Jean Grey: Phoenix/Marvel Girl Appreciation 2020

[baxer]

Attachment 102692

Since Jean (and Scott) has been featured prominently in the promo artwork for Reign of X. Hopefully this will mean that she will get more page time in the next phase

I'm more worried about the quality of the content. I don't think Jean got a really low panel time, what it lacked was focus on her.

Asrar saying the couples are a tease, doesn't make it exciting

See... At this point there should be a Sinister "unsanctioned" glitch in the Resurrection Protocols where an unexpected Madelyne Pryor comes into being on Krakoa.

That is very probable

[loke13]

Is this the most negative thread on the forum?

It's Jean fans. What do you expect?

[WallStreeter]

For me, Jean Grey's depiction so far is very much sexist. I don't care how Hickman is in private. Moria does not really exist besides being a plot device. All other women he writes well seem to be exactly the same person (Frost, M, and this blonde otherworld lady).

It seems to be a comic book run structured around a boys club.

Saturnyne and Emma he definitely writes as the same person, and deliberately so. When Saturnyne was mind controlling Shogo she said come to Auntie Opal Luna. Previous writers had Emma saying come to Auntie Emma.

Monet was always an arrogant rich girl.

Kwannon/Psylocke and Captain Britain/Betsy got starring roles and neither of them were this kind of woman. Rachel is not portrayed as pathetic. Neither are Polaris or Rogue.

So I too think it is Hickmsn personally doesn’t like Jean.

Genesis is queen of another world. Is a is her right hand woman. These are powerful women he created.

With that said I am not invalidating you feelings shot misogyny ruining one of the most prominent women in comics. Why not take all this energy and write a petition. If you do I will sign it and so can other Jean fans. Go to change.org Petitions are free.

[jwatson]

I'm honestly more worried about Aaron (specifically his use of the Phoenix) than I am about Hickman just yet when it comes to Jean's role here. Didn't Hickman hint early on that the reason she's wearing her dumb Marvel Girl outfit again was because of the "last time she wore it," implying DPS? Then we have the hints that the Phoenix will play a part with whatever's going on with the Phalanx/Dominion stuff, and now she's going into Shi'ar space with Scott. Since Hickman maps everything out I doubt all of this will be a coincidence, but I worry whatever Aaron is doing with the Phoenix will supersede him.

Unless, like I said earlier, Marvel editorial is gonna be pretty lax on it and we can just have Jean in possession of the Phoenix with nothing more than a passive aggressive comment on why (let's assume) Jane Foster can't have it any more.

To me this page says everything. jean.jpg

The marvel girl costume was the last time jean had agency. Perhaps she will change the costume at some point but one thing i remember is Jean liked her costume and maybe she just wasn't done with it. She was ripped into a phoenix costume, xfactor for the longest time she didn't have her telepathy, x-men red is the first time i can remember jean had a new costume not only because she chose it but she was for all intents and purposes whole at the time. Perhaps she is doing exactly what the phoenix alluded to in that page but moving on HER time this time.

[WallStreeter]

Is this the most negative thread on the forum?

Considering how horribly Jean has been portrayed who can blame them? The

[Wiccan]

To me this page says everything. jean.jpg

The marvel girl costume was the last time jean had agency. Perhaps she will change the costume at some point but one thing i remember is Jean liked her costume and maybe she just wasn't done with it. She was ripped into a phoenix costume, xfactor for the longest time she didn't have her telepathy, x-men red is the first time i can remember jean had a new costume not only because she chose it but she was for all intents and purposes whole at the time. Perhaps she is doing exactly what the phoenix alluded to in that page but moving on HER time this time.

Lol. The idea that Jean has had no agency since the Phoenix came into her life is retroactive bullshit.

[jwatson]

Lol. The idea that Jean has had no agency since the Phoenix came into her life is retroactive bullshit.

She did? When did Jean get to stop like in krakoa and decide this is what i want to do. I'm not saying she was a puppet but i am saying jean never got to develope the way she wanted and it was never HER choice to change her marvel girl costume and everytime she has wanted to feel safe or has been going through a huge change she herself has almost always chosen to revert back to her marvel girl costume.

[Daedra]

I think the best course of action is to look at the bright side, If I learned anything about Marvel during the years when Jean was dead and buried is that complaining will not change a thing, they will double down on it and pat themselves on the back all the way. (case in point: the phoenix)

[Rebel Heart]

Stunning commission by Felipe Massafera B28C61EE-179D-43E1-B099-5577093FC881.jpg

[SiegePerilous02]

If there is a lack of agency/regression with Jean as Marvel Girl, I'm wondering if it is deliberately meant to be bad. First scene we see her in is when she's arriving in Krakoa with broccoli girl and we have her and Xavier smiling at each other. But the scene has been commented on as having ominous vibe on Xavier's end. I think he even called her "child" when he communicated with her in HoX #4

Could he be trying to keep Jean under control in some way? It wouldn't be the first time. And it's looking more and more likely that the QC as a whole is a bad idea and things might blow up in Charles and Eric's faces, and now Jean has left her seat. While I think the ultimate resolution will focus more on Scott, Jean ascending back to Phoenix and gaining more positive influence over how Krakoa is run while Xavier and Magneto are left out in the cold would be pretty neat.

Is this the most negative thread on the forum?

It's Jean fans. What do you expect?

I'm a Jean fan, and yes it is lol.

Not all of it unwarranted though, but some of it is definitely doom and gloom over nothing. Or at least nothing solid since a lot of the stuff being set up isn't actually out yet, which is how serialized storytelling works.

[WallStreeter]

Lol. The idea that Jean has had no agency since the Phoenix came into her life is retroactive bullshit.

Completely. With out without the Phoenix she had agency and was a strong voice until Hickman got his hands on her.

[Harpsikord]

I've been avoiding posting here because y'all like to pounce when someone disagrees with the collective but I don't see how Jean was treated badly during XoS at all. She had good power moments and wasn't just a communication device, she had agency, wasn't letting Scott make all the decisions for her, got the really cool To Me, My X-Men moment, actually had some action going on in Destruction and Cable. She wasn't an event focus but she was key in saving the day at the end. It was Jean and Magik that opened the portal to let all the demons from the Peak through.

I REALLY loved the scene with Jean choosing to leave the council. Narratively we know that she's probably going to be co-leading an upcoming team with Scott because of the way it was presented, and her making that decision on her own is INCREDIBLY smart. She was disappointed that the council was the way that they were but she made the decision to leave, Scott didn't make it for her. And as the event presents it her leaving is the correct decision to make. Without Jean and Scott making the decision to do Rainfall, the swordbearers would be dead, Apocalypse would've lost, and Amenthi demons would've overtaken Krakoa and then Earth.

I don't think that just because a woman is in an open relationship or a polyamorous relationship with her husband that she's weak. That's bull. I adore the family moments that we've gotten with Jean, Scott, and Cable and Scott made it very clear during the issue with Summoner that he loves one person and that person is without a doubt Jean. I also think the moments we've gotten with her in X-Force have been great.

This era may not be as good for Jean as the late Ressurxion and Disassembled/Age of X-Man eras are, because she was THE face of the X-Men then, but she has ABSOLUTELY NOT been treated badly whatsoever.

[WallStreeter]

nobody ever ask for a teenage version of Cable!! And it really does not make sense that every X-Men just accepts this random guy who just killed the older version of him as if this was not the character everybody knew and spend time with for many years. wtf? Hickman really only made teenage Cable suddenly even more immature and child-like, so he needs a mom to take care of him.

I think the greatest thing about the former summers family dynamic was that Cable came from the future and was older than his own parents in the past.

Or that they simply don’t bring old Cable back from the dead and send teen Cable on his way. You’re right though Hickman made teen Cabke much more childlike than he originally was. This was not worth the sacrifice off old Cable.

I don’t hate teen Cable, mind you and don’t mind him saying. I just hate the reduction of Jean Grey to a passive voice and to the 60s Marvel Girl. Even 90s plain Jean was way stronger.

Hickman totally ignored the existence of Jeen and X-Men Red.

Honestly the Downfall of Jean Frey was X-Mem Resurrection which completely ignored Morrison’s run establishing Jeanas the prime host of the Phoenix and as of having a special cosmic role.

[Daedra]

I've been avoiding posting here because y'all like to pounce when someone disagrees with the collective but I don't see how Jean was treated badly during XoS at all. She had good power moments and wasn't just a communication device, she had agency, wasn't letting Scott make all the decisions for her, got the really cool To Me, My X-Men moment, actually had some action going on in Destruction and Cable. She wasn't an event focus but she was key in saving the day at the end. It was Jean and Magik that opened the portal to let all the demons from the Peak through.

I REALLY loved the scene with Jean choosing to leave the council. Narratively we know that she's probably going to be co-leading an upcoming team with Scott because of the way it was presented, and her making that decision on her own is INCREDIBLY smart. She was disappointed that the council was the way that they were but she made the decision to leave, Scott didn't make it for her. And as the event presents it her leaving is the correct decision to make. Without Jean and Scott making the decision to do Rainfall, the swordbearers would be dead, Apocalypse would've lost, and Amenthi demons would've overtaken Krakoa and then Earth.

I don't think that just because a woman is in an open relationship or a polyamorous relationship with her husband that she's weak. That's bull. I adore the family moments that we've gotten with Jean, Scott, and Cable and Scott made it very clear during the issue with Summoner that he loves one person and that person is without a doubt Jean. I also think the moments we've gotten with her in X-Force have been great.

This era may not be as good for Jean as the late Ressurxion and Disassembled/Age of X-Man eras are, because she was THE face of the X-Men then, but she has ABSOLUTELY NOT been treated badly whatsoever.

these are all very good points and I do agree with you.

[WallStreeter]

No it's very much not productive either. And VERY repetitive.

If nobody else writes a change.org petition fir this, I will in a few days.