Ororo Munroe: Storm Appreciation 2020

[butterflykyss]

Correct me if I’m misinterpreting what you’ve been trying to say in these posts but I don’t think it’s particularly fair to insinuate that all of people’s qualms with this issue stem from “disrespectful” or “personal problems” with what the outcome was. It’s been said by people on both sides of the fence when it comes to the BP/Storm relationship that while there were some cute moments with Storm doing her thing, the plot was filled holes the size of Wakanda’s Great Mound. Between all the tech between Wakanda and Krakoa, omega level telepaths and cerebro abound, and personal lines of communication either between Ororo and T’challa or the Royal Family and T’challa he “couldn’t be reached” in a matter of of potentially global peril? Shuri, an intellectual genius and renown tech savant with the knowledge of the ancestors bringing a knife to an omega level mutant fight? Shuri doubting Ororo’s motives and loyalty after saving her brother and her nation/people on multiple occasions, many times at the risk of her own life? Ororo not even giving them a single night to hear back from T’challa because of a time imperative that only applied to her stealing the sword and not to sitting on her ass, shooting the **** with Logan and Illyana for another two days while everyone else apparently takes their time to show up? Especially when it would’ve been most beneficial and smart to attempt to preserve the best of relations between the people and governing bodies of Wakanda and Krakoa as allies?

Say what you will about your own opinions but to imply that any contrary sentiment readers have with the issue are just due to them being butt hurt about them not getting their own preference when it comes to Ororo and T’challa’s relationship comes across as dismissive to many of the actual, viable, and valid problems with the story Vita told. I, myself, said that if the story had the same outcome but with a believable and well-written story to guide it I wouldn’t have a problem at all, even though I am partial to the relationship. Like many have said before, this issue works perfectly. If and only if you totally ignore any interactions Ororo has had with T’challa, Shuri, and the people of Wakanda in the last 4 years.



Very much agree with you here. To say that writer’s can hype their work, promote you spending your dollars on it, and happily accept and interact with praise of their work is fine but any negative perspectives or opinions about said work is “harassment” and “bullying” is nonsensical. There’s a difference between attacking/harassing a writer personally out of anger and expressing a dissenting opinion about their work that they were happy enough to promote and discuss publicly. To block anyone who doesn’t blindly love what you’re doing as a creator is childish and vain to me. However it is their right to be that way if they so choose. They shouldn’t be surprised though when people lose respect for them because of it.

Thank you beloved. Sometimes things have to be spell it out so that its plain and clear. As many, many people have said if this mission was so time sensitive respective to her it is not conveyed well in the story based upon the ending where see that only two other participants are there. Tchalla can't get in touch with her here but has been able to communicate with her when he was on the edge of the universe and she on earth. Ororo likely knew tchalla could only grant her the sword so if this was so urgent why not utilize any of the high level teleoaths on the island. Also, logan litereally went to Japan, fought with silver samurai, went to hell fell in a out of lava, was reduced to bone, had to regenerate, fight some more and offer solem something off panel to get his sword. I didnt recall seeing him bludgeon his way through any of his established relationships out of a since of urgency, yet ororo couldn't wait just until the next morning for tchakla to return? it was just not written well.


and let's not forget the reviewers offering said criticism never posted on their wall and from what i understand the reviewerd who gave a negative review was looking forward to the book because vita was writing it. they didn't like his thoughts and blocked him.

[Ororo101]

Yes. You are misinterpreting my posts.

Ok I’m glad, since that would be a pretty hypocritical and unfair generalization. Happy to be wrong.

[butterflykyss]

Its an entire event about swords, that doesn't involve many of the actual swordsmen and women in the X books or any of the already existing legendary swords, to say nothing of how they're going around and taking swords from humans and other cultures rather than relying on mutant powers. Its a mess.

You can both A) dislike the Storm/BP ship, how and why it started, and B) criticize how its ended. They aren't mutually exclusive.

Apologies for the 'Vita's run on Marauders' thing. Its mostly Duggan and Vita just did the one issue for some reason. Its baffling how this whole thing played out, because a couple of simple edits would have gone a long way towards fixing the story. Not having Black Panther show up and not having Storm just get back and sit and wait would have fixed so much. It almost feels like they brought Vita on to deflect from criticism of the handling of Storm.

I don't understand the hate for Coates' story. I don't like the ship of the two, but Coates handled it with much more maturity and weight than I've seen from other writers. Ironically, in Coates' Black Panther AND Captain America runs Krakoa has come across as a much healthier and respectful country than it has in the X books.

Edit: stories like this make me miss the old Stan Lee days where a character could just say "I haven't been able to get in touch with Black Panther!" and a little caption at the bottom would say something like "Black Panther is in trouble! Check out Avengers #X to see what's happening to T'Chala right now!" There's so much going on in the Marvel universe right now that I can't be upset with BP not returning phone calls.

I wrote a lot and I touched on several quite critical issues. I mean it is mostly negative (so I do expect possible block) but if he does sit and reads all I've written he would understand it.

I gave him a direct link to this thread here from page 485 till now. I do hope he will at least check all that feedback... I mean 20+ pages of 80% negative feedback is a huge thing. I touched on how he could let something like this to slip between his fingers, because, well it is not normal. I mean if I had such script placed in front of me, I, as a writer or even editor will simply drag two long red lines and I will say. "No. You either provide me more, as a build-up on what you plan to do at a later date or just sit back and re-read the 4 years of story that has been written from the BP/Avengers office by Coates."

You cannot expect any writer with his saint mind or editor for that matter, to approve such script. There is like a lot of out of character behaviour (on which I touched as well in my PM) and uncharacteristic traits for Storm or Black Panther. This is all kinds of wrong, I mean it SCREAMS RED HOT WRONG.

You cannot expect people to accept such type of writing and if somebody doesn't tell them or show them where to look. Well sorry, this will not work, not only for Marvel but for him, as well, as an Editor.

wow thanks for letting me know beloved. I hope he takes into account your feedback (^_^)

[Grunty]

I wonder if the Sword of Bone for Storm was ever an option on the table or vetoed right away (if even remembered) because it didn't suit her theme wise?

Hence feeling the need to introduce a whole new sword that could do things with lightning (because throwing lightning at things is how most writers seem to handle her)?

[skyvolt2000]

I blame this crap entirely on Coates.
They were married. The marriage was annulled. They both moved on. They were happy.
And Coates could not leave well enough alone. He had to put them back together because he secretly desired to write an X-Book and using Storm in BP was the closest thing to that.
The X-Offices were not under any obligation to acknowledge or follow through on what he was doing. They didn't...not directly. They did what the felt they had to do. And here we are.

People are weeping and wailing and gnashing teeth (crying about the "End of Black Love" and such rubbish) as if T'Challa is the only man Storm has loved and lost...as if Storm is the only woman T'Challa has loved and lost.

I think the issue is this- if you did not read Coates's run and only know they were broken up a LONG time ago.

This story works except for Shuri girl nerd bring a knife to a Mutant fight.
Now if you read Coates and Vita's books-the story is a hot mess.

This is why folks don't trust the use of characters from two different franchises.

As for the end of black love- as of right now the only 3 black couples in comics are Luke Fox's parents in Batman universe and Moon Girl's parents and Hobie Brown. NONE with their own books.

That is why folks are mad.

Folks have not forgotten about Monica and Panther. It's just that Panther with Storm is an attention getter. Now if Monica was built up like Lois Lane or Mary Jane different story.

Now unlike Harley and Catwoman and Lois Lane-it didn't lead to anything like a mini or solo or one shots. Catwoman can lay up on Batman and still be a loner. Harley... is Harley. Storm never got those shots.

I will put it to you like this if Storm had a 12 part mini or ongoing that piggybacked on Black Panther and built up to Vita's issue. Panther in space and Storm at home having adventures and over that 12 issue span-she begins to question the relationship and her loyalty to mutants.

A fully prepared Vita could have given folks closure. Read Vita's Livewire vol 1. Vita gave you a character who made a choice for the greater good and stood by it.

[MoneySpider]

The issue wasn't even a good display of Storm's thievery skills. I like the concept of her pulling off a big heist, but it was executed in a boring way. I wanted to see 'Ro picking locks and crawling through airducts like Catwoman.

Wouldn't crawling through air ducts make her claustrophobic, or has she conquered her claustrophobia?

[MoneySpider]

BP fans aren't upset

I am one Black Panther fan who is upset. I do not like it when the X-Office throws shade on the Storm/Black Panther relationship and does everything they can to destroy it. I didn't appreciate that when they did it in 2012 and I don't appreciate it now.

[MindofShadow]

I blame this crap entirely on Coates.
They were married. The marriage was annulled. They both moved on. They were happy.
And Coates could not leave well enough alone. He had to put them back together because he secretly desired to write an X-Book and using Storm in BP was the closest thing to that.
The X-Offices were not under any obligation to acknowledge or follow through on what he was doing. They didn't...not directly. They did what the felt they had to do. And here we are.

People are weeping and wailing and gnashing teeth (crying about the "End of Black Love" and such rubbish) as if T'Challa is the only man Storm has loved and lost...as if Storm is the only woman T'Challa has loved and lost.

It is 50/50

Coates should have left it alone. But marvel editorial let him do it. So the X office should have went along with it. That is how comic universes are supposed to work.

What does it gain for Storm to lose the connection to the Black Panther mythos? I mean, they weren't holding her back. She was still doing all the Xmen stuff. It isn't like she had to choose one or the other.

X office cut off another avenue for Storm stories because... ?????? for a random issue of a side book that Hickman isn't even writing? For a made up sword?

And they didn't even have the balls to let the main writer do it... nah... bring in the non binary queer black woman (sorry is woman appropriate here? non binary? I don't undestand it all sorry) so they can deflect blame.

I don't like Coates but at least he had Storm and Tchalla act like adults. X office writes them like children, not a king and a goddess.

[jwatson]

I think the issue is this- if you did not read Coates's run and only know they were broken up a LONG time ago.

This story works except for Shuri girl nerd bring a knife to a Mutant fight.
Now if you read Coates and Vita's books-the story is a hot mess.

This is why folks don't trust the use of characters from two different franchises.

As for the end of black love- as of right now the only 3 black couples in comics are Luke Fox's parents in Batman universe and Moon Girl's parents and Hobie Brown. NONE with their own books.

That is why folks are mad.

Folks have not forgotten about Monica and Panther. It's just that Panther with Storm is an attention getter. Now if Monica was built up like Lois Lane or Mary Jane different story.

Now unlike Harley and Catwoman and Lois Lane-it didn't lead to anything like a mini or solo or one shots. Catwoman can lay up on Batman and still be a loner. Harley... is Harley. Storm never got those shots.

I will put it to you like this if Storm had a 12 part mini or ongoing that piggybacked on Black Panther and built up to Vita's issue. Panther in space and Storm at home having adventures and over that 12 issue span-she begins to question the relationship and her loyalty to mutants.

A fully prepared Vita could have given folks closure. Read Vita's Livewire vol 1. Vita gave you a character who made a choice for the greater good and stood by it.

I think a lot of it doesn't work, I'm on the side that loved it but i can see all the plot holes. Vita wrote the Shuri series. Vita wrote it. Storm showed up and helped Shuri and put herself on the lline to help shuri. Vita has mentioned corresponding with Coates in the past so i'm sure Vita has more insight into his goals/plans than most. So it makes no sense to me, i agree, it made zero sense t that Shuri didn't just believe Storm and throughout the whole book i can't lie, in the back of my mind i was like "Well if storm is their goddess and she just saved them why would the people who have enough faith in her that it empowered her have a problem with her borrowing a artifact for a few days, how would they even know." But because i was on the other side and already done after Nakia can borrow my man i was able to just let it go. But i agree and can easily see how this violated a lot of Coates good intent and i think i understand it more because it was Vita and Vita knew exactly what was going on in the BP line because Vita was there. But it was still a good book for me. But i get it.

[Ororo101]

It is 50/50

Coates should have left it alone. But marvel editorial let him do it. So the X office should have went along with it. That is how comic universes are supposed to work.

What does it gain for Storm to lose the connection to the Black Panther mythos? I mean, they weren't holding her back. She was still doing all the Xmen stuff. It isn't like she had to choose one or the other.

X office cut off another avenue for Storm stories because... ?????? for a random issue of a side book that Hickman isn't even writing? For a made up sword?

And they didn't even have the balls to let the main writer do it... nah... bring in the non binary queer black woman (sorry is woman appropriate here? non binary? I don't undestand it all sorry) so they can deflect blame.

I don't like Coates but at least he had Storm and Tchalla act like adults. X office writes them like children, not a king and a goddess.

Gasping for air in this sea of truth man. Thanks for saying all of that.

[jwatson]

A part of me feels like the story for next year is going to set up Wakanda trying to "steal" the mutant goddess and we will find out xavier did in fact know Storm was a goddess and was keeping that as a seed in his back pocket for krakoa and it's needs. I don't know something in this issue just felt like despite all the plot wholes i felt Tchalla and co was trying to make Storm make a choice. That is one thing i will say i did honestly feel as well reading this. If i go at it from the side of well she called, why didn't he answer but he answered his mother. Why did Shuri, Ramonda and even tchalla keep specifically using the same wording with telling her to wait. It feels like they knew this day would come and two of them are super genuises and they were hoping Ororo would wait, which would basically be choosing wakanda as family first and i suspect Ororo felt that and it started to make her upset. So from the perspective of enjoying the story i also saw those moments. And ororo got madder and madder as Shuri, and Ramonda kept telling her to wait because it would ROCK their people and as a mutant if she is one of theirs shouldn't her society be as well since that is what they want her to embrace? Wakanda first. So there was some good in there for those of us who were already done and felt alot of that same frustration Storm felt.

[butterflykyss]

It is 50/50

Coates should have left it alone. But marvel editorial let him do it. So the X office should have went along with it. That is how comic universes are supposed to work.

What does it gain for Storm to lose the connection to the Black Panther mythos? I mean, they weren't holding her back. She was still doing all the Xmen stuff. It isn't like she had to choose one or the other.

X office cut off another avenue for Storm stories because... ?????? for a random issue of a side book that Hickman isn't even writing? For a made up sword?

And they didn't even have the balls to let the main writer do it... nah... bring in the non binary queer black woman (sorry is woman appropriate here? non binary? I don't undestand it all sorry) so they can deflect blame.

I don't like Coates but at least he had Storm and Tchalla act like adults. X office writes them like children, not a king and a goddess.

we all know why they did it but let me present this angle. I was having an exchange with a fellow storm fan and he made the point that this x of swords is about sacrifice, he went on to say that this, severing her ties to wakanda, was the only thing they could take from her, which in part is the fault of the years and years of lack of development. I didnt agree with this obviously but does this theme make the approach taken acceptable for those who had issue with the book.

aside from this I agree with your post, especially your last takeaway with them being children.

[Marvell2100]

A part of me feels like the story for next year is going to set up Wakanda trying to "steal" the mutant goddess and we will find out xavier did in fact know Storm was a goddess and was keeping that as a seed in his back pocket for krakoa and it's needs. I don't know something in this issue just felt like despite all the plot wholes i felt Tchalla and co was trying to make Storm make a choice. That is one thing i will say i did honestly feel as well reading this. If i go at it from the side of well she called, why didn't he answer but he answered his mother. Why did Shuri, Ramonda and even tchalla keep specifically using the same wording with telling her to wait. It feels like they knew this day would come and two of them are super genuises and they were hoping Ororo would wait, which would basically be choosing wakanda as family first and i suspect Ororo felt that and it started to make her upset. So from the perspective of enjoying the story i also saw those moments. And ororo got madder and madder as Shuri, and Ramonda kept telling her to wait because it would ROCK their people and as a mutant if she is one of theirs shouldn't her society be as well since that is what they want her to embrace? Wakanda first. So there was some good in there for those of us who were already done and felt alot of that same frustration Storm felt.

Nooooo!!!!!!

Let this be the last interaction, she can keep the sword! We won't ask for it back, we promise! We don't need the sword! Zuri was just using it to cut salami for making sandwiches!

Wakanda don't need to steal her back, she can stay with the fam in the X-books.

[chief12d]

A part of me feels like the story for next year is going to set up Wakanda trying to "steal" the mutant goddess and we will find out xavier did in fact know Storm was a goddess and was keeping that as a seed in his back pocket for krakoa and it's needs. I don't know something in this issue just felt like despite all the plot wholes i felt Tchalla and co was trying to make Storm make a choice. That is one thing i will say i did honestly feel as well reading this. If i go at it from the side of well she called, why didn't he answer but he answered his mother. Why did Shuri, Ramonda and even tchalla keep specifically using the same wording with telling her to wait. It feels like they knew this day would come and two of them are super genuises and they were hoping Ororo would wait, which would basically be choosing wakanda as family first and i suspect Ororo felt that and it started to make her upset. So from the perspective of enjoying the story i also saw those moments. And ororo got madder and madder as Shuri, and Ramonda kept telling her to wait because it would ROCK their people and as a mutant if she is one of theirs shouldn't her society be as well since that is what they want her to embrace? Wakanda first. So there was some good in there for those of us who were already done and felt alot of that same frustration Storm felt.

T'Challa never asked her to make a choice. He wanted her to not steal the blade and put him in a politically compromising position that would get his people killed and endanger the only family he really has. But considering he just let her go anyway I doubt it was as big a deal as Storm and others made it out to be. The guy's used to revolts lol.

But this all operates under the assumption he had to physically be there to hash out this issue. If he took a regular flight back from wherever he was (with the Avengers, in space, etc.) why didn't he immediately get in touch with Storm en route and just give him her blessing? His mother AND Storm presumably told him everything so why did he only recognize what his mother said unless he simply ignored Storm, which doesn't make sense. The Wakandans wanted to perform the right protocol and if there was better communication between the 3 parties this whole thing could've been avoided.

[butterflykyss]

A part of me feels like the story for next year is going to set up Wakanda trying to "steal" the mutant goddess and we will find out xavier did in fact know Storm was a goddess and was keeping that as a seed in his back pocket for krakoa and it's needs. I don't know something in this issue just felt like despite all the plot wholes i felt Tchalla and co was trying to make Storm make a choice. That is one thing i will say i did honestly feel as well reading this. If i go at it from the side of well she called, why didn't he answer but he answered his mother. Why did Shuri, Ramonda and even tchalla keep specifically using the same wording with telling her to wait. It feels like they knew this day would come and two of them are super genuises and they were hoping Ororo would wait, which would basically be choosing wakanda as family first and i suspect Ororo felt that and it started to make her upset. So from the perspective of enjoying the story i also saw those moments. And ororo got madder and madder as Shuri, and Ramonda kept telling her to wait because it would ROCK their people and as a mutant if she is one of theirs shouldn't her society be as well since that is what they want her to embrace? Wakanda first. So there was some good in there for those of us who were already done and felt alot of that same frustration Storm felt.

vita shared a picture of a picture of storm stuff (comics and toys I think) right before it was announced she was writing children of the atom. storm fans assumed she was going to announce she was working on a solo lol. silly rabbits. what i would imagine storm big plans are is to lead this team of new knock off mutants. from a goddess to a mother hen. yalll girls enjoy: