Jason Todd: Robin, Red Hood, Arkham Knight Appreciation 2020

[Sergard]

If an outlaw does die, I highly doubt it'll be one of the dark trinity. I'd say it's either gonna be one of the New 52 Outlaws (probably New 52 Jason) or a miscellaneous ally (Essence, a member of generation: outlaw, etc.).

As for the Winter Soldier thing, I meant that I wish we could have skipped the dark times between UTH and RHATO where Jason was essentially whatever the plot required him to be at that point in time. Bucky, while not exactly in a great spot today, didn't have nearly as many hiccups after his re-brand that Jason did. And with how popular he's become over the last 8 or so years, I really do wish those initial years weren't wasted as much as they were (Plus an additional 6 or so years of stories worth reading woulda been nice too).

My money is on New 52 Outlaws. I don't think that Essence is currently considered a teammate, and the kids aren't involved in the mission. They are all in New York. I'd also be sad if one of them gets killed off so shortly after their introduction. (Well, I'd be generally sad if one of them died. I like them and there is already enough death in the DC universe.)

Of course it would have been nice if all the bad post-crisis stories with Jason wouldn't exist and/or were replaced by good ones. The character was wasted for years.
At least there isn't really anything to mourn about when New52 came around and cleaned stuff up.

After reading some comments about the upcoming Three Jokers story, I'm slowly losing my little bit of optimism I had for the story. This is starting to feel like Morrison's Batman and Robin 2.0. A crappy depiction of Jason in an otherwise popular story that's going to hurt the character for years.

[Zaresh]

I still hold hope, though, until I get to read and be disappointed (or not). I need to believe.

[E.Marie]

I’m getting into Rebirth, and this book is on my radar. Has DC re-inserted Croc into Jason’s origin?

Croc is, or was, more involved with Roy as his sponsor. He felt sympathy during the stage in Roy's life when he was heavily addicted. He knows about Red Hood via Roy and doesn't see him in a bad light. Likewise Jason seems to have a soft spot for him for his efforts in helping Roy recover.

As for Three Jokers, I think the creative team already confirmed that there will be more than one controversy. Over on Reddit there's been comments on how Jason healed wrong because the solicits say he's not with his allies. It's not a title I'm really looking forward to in general.

[Swallowtail]

My money is on New 52 Outlaws. I don't think that Essence is currently considered a teammate, and the kids aren't involved in the mission. They are all in New York. I'd also be sad if one of them gets killed off so shortly after their introduction. (Well, I'd be generally sad if one of them died. I like them and there is already enough death in the DC universe.) .

The smart money has got to be on losing Bizarro though, right? Killing him off has zero impact on the wider universe because he’s not even ‘Bizarro Prime’. He’s a character that needs constant supervision so if the Outlaws are ending And Since Jason is not going to be able to do that anymore he’s either going to have to be teleported into some inaccessible safe haven with the kids or he’s going to die.

Plus it resets Jason to factory settings of sad and angry.

[Korath]

The smart money has got to be on losing Bizarro though, right? Killing him off has zero impact on the wider universe because he’s not even ‘Bizarro Prime’. He’s a character that needs constant supervision so if the Outlaws are ending And Since Jason is not going to be able to do that anymore he’s either going to have to be teleported into some inaccessible safe haven with the kids or he’s going to die.

Plus it resets Jason to factory settings of sad and angry.

I hope they won't do that. They surely will, of course, but I hope they won't. Outlaw Bizarro is such a superior character compared to Bizarro Prime...

[Rise]

I'm still not interested in RHATO, but I do hope Lobdell end his run in high note.

The Three Jokers is the only book I'm excited for.

Croc is, or was, more involved with Roy as his sponsor. He felt sympathy during the stage in Roy's life when he was heavily addicted. He knows about Red Hood via Roy and doesn't see him in a bad light. Likewise Jason seems to have a soft spot for him for his efforts in helping Roy recover.

As for Three Jokers, I think the creative team already confirmed that there will be more than one controversy. Over on Reddit there's been comments on how Jason healed wrong because the solicits say he's not with his allies. It's not a title I'm really looking forward to in general.

Considering his lifestyle, I don't think anyone can excatly say he was "healed right" especially when you compare him to Batgirl who suffered because of the Joker too. Still, there's no point on judging a book that haven't come out yet.

[Restingvoice]

Croc is, or was, more involved with Roy as his sponsor. He felt sympathy during the stage in Roy's life when he was heavily addicted. He knows about Red Hood via Roy and doesn't see him in a bad light. Likewise Jason seems to have a soft spot for him for his efforts in helping Roy recover.

As for Three Jokers, I think the creative team already confirmed that there will be more than one controversy. Over on Reddit there's been comments on how Jason healed wrong because the solicits say he's not with his allies. It's not a title I'm really looking forward to in general.

Is there a significant difference of portrayal between Red Hood Croc and other Croc? Like he's mainly friendly and human in Red Hood, but feral in others? I only remember during Batman Eternal, while he can be hostile, he is friendly and cares more about his sewer society where he protects the downtrodden.

[Sergard]

[...]

As for Three Jokers, I think the creative team already confirmed that there will be more than one controversy. Over on Reddit there's been comments on how Jason healed wrong because the solicits say he's not with his allies. It's not a title I'm really looking forward to in general.

I fear that the confirmed controversies will just make Jason look bad and everyone else look good. I know that it was obvious that Jason would be used as the one who healed wrong but I still had a tiny bit of hope that there would be some nuance to it. I generally have some strong emotions about the phrase that someone "healed wrong", especially when compared to another person who supposedly "healed right". Just the simple fact that there is some kind of comparison going on is mind-boggling. Congratulations, Barbara gets a gold star for "healing right". But that's not a reason to drag Jason through the mud (again). I don't understand why there's this constant need in DC Comics to degrade a character because they want to elevate someone else. Just write a story about how awesome Barbara is. Leave Jason out of it. Simple as that.

[...]
Considering his lifestyle, I don't think anyone can excatly say he was "healed right" especially when you compare him to Batgirl who suffered because of the Joker too. Still, there's no point on judging a book that haven't come out yet.

No one claims that Jason "healed right" (whatever that means) but it would be a disservice to the character to completely ignore his own recovery path and simply reduce it to he "healed wrong". I'm also heavily against the idea of comparing Jason and Barbara. Those are two completely different cases. Just because they are both victims of the Joker doesn't mean they are the same.

I'd like to be optimistic about the book but I simply can't.

[Rise]

You take things way, way too personally. We literally have zero knowledge about what Johns & Fabok are planning for Jason (except thar it turned Fabok into a big fan of Jason because of this book) so what's the point of you expecting the worse? If you already feel like you aren't going to enjoy it, simply don't bother with it since I have seen it before with people who hated the idea of RHATO and decided to read it just to find reasons to get angry about it because they already mind up their minds.

Seeing so much negativity every single time Jason show up in another book is seriously getting tiring and the reason why I started avoiding this thread.

[Sergard]

You take things way, way too personally. We literally have zero knowledge about what Johns & Fabok are planning for Jason (except thar it turned Fabok into a big fan of Jason because of this book) so what's the point of you expecting the worse? If you already feel like you aren't going to enjoy it, simply don't bother with it since I have seen it before with people who hated the idea of RHATO and decided to read it just to find reasons to get angry about it because they already mind up their minds.

Seeing so much negativity every single time Jason show up in another book is seriously getting tiring and the reason why I started avoiding this thread.

I don't see what's too personal about sharing a simple opinion, even if it's a negative one (I'm not denying that), especially since the solicitation for Three Jokers #2 just came out. And all comments I've seen so far are going in the same direction. If you think that I or others are too negative, you are welcome to argue against it (That's something Zaresh does all the time when there's a negative mood in the thread). Or don't. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

I also never stated that I'm going to read the book just to find reasons to get angry. I'm still going to give Three Jokers a fair chance when it's out. But I won't give it an approval in advance. If it's good, I'll say it is good. If I don't like what I see, I'll drop the book.

[Zaresh]

@Serg I'll give you some hope.

To my understanding, Johns loves these redeeming characters that are like Jason. He also like underdogs, I think, which he clearly is. And he was one of the big supporters of Jason under Lobdell in Rebirth, as far as I understand. Keep some hope, my friend. He may make him suffer, but I doubt he will make him look like a joke or the untimate jerkass. I mean, sure, he wrote that issue in TT, and he was probably one who was Ok with the idea of bringing Jason back as an antagonist or supported it. But in these days, I have the feeling his thoughts on the character have changed.

I mean, I may be wrong. But I'm going to wait and read, and be mad if I had to when the times come. I had worse fears for Unkillables and in the end it just was... meh, Jason--wise.

Edit: he he, I guess, yes, I need to fight negatively, probably because I want you guys to be bappy. I makes me happier, when you feel good, or better at least. I usually do that by hugging and logic, but... Now, here, I only can resort to this :/.

[dietrich]

https://www.thethings.com/dc-animate...action-movies/

UTRH possibly the best Batman movie ever made.

[Sergard]

@Serg I'll give you some hope.

[...]

You would be a good protagonist in the Danganronpa game series.

Here's a cute little DC Super Hero Girls fanart with Dick and Jason (or how Jason could look like in that style. He's not part of the series):

Quic

[Sergard]

[Restingvoice]

Is there any follow up after Batman and Damian accused him in Leviathan, whether in Leviathan itself or RHATO? Or just a mention?

He seems pretty relaxed about the whole thing after he shook them off, so my impression is he didn't really take it personally but please tell me if I miss something.