Excalibur [04} : Fall back and think of England Spoilers

[Veitha]

How is the ability to create earthquakes out of nothing at all not manipulating the Earth?




It’s “Queen of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, Head of the Commonwealth and Defender of the Faith”, thank you very much.

Rictor always had a semimystical connection to the Earth. He felt lost after MDay because he was no longer connected to it. He's not just like Avalanche or Quake.

[Knightmare]

Double Post please delete if possible.

[Knightmare]

I didn’t say fluid, I said not static. His powers have changed quite often depending upon the writer. Can he fly for example. Depends on when he was being written.

The whole idea of Captain Britain since Moore got hold of him has been to play into the Matter of Britain as a ‘real concept’ so it isn’t a leap to start overlaying Arthurian concepts over Captain Britain.

Arthur himself was subject to this land/king duality. The idea that a barren unmanned or unworthy king creates a wasteland of his kingdom is central to the grail quest, the Fisher King stories the concept of the Dolorous Stroke and Conn of Ireland. In some versions of this idea the very wasteland brings on enchantment, most fully realised in the tabletop RPG Pendragon.

I don’t believe it is a coincidence that Tini has jumped straight into monsters crossing over from the Otherworld. This is a direct nod to this wasteland/enchantment idea and springs from the ‘as above so below’ paradigm that she is trying to subvert. Brian is currently very much like Conn in that he has fallen under the sway of an inappropriate woman and as a direct result a chain of events have led to a weakening of the barriers.

His power set hasn't changed at all. He's the archetypal flying brick hero. Only the source of his powers has changed really. He's also been able to fly since 1977, for like 99% of his publication run he's been able to fly. Can you provide some examples of power changes for him?

How is the ability to create earthquakes out of nothing at all not manipulating the Earth?


It’s “Queen of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, Head of the Commonwealth and Defender of the Faith”, thank you very much.

That's like you blowing on dust and saying you can manipulate the earth, what? No that's just a side effect of your ability to create a gust of wind. Rictor, Avalanche and Quake all have the same ability to create vibrations and send them through objects. Someone who can manipulate the earth would be someone like Magma or Sandman. A person with the power of Geokinses, unlike Rictor who has the power of Seismokinesis.

[JKtheMac]

His power set hasn't changed at all. He's the archetypal flying brick hero. Only the source of his powers has changed really. He's also been able to fly since 1977, for like 99% of his publication run he's been able to fly. Can you provide some examples of power changes for him?

As you have directly dismissed my only example which is categorically true because he has been portrayed as both being able to fly and not being able to then I really don’t have much incentive as you will probably ignore those too.

Even if we were to pretend that Captain Britain has a static power set you have entirely ignored my main thesis too and purely focused on one tiny element of it. This story can and I would strongly assert is making a direct connection between the realm and the powers of Captain Britain, and may be taking this to new places.

As you seem to believe that Chimeras have no place in the Matter of Britain you will forgive me if I prefer to go along with Tini’s clear understanding of the breadth and scope of the source material and not your more narrow one. I enjoy the wide variety of Arthurian romance including that drawn from other material in the wider canon of medieval literature. Surely comics are the perfect place to do this? If we confine ourselves to Mallory or Chrétien de Troyes we wouldn’t even have Captain Britain as we recognise him now.

[Londo Bellian]

Magma & Sandman: direct manipulation of earth/ground/soil
Avalanche, Rictor & Quake: manipulation of physical force (seismic waves in their case) that moves earth/ground/soil in turn

That it?

[Knightmare]

As you have directly dismissed my only example which is categorically true because he has been portrayed as both being able to fly and not being able to then I really don’t have much incentive as you will probably ignore those too.

Even if we were to pretend that Captain Britain has a static power set you have entirely ignored my main thesis too and purely focused on one tiny element of it. This story can and I would strongly assert is making a direct connection between the realm and the powers of Captain Britain, and may be taking this to new places.

As you seem to believe that Chimeras have no place in the Matter of Britain you will forgive me if I prefer to go along with Tini’s clear understanding of the breadth and scope of the source material and not yours.

Sorry I didn't mean to sound dismissive, but between the time Captain Britain was created and he gained the ability to fly only 8 months had passed and he's been able to fly ever since 1977 to 2019. When did his ability to fly get taken away?

I didn't ignore your so called thesis, I just found it to be flawed and asserted my own opinion. At no point has this story linked the powers of Captain Britain to the realm. Tell what you source is for this? I promise I'll check it out and If I'm wrong I'll say so, but I'm not just going to take your word for it. We've both read the same material and have somehow come out with different conclusions, so just site your source.

I haven't read the Matter of Britain and I don't need to. I know what a Chimera is and where it originates from(Greek Mythology), just like the Hydra. I know this because I educated myself to make sure I knew what I was talking about, I just wish you'd do the same instead of taking a stranger(Tini) word that she knows what she's talking about.

Magma & Sandman: direct manipulation of earth/ground/soil
Avalanche, Rictor & Quake: manipulation of physical force (seismic waves in their case) that moves earth/ground/soil in turn

That it?

What else were you expecting?

[CRaymond]

I mean, it seems clear that this Excalibur is collecting mutants as D&D archetypes and Rictor fits the bill for "druid-as-earthbender" but I never really liked that his powers were anything more than seismic vibration. It suggests he operates more comfortably on a macro scale, but can grow into more precision with training. This earth-sense could be manifestation of that macro ability, but actually shaping and controlling stone is, well, boring?

[CGAR]

Magma definitely would fall in line with what Apocalypse needed.

I wish they used her more.

[JB]

This earth-sense could be manifestation of that macro ability, but actually shaping and controlling stone is, well, boring?

I say throw in some mutant magic training from •-[A]-• and then Ric can shape stone into creatures and animate them. Kinda like Bobby's golems.

[CRaymond]

I say throw in some mutant magic training from •-[A]-• and then Ric can shape stone into creatures and animate them. Kinda like Bobby's golems.

Oh sure. I mean, Dani's a Valkyrie so if they want to make Ric a Druid, go off gurlz. It's just not what I would've done with Rictor, or what I would've done with Excalibur.

And iI'm not a big fan of Bobby's more Elsa-like snowy whatever-you-want powers. I'm probably the boring one. Cest la vie.

[yogaflame]

Rictor may have originally been presented as a more 'vibration' based type mutation, but even in his first appearances he was making huge earthquakes not like Avalanche has ever demonstrated, and in his later X-Factor PAD run his visceral connection to the earth was introduced.





He probably hasn't tapped into it the same way someone like Storm or Meggan or even Magma have, but that's another factor. I mean, not even Magneto really ever seems to have that spiritual type resonance with the earth despite being keenly tied into it's electromagnetic core, nor Iceman despite being a true elemental in terms of actually becoming one with his element on the regular, physically. Maybe the guy elementals aren't allowed to be all one with nature, at least they haven't been. I'm interested to see where Tini goes with this; I did a sketch of Rictor as an Aztec priest in tune with the earth and it's spiritual/cultural significance. It's a reasonable angle to explore given his powerset.

aztecrictor copy.jpg

[hulkling]

I say throw in some mutant magic training from •-[A]-• and then Ric can shape stone into creatures and animate them. Kinda like Bobby's golems.

First He needs to create this new mutant magic and set the rules because you know magic always comes with a price.

[Veitha]

Rictor may have originally been presented as a more 'vibration' based type mutation, but even in his first appearances he was making huge earthquakes not like Avalanche has ever demonstrated, and in his later X-Factor PAD run his visceral connection to the earth was introduced.





He probably hasn't tapped into it the same way someone like Storm or Meggan or even Magma have, but that's another factor. I mean, not even Magneto really ever seems to have that spiritual type resonance with the earth despite being keenly tied into it's electromagnetic core, nor Iceman despite being a true elemental in terms of actually becoming one with his element on the regular, physically. Maybe the guy elementals aren't allowed to be all one with nature, at least they haven't been. I'm interested to see where Tini goes with this; I did a sketch of Rictor as an Aztec priest in tune with the earth and it's spiritual/cultural significance. It's a reasonable angle to explore given his powerset.

aztecrictor copy.jpg

Thanks for posting this! I was referring to this a couple comments ago. He's not like Quake or Avalanche and I assume Tini knew about this when she wrote Rictor in this role.

Lovely sketch btw.

[Knightmare]

Rictor may have originally been presented as a more 'vibration' based type mutation, but even in his first appearances he was making huge earthquakes not like Avalanche has ever demonstrated, and in his later X-Factor PAD run his visceral connection to the earth was introduced.





He probably hasn't tapped into it the same way someone like Storm or Meggan or even Magma have, but that's another factor. I mean, not even Magneto really ever seems to have that spiritual type resonance with the earth despite being keenly tied into it's electromagnetic core, nor Iceman despite being a true elemental in terms of actually becoming one with his element on the regular, physically. Maybe the guy elementals aren't allowed to be all one with nature, at least they haven't been. I'm interested to see where Tini goes with this; I did a sketch of Rictor as an Aztec priest in tune with the earth and it's spiritual/cultural significance. It's a reasonable angle to explore given his powerset.

aztecrictor copy.jpg

Yeah everything you posted proves he's still just a vibration mutant. No where has he shown the ability to manipulate earth.

Thanks for posting this! I was referring to this a couple comments ago. He's not like Quake or Avalanche and I assume Tini knew about this when she wrote Rictor in this role.

Lovely sketch btw.

He's exactly like Quake and Avalanche. They may have varying levels of power and control over their abilities, but are fundamentally still all the same.

[yogaflame]

Thanks for posting this! I was referring to this a couple comments ago. He's not like Quake or Avalanche and I assume Tini knew about this when she wrote Rictor in this role.

Lovely sketch btw.

Yeah, Tini is reflecting the more modern take on his powers(which clearly shows he's empathically linked to the earth itself). And thanks, I made if for a jam on this forum years ago.