth, editors agreed just didn't seem to make sense as an arch-enemy for a character that was becoming so big. He was a one-dimensional thug when originally written and aside from being really really strong (which again so is the Hulk, Wendigo and others Logan tussled with) offer anything.

Wolverine in general works without having an arch-enemy. As the tagline of Logan goes, "Nature made me a freak, Man made me a weapon, God made it last all too long". At different moments many different characters have gotten in his face far more than Sabertooth ever did. Magneto ripped his skeleton out, Apocalypse made him a Horseman, and in DOFP a Sentinel fries him, and the one time he hit on Spider-Man's wife, Peter Parker hurled him out of the top floor of Stark Tower.

[Frontier]

I'm gonna say Jobbertooth as well. Because Wolverine does not see him as an "arch foe", some much as a repeated annoyance. And that's exactly how he's written. Logan doesn't fear or worry about him. Any so-called "rivalry" they have is just one-sided hating on on Jobber's part. And one-sided beat downs on Logan's part.

Hell, i'll go so far as to say Jobbertooth doesn't even deserve his alias anymore. Give the name "Sabretooth" to someone who's actually strong.

When it's so one-sided, arch nemesis doesn't seem to fit, so much as "pest."

That's never been my experience with it.

From my reading, nothing is more visceral then how much Logan hates Creed, and if he tries to downplay Sabertooth's threat is as much posturing as when Creed calls Logan "runt."

Sabertooth is everything Wolverine rejects about himself, which is part of why he hates him so much.

Claremont really did want Sabretooth to be Wolverine's Arch-Enemy and he saw Sabretooth as Wolverine's superior and maybe Logan's true Dad or whatnot. The thing is that never entirely went into the comics because Wolverine broke out and became a big star, and Sabretooth, editors agreed just didn't seem to make sense as an arch-enemy for a character that was becoming so big. He was a one-dimensional thug when originally written and aside from being really really strong (which again so is the Hulk, Wendigo and others Logan tussled with) offer anything.

I think Sabertooth is pretty commonly regarded as Wolverines Archnemesis, especially with all the focus adaptions put on their rivalry.