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  1. #1531
    Fantastic Member qwertyuiop1998's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny View Post
    The one part I didn't like about that story was Hal telling Bruce that without him he'd probably still be Parallax. What did Bruce ever contribute to Hal getting rid of Parallax when he was the one who doubted him the most. Bruce was certain that Hal had gone rogue again for the entirety of the GL Rebirth story, even in the end he didn't seem too happy to see Hal back and it wasn't until later on when they made up. I get DC writers always putting Batman on a pedestal and I get the comedic element Johns was going for when the League was going to get a good laugh at Hal in the end for pouring his soul to Batman, but there's no need to rewrite the story just to prop Batman. He's the last guy who needs it. lol

    TBF, Johns alwyas trying to portray Hal and Batman have some respect and both find similarities from each other. On the other hand, Johns relatively didn't spend too much effort on Alan and Hal's relationship.
    But I agree with you about parallax part. Batman really didn't do anything to helping hal rid parallax, Actually, on the contrary, He maybe makes it more difficult......
    "Dangerous Zombie! Transform!! Click And Load! Buggle UP! Danger! Danger! Death The Crisis! Dangerous Zombie!" Kamen Rider Gemn
    (In first he's mysterious and evil and now he's psycho and crazy and insane and evil AND "The Meme Lord"LOL.)

  2. #1532
    Citizen of Metropolis Amacent's Avatar
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    DC really can't help themselves from shoe-horning Batman into a story. At least the art was good.

  3. #1533
    Extraordinary Member Johnny's Avatar
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  4. #1534
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by liwanag View Post
    I'd like this dynamic more if Hal wasn't so often depicted as such an idiot on the show.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius View Post
    Thought the two Hal-centered stories were pretty good. Liked that Carol was the "final" message in Last Will.

    The Batman thing came off Johns throwing a bone to the Batman fans who still have sour grapes over Hal decking Bruce back in Rebirth.
    To be fair, I think it's a common criticism of Johns is that his Batman is kind of weak.
    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny View Post
    Strong GL:TAS vibes...
    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny View Post
    Y'know, I can honestly believe Guy would be the first one to bite it. I hate thinking that way, but I can believe it.

  5. #1535
    Extraordinary Member Johnny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyuiop1998 View Post
    TBF, Johns alwyas trying to portray Hal and Batman have some respect and both find similarities from each other. On the other hand, Johns relatively didn't spend too much effort on Alan and Hal's relationship.
    But I agree with you about parallax part. Batman really didn't do anything to helping hal rid parallax, Actually, on the contrary, He maybe makes it more difficult......
    This part was also annoying: "You made yourself into the man you are. Sometimes I feel like I took a shortcut".

    Him and his parents' fortune that is? Because without it I'm not if sure Bruce would've had the chance to do all that traveling and training. It's like the narrative makes it seem like just because Hal was chosen to wield the most powerful weapon in the universe, he must have somehow been more privileged than Batman just because the latter doesn't have powers and relies on high-tech toys.
    Last edited by Johnny; 06-23-2020 at 05:56 PM.

  6. #1536
    Amazing Member ultrarider7's Avatar
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    I also didn't like Batman being one of the messages, it feels forced when they were just acquaintances at best even if you include their interactions in Johns' run. Should have been Barry or Ollie, you know, Hal's best friends.

  7. #1537
    Fantastic Member MaxStirner_91's Avatar
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    I actually didn't care much for the Johns story at all and his usual depiction of Hal as dumb ("I wish I were as smart as you!"). The GL/GA story on the other hand, I loved. Hal reading Henry David Thoreau. That's beautiful.
    Last edited by MaxStirner_91; 06-23-2020 at 08:45 PM.

  8. #1538
    Obsessed & Compelled Bored at 3:00AM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaxStirner_91 View Post
    I actually didn't care much for the Johns story at all and his usual depiction of Hal as dumb ("I wish I were as smart as you!"). The GL/GA story on the other hand, I loved. Hal reading Henry David Thoreau. That's beautiful.
    I don't think Hal wishing he was as smart as the smartest man in the DCU is depicting Hal as dumb.

  9. #1539
    Extraordinary Member Gaius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaxStirner_91 View Post
    I actually didn't care much for the Johns story at all and his usual depiction of Hal as dumb ("I wish I were as smart as you!"). The GL/GA story on the other hand, I loved. Hal reading Henry David Thoreau. That's beautiful.
    Yeah, felt like something I'd see Morrison write in the current series.

  10. #1540
    Fantastic Member MaxStirner_91's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bored at 3:00AM View Post
    I don't think Hal wishing he was as smart as the smartest man in the DCU is depicting Hal as dumb.
    Bruce may be "smart" in the sense of being a detective but I don't see Bruce as being a very thoughtful person, or at any rate, the most thoughtful person in the DCU. Hal on the other hand has explored entirely different cultures in the vast spaces of the entire universe where he must have met people who were smarter than Bruce so it makes no sense to me that he'd be in thrall of some dude on earth who comes from old money and gets his kicks beating up mentally ill people and putting them in an insane asylum. This is a guy who could use his money to get rid of institutionalized poverty instead. I know it's not fair to exactly compare Batman's universe to ours but the idea of Hal being "privileged" compared to Bruce is such a galaxy brain take it boggles the mind.

    My other complaint is that Johns too often plays up this "all guts no brains" dimension to Hal which really takes away from the more interesting aspects of the character -- that he's actually a pretty thoughtful person. How many heroes in the DCU would take two months off to read Thoreau and re-evaluate their world views? I wish these aspects of Hal were played up more often (and I think to an extent, Morrison's run has done just that -- taking these contradictory aspects to create a more well-rounded character) but the jock-like dumb 80s action hero version of Hal seems to have become the go-to depiction of the character in the hands of lesser writers which is really frustrating for me, haha.

  11. #1541
    Obsessed & Compelled Bored at 3:00AM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaxStirner_91 View Post
    Bruce may be "smart" in the sense of being a detective but I don't see Bruce as being a very thoughtful person, or at any rate, the most thoughtful person in the DCU. Hal on the other hand has explored entirely different cultures in the vast spaces of the entire universe where he must have met people who were smarter than Bruce so it makes no sense to me that he'd be in thrall of some dude on earth who comes from old money and gets his kicks beating up mentally ill people and putting them in an insane asylum. This is a guy who could use his money to get rid of institutionalized poverty instead. I know it's not fair to exactly compare Batman's universe to ours but the idea of Hal being "privileged" compared to Bruce is such a galaxy brain take it boggles the mind.

    My other complaint is that Johns too often plays up this "all guts no brains" dimension to Hal which really takes away from the more interesting aspects of the character -- that he's actually a pretty thoughtful person. How many heroes in the DCU would take two months off to read Thoreau and re-evaluate their world views? I wish these aspects of Hal were played up more often (and I think to an extent, Morrison's run has done just that -- taking these contradictory aspects to create a more well-rounded character) but the jock-like dumb 80s action hero version of Hal seems to have become the go-to depiction of the character in the hands of lesser writers which is really frustrating for me, haha.
    Agreed about Morrison. His depiction is a perfect balance of all the contradictory elements within Hal.

    I thought the animated series also did a good job of balancing Hal's character.

    I don't really want Hal depicted as extraordinarily bright, though. He should be extremely resourceful, cunning and unflappable no matter the situation, but I haven't ever liked seeing him as a big brain type character. Pre-Crisis, a writer had him as the designer of the flightless training module he was in when Abin Sur grabbed him and it never worked for me. I prefer Tom as the brains in terms of tech, Carol as the business savy one and Hal as the guy with the will and balls to be able to pull off anything they throw at him.

  12. #1542
    Fantastic Member MaxStirner_91's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bored at 3:00AM View Post
    Agreed about Morrison. His depiction is a perfect balance of all the contradictory elements within Hal.

    I thought the animated series also did a good job of balancing Hal's character.

    I don't really want Hal depicted as extraordinarily bright, though. He should be extremely resourceful, cunning and unflappable no matter the situation, but I haven't ever liked seeing him as a big brain type character. Pre-Crisis, a writer had him as the designer of the flightless training module he was in when Abin Sur grabbed him and it never worked for me. I prefer Tom as the brains in terms of tech, Carol as the business savy one and Hal as the guy with the will and balls to be able to pull off anything they throw at him.
    Agreed. I don't think he should be big-brained in a Reed Richards or Tony Stark kind of way. Just that he's thoughtful and compassionate but also someone with balls of steel.

  13. #1543
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    I think I can understand Geoff Johns was trying to say as a doubter, Bruce kinda restrain Hal from going wild. But mostly I agree with Johnny.
    Sadly, I expected more from Geoff Johns, who brought back Hal and rebuilt the Hal Jordan most people(including me) love today. All I can say is, maybe Hal has grown after Johns left, but Johns hasn't.
    My favourite one in this anniversary issue is the GL/GA story written by Denny O'Neil.

  14. #1544
    Extraordinary Member Robanker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bored at 3:00AM View Post
    I don't think Hal wishing he was as smart as the smartest man in the DCU is depicting Hal as dumb.
    But he didn't mention Lex Luthor.

    The message to Batman was weird. I honestly thought it'd be Ollie, if only for being the one to really drag Hal back down to ground level and remind him no injustice is too small or abstract for a space cop. But no, it just had to be Bruce, I guess.

  15. #1545
    Fantastic Member qwertyuiop1998's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaxStirner_91 View Post
    Bruce may be "smart" in the sense of being a detective but I don't see Bruce as being a very thoughtful person, or at any rate, the most thoughtful person in the DCU. Hal on the other hand has explored entirely different cultures in the vast spaces of the entire universe where he must have met people who were smarter than Bruce so it makes no sense to me that he'd be in thrall of some dude on earth who comes from old money and gets his kicks beating up mentally ill people and putting them in an insane asylum. This is a guy who could use his money to get rid of institutionalized poverty instead. I know it's not fair to exactly compare Batman's universe to ours but the idea of Hal being "privileged" compared to Bruce is such a galaxy brain take it boggles the mind.

    My other complaint is that Johns too often plays up this "all guts no brains" dimension to Hal which really takes away from the more interesting aspects of the character -- that he's actually a pretty thoughtful person. How many heroes in the DCU would take two months off to read Thoreau and re-evaluate their world views? I wish these aspects of Hal were played up more often (and I think to an extent, Morrison's run has done just that -- taking these contradictory aspects to create a more well-rounded character) but the jock-like dumb 80s action hero version of Hal seems to have become the go-to depiction of the character in the hands of lesser writers which is really frustrating for me, haha.
    Yeah, I see Hal as character that maybe looks like weird or dumb sometimes, But that just because he sees things from a unique point of view due to his experience through the entire universe, He actually is a clever and thoughtful person. Morrison did a good job on writing this imo
    "Dangerous Zombie! Transform!! Click And Load! Buggle UP! Danger! Danger! Death The Crisis! Dangerous Zombie!" Kamen Rider Gemn
    (In first he's mysterious and evil and now he's psycho and crazy and insane and evil AND "The Meme Lord"LOL.)

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