View Poll Results: Better female character

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  • Rey

    5 29.41%
  • Michael Burnham

    12 70.59%
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  1. #1
    Mighty Member Beaddle's Avatar
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    Default Rey (Star Wars) or Michael Burnham (Star Trek)

    The two women are the current central figures in the star wars and star trek universe. they both have High Mary sue qualities, please which of the two ladies do you prefer more?

    Personally I like Rey better. Michael Burnham is beyond a ridiculous character in the star trek mythos. I don't know what the writers were thinking to come up with such a character, she is not just a Mary sue but a self insert. Rey on the other hand a much weaker re-imagination of Luke SkyWalker but not a ridiculous figure.

    tumblr_pcp438gbf51xwall3o1_500.jpg
    Last edited by Beaddle; 12-09-2019 at 03:42 PM.

  2. #2
    Mighty Member Godzilla2099's Avatar
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    I don't like either. I'll vote for Burnham. She's at least had education and experience.

    Rey: After hearing the force is real, she's able to pilot the Millennium Falcon against TIE Pilots, resist Mind Control from Kylo Ren, Mind Control a Storm Trooper, telekinesis, and beat Kylo Ren in a duel with zero lightsaber experience.

    Burnham: Another case of pushing a character too hard and throwing others under the bus in order to elevate.

    Overall, there have been ladies in both Star Wars and Star Trek that I light years prefer over these two
    Last edited by Godzilla2099; 12-09-2019 at 03:56 PM.

  3. #3
    Incredible Member Bat-Meal's Avatar
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    It's been way too long since I binged season 1 of ST Discovery, but I remember liking Michael. And finding Rey was too overpowered too quickly (where was the training montage) in the new Star Wars, so I'll go with Michael.

  4. #4
    Niffleheim
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    I can't comment on Burnham because every time I try to watch Discovery I switch it off because of the new Klingons and Force Awaken was enough for me but I'll be surprised if she surpasses Rey on the Mary Sue factor.

  5. #5
    Extraordinary Member Jokerz79's Avatar
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    I like Rey I have issues with her instant Jedi Knight abilities but I like her as a character. Michael Burnham I want to shove her out the airlock which saddens me I loved the actress on TWD but I find Michael completely unlikable.

  6. #6
    nice to meet ya! master of read's Avatar
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    sigh. don't make me pick.

  7. #7
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    The sexism is real. We have tons of male driven fiction with competent bad ass heroes male heroes but when they are female they are called “Mary Sue”. A term that doesn’t even make sense in this context because neither Rey nor Michael are “creator representations” in the stories.

    Rey and Michael are the protagonists of their stories and should be depicted competently. Is Rey somewhat overpowered, yes but that doesn’t make her any more of a “Mary Sue” than someone like “John Wick” or a host of action movie male characters that mow down everything and everyone in his path. Michael on the other hand is just shown as being brash (something that straight caused her imprisonment), but competent.

    Most of the criticism around Michael centers on the fact that 1) she’s female 2)she’s a person of color headlining a major franchise. Two things the alt-right members of fandom (those middle aged guys on youtube that complain about everything female or,minority driven) have a problem with. She’s an intelligent member of the Star Trek series in line with previous protagonists, should she be depicted different because she’s female?

    I prefer to see my heroes, whether male or female be competent, sexists be damned.
    "Obviously not all conservatives are racists/bigots but all racists/bigots claim to be conservative"- Unknown

  8. #8
    Incredible Member Bat-Meal's Avatar
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    Speaking of female protagonists in sci-fi, I really like the new Doctor Who.

    Can't wait to watch the new season! But, it's not out until next year.

  9. #9
    Extraordinary Member j9ac9k's Avatar
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    I'll take Rey over little that little snot Anakin anyday.

  10. #10
    Extraordinary Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    From what I've seen of both, I like Rey more as a character, but I think they're pretty different ones, so tricky comparing them (also, haven't had a chance to really dive into the DSC stuff).

    Quote Originally Posted by Beaddle View Post
    The two women are the current central figures in the star wars and star trek universe. they both have High Mary sue qualities, please which of the two ladies do you prefer more?
    Thing is, Rey being a Mary Sue was DOA back in 2015; the facts and logic did not and do not support that conclusion.
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  11. #11
    Mighty Member Beaddle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jokerz79 View Post
    I like Rey I have issues with her instant Jedi Knight abilities but I like her as a character. Michael Burnham I want to shove her out the airlock which saddens me I loved the actress on TWD but I find Michael completely unlikable.
    I won't call Michael completely unlikeable but rey is definitely more likeable. Michael is an irritating character. why I call her ridiculous is because she is now this central figure in star trek that was never mentioned again from star trek TOS to star trek Beyond.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bat-Meal View Post
    It's been way too long since I binged season 1 of ST Discovery, but I remember liking Michael. And finding Rey was too overpowered too quickly (where was the training montage) in the new Star Wars, so I'll go with Michael.
    That's fair enough but discovery season 2 was awful and Michael Mary Sue's rader are off the chats. It was bad enough season 2 had poor story telling but Michael taking Center stage on that foundation almost made season 2 excruciating watch, season 2 was saved by Captain Pike and to an extent a young Spock. Michael was the weak link in season 2.


    Quote Originally Posted by Godzilla2099 View Post
    I don't like either. I'll vote for Burnham. She's at least had education and experience.

    Rey: After hearing the force is real, she's able to pilot the Millennium Falcon against TIE Pilots, resist Mind Control from Kylo Ren, Mind Control a Storm Trooper, telekinesis, and beat Kylo Ren in a duel with zero lightsaber experience.

    Burnham: Another case of pushing a character too hard and throwing others under the bus in order to elevate.

    Overall, there have been ladies in both Star Wars and Star Trek that I light years prefer over these two


    I must warn, there are SPOILERS AHEAD. Read at your own risk.




    I find Michael Burnham worse. she started the klingon war, she has never taken any real convincing responsibility of her action yet she somehow is accepted on discovery and is adored by everyone. she is basically sarek's soulmate in a weird way, his almost death last thought was about her not Amanda or even spock, she has three mothers, all once shown in one episode talking about how much they care about her, in the mirror universe captain locca was basically in love with her. Saru dislikes her in episode 1 by episode 7 she is basically his confidante. she is a full human who excelled better than vulcans and was only rejected from the Vulcan science academy because she was human.

    Rey is different, the force is more about feelings and destiny chose you. it makes sense in a way for her to defeat Ben, maybe rey got the keys to the kingdom too easily but at least you don't really have to explain any science fiction stuff in it unlike star trek. Michael is basically the centre of everything in stat trek discovery far more than rey is the center figure in star wars ST. Michael is worse.
    Last edited by Beaddle; 12-10-2019 at 12:25 AM.

  12. #12
    Incredible Member Bat-Meal's Avatar
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    Not reading those spoilers, I intend to get around to watching S2 of ST Discovery eventually. I like the Orville better than ST these days, so S2 of that got priority. Anyway, from what I recall of S1, isn't Michael supposed to be a stuff-up. I mean, she got sent to prison for messing things up and stuff, that is the opposite of a Mary Sue IMO.

    I think I need to rewatch S1, I've forgotten most of what happened.

  13. #13
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    People still seem to forget that Luke and Anakin did the same stuff or more so than Rey. But nobody calls them Mary Sue for that.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowfyr View Post
    People still seem to forget that Luke and Anakin did the same stuff or more so than Rey. But nobody calls them Mary Sue for that.
    Thats the issue. SW fans will love and praise Luke (but only OT Luke who was frankly bland, if you insist that someone may actually change over 40 years they shriek) but as soon as you point out that Rey and Luke are pretty similar they go nuts.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowfyr View Post
    People still seem to forget that Luke and Anakin did the same stuff or more so than Rey. But nobody calls them Mary Sue for that.
    Some guys just don't like seeing female characters doing stuff that the guys couldn't do.

    If Rey were male, some people might complain but you wont see thousands of videos about them complaining about "whamen".
    "Obviously not all conservatives are racists/bigots but all racists/bigots claim to be conservative"- Unknown

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