Earth 1985 - what would you like to see?

[Sodam Yat]

I like this. Also John as the only GL since Hal was retired and Guy was in a coma.

I agree with this 100%

[Dataweaver]

I know an Earth 1985 was shown...but no Earth 1985-2 was shown.

I don't see any mention of Earth 2 being split every time Superman's origin changes.

DDC also mentions an Earth 2 that's a continuation of the Golden Age DCU: it's entirely possible that that Earth is distinct from the Silver Age Earth 2 that Roy Thomas helmed. In particular, Roy Thomas made his Earth 2 something of a “clutter-Earth” of Golden Age heroes from all sorts of different publication companies: the All-Star Squadron is arguably to the actual Golden Age DCU as the JLI is to the pre-Crisis DCU.

And while DDC only explicitly mentioned one Earth forming per reboot, the premise behind the notion is that each era of comics gets archived when the next one comes along. If we go with the spirit of the thing instead of a literalist interpretation, then Earth 1985 is the main Earth of the Infinite Earths version of the Multiverse, which also gets archived along with it. After all, you can't have Earth 1's history preserved without also preserving Flash of Two Worlds and the various Crises on Multiple Earths; and you can't do that without having Multiple Earths.

[dswynne]

DDC also mentions an Earth 2 that's a continuation of the Golden Age DCU: it's entirely possible that that Earth is distinct from the Silver Age Earth 2 that Roy Thomas helmed. In particular, Roy Thomas made his Earth 2 something of a “clutter-Earth” of Golden Age heroes from all sorts of different publication companies: the All-Star Squadron is arguably to the actual Golden Age DCU as the JLI is to the pre-Crisis DCU.

And while DDC only explicitly mentioned one Earth forming per reboot, the premise behind the notion is that each era of comics gets archived when the next one comes along. If we go with the spirit of the thing instead of a literalist interpretation, then Earth 1985 is the main Earth of the Infinite Earths version of the Multiverse, which also gets archived along with it. After all, you can't have Earth 1's history preserved without also preserving Flash of Two Worlds and the various Crises on Multiple Earths; and you can't do that without having Multiple Earths.

Then we're dealing with multiple clusters of Earths with their own multiverse.

Ergo, when the Metaverse is reformatted, all the realities of that Earth is also archived into its own cluster, within an "infinite" Multiverse. In this case, "Earth-1985" is simply a name for one cluster. So, it should be "Earth-1985-1", which is linked "Earth-1985-2" and so on. So, there could still be 52 Earths, plus a bunch of Earths that are archived.

[docmidnite]

I always wanted to see a World/Earth-1 where CoIE never happened but time moved on. Something like this maybe...

- Hal, Barry, and Ray remain retired like they were retired before/during CoIE.

- Wally visits Barry in the future (where Barry stabilizes Wally's powers so they are no longer killing him) and Wally goes back to the present where he takes over the Flash mantle while Barry is retired in the future with Iris.

- John Stewart is the only GL in Sector 2814 while Hal is still retired and Guy is still in his coma.

- Superman marries Lois, and they leave Earth to spend their retirement alone together (leaving Kara Zor-El and Black Lightning as Metropolis' protectors).

- With Superman retired, Firestorm becomes Earth's most powerful superhero.

- Batman eventually gets offed by the Joker, but instead of taking over the mantle, Dick stays as Nightwing and does things his own way.

- Kara Zor-El and Barbara Gordon/Batgirl form a World's Finest pairing in honour of their mentors and protect the world taking on the biggest threats that might come up to Earth.

- Ray Palmer stays in the jungle, retired with the new love of his life, and Professor Stein then takes over as the world's leading expert in Atomic Theory.

- Ollie eventually dies, leaves everything to Roy, and Queen Industries goes into the black ops business under Roy as Arsenal.

- Katar and Shayera retire and go back to Thanagar, and Charlie Parker/Golden Eagle takes over their assignment.

- Arthur retires and takes the throne full-time, and makes Tempest Atlantis' ambassador to the surface world.

- Diana takes over as Queen of Paradise Island and Donna's the number #1 heroine on Earth.

- Changling is still the last survivor of the original Doom Patrol.

- JLDetroit's Steel becomes more like DC's version of The Shield while Vic/Cyborg eventually becomes the smartest man on Earth.

A new type of super team arises (one made up of from the W/P Titans, Outsiders, and JL Detroiters as well as others) led by Nightwing

[Tzigone]

Kara Zor-El and Barbara Gordon/Batgirl form a World's Finest pairing in honour of their mentors and protect the world taking on the biggest threats that might come up to Earth.

I do not regard pre-COIE Batman as a mentor to pre-COIE Batgirl (and I much prefer that to the mentor-version). Also, where do Clark and Lois leave Earth and go to? Why do they even want to leave the planet? Or do you just want them out of the way (Superman not martyred) and don't really care about their motivations?

Changling is still the last survivor of the original Doom Patrol.

I know that was status quo for a while, but Cliff was resurrected well before COIE. Did he die again? I do prefer Changling as only survivor myself, though.

[kcekada]

I would just prefer if they acted like Crisis never happened. The JSA is on a Roy a Thomas inspired Earth 2 with Infinity Inc, and new characters like the new Mr Terrific, and Star Girl. The Levitz inspired Legion is in the future right after the Magic Wars aND Superboy (Clark) was bother a member aND the inspiration. Where Cyborg is a NTT and not a founder of the JLA, which is still in the Satellite Era. Geoff is the editor of all related titles because he is the master of nostalgia and finding and showcasing the iconic versions of characters.

I assumed that was the whole point of 1985. It was Earth 1 before Crisis -- so Earth 2 and the Levitz Legion would also exist -- along with Superboy, Supergirl and all of the existing parallel Earths of that era.

[Mr.B]

It's possible Earth 2 is the same as pre crisis sans Batman dying. While the other Earths get no restorations. Because they lack good Clark. So no retro copies of pre crisis Earth 4, 3, 5, X, S, Prime etc.

The new metaverse multiverse doesn't have to be the same. It's also possible it overrides convergence and convergence is no longer canon in any way.

[Dataweaver]

I've got a slightly different take on it:

Everything happens exactly as before right up through Crisis on Infinite Earths #10, which ends with a struggle between the Spectre and the Anti-Monitor at the Dawn of Time. Including the deaths of Supergirl and the Flash. Everything cases to black…

…but instead of everyone waking up on a shared Earth, everyone wakes up on their own Earths. As well, Supergirl and the Flash are alive again, telling a tale of having been abducted to a world called Telos and being sent back to prevent the Crisis from destroying the Multiverse — and having succeeded. As the Multiverse's heroes are coming to grips with this revelation, the Anti-Monitor attacks Earth 1 as he did at the end of the original Crisis, and the events of the final issue of the Crisis play out more or less the same, but with fewer deaths due to the Flash and Supergirl being there to help, or the heroes just not being where they had been in the original version. (In particular, Earth 2's Robin and Huntress take a bit longer getting into the battle, and aren't with Kole when the shadow demons overwhelm her. Kole dies, but they don't.) The whole thing ends with Earth 2's Superman dealing a knockout punch against the Anti-Monitor and Alex transporting him and Superboy Prime back to Earth 2.

After the Crisis, Harbinger gathers the heroes of the Multiverse and gives a speech about needing to prevent this from every happening again. To that end, she's forming a team with representatives from the various Earths — a Justice League Interdimensional. The initial roster includes Earth 1's Batman, Earth 2's Green Lantern, Earth 3's Alex Luthor, Earth 4's Captain Atom, Earth S's Captain Marvel, Earth X's Uncle Sam, and Earth Prime's Superboy, along with Harbinger, Pariah, and Lady Quark.

Things develop from there. I have some thoughts in that regard; but they'll have to wait a bit, because Real Life is summoning me.

[Kuwagaton]

I know the best case scenario would be a book about everyone, but I really only care about Kal, Kara, Katar, Shayera, and Bruce. And even there I don't mind just getting Superman and the Hawks.

- continuing from Convergence, where CoIE hadn't happened and the Hawks were pretty much still just dealing with their short lived series.

- Superman stays unmarried and has his pre crisis shield, not the one pictured

- Marvel had on several occasions brought in legends to pick up from their legendary runs, but they were completely influenced by the time spent away. I'd like to avoid that and live in the moment. Bates for one is as good as ever.

- if there has to be a big crossover, then all of the heroes lose their powers and must from there team up with the Chicago Bears

[docmidnite]

I do not regard pre-COIE Batman as a mentor to pre-COIE Batgirl (and I much prefer that to the mentor-version). Also, where do Clark and Lois leave Earth and go to? Why do they even want to leave the planet? Or do you just want them out of the way (Superman not martyred) and don't really care about their motivations?.

Umm... relax.. n0 need to get uppity about anything here... Silver Age Supes ended up on many paradise planets throughout his many space adventures back then. I could easily see him and Lois spending the rest of their lives in peace on one of those paradise worlds if they wanted.

[scary harpy]

It's possible Earth 2 is the same as pre crisis sans Batman dying. While the other Earths get no restorations. Because they lack good Clark. So no retro copies of pre crisis Earth 4, 3, 5, X, S, Prime etc.

The new metaverse multiverse doesn't have to be the same. It's also possible it overrides convergence and convergence is no longer canon in any way.

The problem I see is that Earth 3, 4 and 5s/S have very few super-beings. Now if you combines those Earths into one new earth...then they would balance with Earths 1 and 2. Bonus, we wouldn't have a clutter Earth.

[Dataweaver]

The problem I see is that Earth 3, 4 and 5s/S have very few super-beings. Now if you combines those Earths into one new earth...then they would balance with Earths 1 and 2. Bonus, we wouldn't have a clutter Earth.

Another problem with Mr.B's notion is that Earth Prime did have a Superman — well, a Superboy, at least. In my take on the matter, the 1985 version of Earth Prime becomes the world of the Superman: Secret Identity Elseworlds story.

But for all the talk of the Metaverse preserving Superman, the truth is that it's more than that: it's about preserving heroic ages. There may be something to the effect of every world having a Superman analog (sort of like the Supermen of the Multiverse that appeared in Final Crisis), though that hero doesn't necessarily need to resemble Superman all that much: Captain Atom, Captain Marvel, and Uncle Sam from Earths 4, S, and X, for example.

[Mr.B]

The problem I see is that Earth 3, 4 and 5s/S have very few super-beings. Now if you combines those Earths into one new earth...then they would balance with Earths 1 and 2. Bonus, we wouldn't have a clutter Earth.

Still be a clutter earth. Earth 1985 has no clutter Earth characters.

Superboy prime is evil. And Earth prime already and always exist.

[Dataweaver]

The Superboy Prime who went through massive PTSD due to the Crisis and subsequent isolation became evil; under different circumstances, he may well have turned out differently (see Superman: Secret Identity).

[scary harpy]

Still be a clutter earth. Earth 1985 has no clutter Earth characters.

Superboy prime is evil. And Earth prime already and always exist.

We'd have Earth 1, Earth 2 and Earth 345 (for lack of a better name). Less cluttered.