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  1. #1186
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    I personally don't give a crap about who they cast as the FF. You could pull a Big Hero 6 for all I care. I just want to enjoy the character without having things that cannot easily be read as racist. It's why I'm the only asian person who seems to support the Ancient One's race change because having her be an asian male would just be another proverb-speaking stereotype and having her be an asian female leads her into being a dragon lady. So two stereotypes I hate are gone.

  2. #1187
    The King Fears NO ONE! Triniking1234's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oberon View Post
    Isn't Kang from the 40th century though? Or even the 30th, that is a long time. It doesn't have to be Reed or Sue who are the black ancestors. There are many generations between Reed and Nathaniel Richards, Kang. Also, Kang wears a blue mask or skin, which I imagine will be true in the MCU, so we may not even see Kang's skin color.
    We know Kang is white in the comics because he appears unmasked as Immortus and Rama Tut and during his origin retellings. It depends if MCU pulls a Gamora and he's in full make-up in all his appearances like in EMH and Assemble (unless I missed an unmasking episode).
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  3. #1188
    Spectacular Member Billy Maximoff's Avatar
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    The FF plays a key role in young Scott Summers' life in today's X-Men: Marvels Snapshot for anyone who's interested.
    Last edited by Billy Maximoff; 09-16-2020 at 12:20 PM.

  4. #1189
    Extraordinary Member Crimz's Avatar
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    I hope the FF interact with the newer younger heroes more.
    It's weird and a missed opportunity that there has been so few interactions.
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  5. #1190
    Astonishing Member phantom1592's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crimz View Post
    That film bombed because it was trash. That's the long and short of it. The race change had next to no impact on that, what did have impact was the director trashing his own film days before it released...

    I don't need my heroes to look exactly like comics, so many things change in an adaptation and that can easily be one of them. All that matters is getting spirit and dynamic of the characters right, and for most characters that doesn't include race/ethnicity. The FF are such characters (except Ben who should be Jewish but that doesn't mean he needs to be white too).

    Yeah... it was trash. However most people had made up their minds it would be trash months before the director came out and agreed with people. The race switching was the first step to saying he was dismissing the source material and was a major nail in that coffin. In fact that's what i found laughable about him complaining about studio interferring with 'his vision'. EVERYTHING he talked about before the movie came out... Sue adopted, 'Van Damme' being a computer hacker, Thing with no pants, The movie being darker and edgier... THey all spelled out it was going to suck.

    And it REALLy did....


    Quote Originally Posted by Oberon View Post
    Nah! The meeting between the FF, Reed and Kang would be: "I am your descendent from over 1000 years in the future", he either removes a helmet or does not, they all stare in awe of some sort. He, Kang, does not need to be revealed to be of any race, I'm telling you. Can anyone post a picture of what Kang looks like without a blue mask or hue over his face?

    I'm the grandparent of a multi racial child. She's 14 and beautiful. I know you didn't say it and I'm not trying to scold anyone, but I don't like the term 'race mixing'.

    Even back in the '70s some of the biggest comic fans, FF fans at that, were black men and we could talk quite a while about plots and characters. I really don't think this stuff matters as much as you think. Likewise the movies and other media.

    Works best when you try to be less gratuitous with it. Like the casting of Michael Clarke Duncan as Kingpin in the DD movie. Nothing needed to be said and it was perfect casting to me.
    Likewise with Majors as Kang, I really don't think anyone need 'explain' anything and please let the FF be as they've always intended to be. Isn't that why "we hate" all the other movie representations? PS: yes, even eye color should be correct to me, too. Spidey has brown eyes, looking at your Toby, though in most other ways you were perfect too.
    They could even cut out the whole 'I'm your descendent from the future.' For decades nobody KNEW who Kang's ancestor was and franky all clues pointed to Doom. Between the super armor and 'using his ancestor's time travel tech'... it was always Doom that was biggest contender. So yeah, make it vague, make him myserious, or gloss over it. For a time traveling conquerer with advanced tech out to conquer all of history.... who his ancestor is really shouldn't be the driving force of the character.

    As for Duncan and Kingpin... yeah, that was one case of race-switching that didn't bother me. I remember the director saying that the core of Kingpin was BIG... and Intimidating . That he wanted someone who filled a room and after everyhting that Daredevil and fought and beaten... that Kingpin was the the REAL threat. And that was a solid success. IN fact they did better than Netflix ever did. I never had the feeling that Vincent was truly a PHYSICAL threat to DD.

  6. #1191
    Invincible Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crimz View Post
    I hope the FF interact with the newer younger heroes more.
    It's weird and a missed opportunity that there has been so few interactions.
    Yeah, have Reed and Kamala interacted AT ALL? They have similar powers - Reed should want to study her abilities.
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  7. #1192
    Mighty Member Oberon's Avatar
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    First I have to apologize, I was confused and confused the first two FF movies with the last one, which was rather trash (and I've never seen all of it.

    I also have to apologize because of course I remember that pre Kang/ post Kang we have Rama Tut and Immortus who on panel were white.

    I do like the actor, Majors and think he would have great range to play a Kang.

    I do think that keeping it mysterious, especially if Doom may/will also be appearing soon/in short order to the MCU.

    I trust the direction of the MCU so I 'm sure we'll see the FF we've always wanted and they have done some trolling before with the post credit teasers. This is going to be great, having it develop through/starting with Ant Man 3. Though I do expect some connections possible in the Eternals.

  8. #1193
    Astonishing Member phantom1592's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oberon View Post
    First I have to apologize, I was confused and confused the first two FF movies with the last one, which was rather trash (and I've never seen all of it.

    I do think that keeping it mysterious, especially if Doom may/will also be appearing soon/in short order to the MCU.

    I trust the direction of the MCU so I 'm sure we'll see the FF we've always wanted and they have done some trolling before with the post credit teasers. This is going to be great, having it develop through/starting with Ant Man 3. Though I do expect some connections possible in the Eternals.
    I always liked the first two FF movies too. Doom was pretty bad in them... but the core origin/background/relationship of the family was rock solid. I definitely put them in from time to time to rewatch... but the last one? Never again :P

    I know what I want them to do with Doom... I don't believe they will, but I know what they need to do. They need to go Full circle. Darth Vader was supposedly designed after Dr. Doom.... well now they need to take tips from Vader.

    NEVER EVER Show his face. Keep it in the helmet. No 'pre-mask' Victor hanging around... No Mask getting ripped off for Shock Value... Keep it hidden. Make him the scariest most intimidating character in any room he's in. Find someone with an epicly deep voice to do the lines. They don't have to be the same actor as walking around in the suit. He's powerful. He's confident. Dr. Doom should be all of this. Don't even bother with a big name fancy actor who needs to flash his face in front of the camera.

    Frankly I would do the same with Kang.. but i'm less emotional about Kang. I think Avengers Forever was the only real Kang story that I ever read. I had the Secret Wars toy when I was really young, but knew nothing about him. He's really a non-entity to me. Do whatever they want with him...

  9. #1194
    Extraordinary Member Crimz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    Yeah, have Reed and Kamala interacted AT ALL? They have similar powers - Reed should want to study her abilities.
    There was sentence between each other in Iron Man a while ago, but that's it...
    Kamala and Reed team-up is one of those things that make so much sense I don't know why it hasn't happened. But weirdly she has not interacted with FF in general, not even Ben who usually gets to meet every hero in the MU at some point.

    Same case with Miles, he and Sue should have a team-up too.
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  10. #1195
    Keeper of the Torch Ravin' Ray's Avatar
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    Reed and Kamala haven't met privately one-on-one to my knowledge, but back in Amazing Spider-Man (2018) #10, when the Thieve's Guild stole items from the super community and Reed and Tony set up a retrieval network with technological, mystical (Dr. Strange) and telepathic (Jean Grey) scans, Kamala pointed out that her stolen bag had her phone, and the find-me app in it pinged its location. Cue in Tony facepalming with "This is embarrassing.") The two geniuses who came with an elaborate plan just got shown up, unintentionally, by Ms. Marvel.
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  11. #1196
    Extraordinary Member Crimz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ravin' Ray View Post
    Reed and Kamala haven't met privately one-on-one to my knowledge, but back in Amazing Spider-Man (2018) #10, when the Thieve's Guild stole items from the super community and Reed and Tony set up a retrieval network with technological, mystical (Dr. Strange) and telepathic (Jean Grey) scans, Kamala pointed out that her stolen bag had her phone, and the find-me app in it pinged its location. Cue in Tony facepalming with "This is embarrassing.") The two geniuses who came with an elaborate plan just got shown up, unintentionally, by Ms. Marvel.
    That was it. For some reason I thought it was Spider-Man.
    Anyway that was barely an interaction and the first time they've met, their first meeting should have bee bigger than that.
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  12. #1197
    Mighty Member Oberon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom1592 View Post
    I always liked the first two FF movies too. Doom was pretty bad in them... but the core origin/background/relationship of the family was rock solid. I definitely put them in from time to time to rewatch... but the last one? Never again :P

    I know what I want them to do with Doom... I don't believe they will, but I know what they need to do. They need to go Full circle. Darth Vader was supposedly designed after Dr. Doom.... well now they need to take tips from Vader.

    NEVER EVER Show his face. Keep it in the helmet. No 'pre-mask' Victor hanging around... No Mask getting ripped off for Shock Value... Keep it hidden. Make him the scariest most intimidating character in any room he's in. Find someone with an epicly deep voice to do the lines. They don't have to be the same actor as walking around in the suit. He's powerful. He's confident. Dr. Doom should be all of this. Don't even bother with a big name fancy actor who needs to flash his face in front of the camera.

    Frankly I would do the same with Kang.. but i'm less emotional about Kang. I think Avengers Forever was the only real Kang story that I ever read. I had the Secret Wars toy when I was really young, but knew nothing about him. He's really a non-entity to me. Do whatever they want with him...
    Yes, the first 2, the Tim Story movies get some love from me. There was a connection or chemistry that you could see with the main characters. Not that she would ever reprise the role, but Kerry Washington as Alicia was a great twist on the comic.

    Agree on Julian, I like the actor, but this was not for him. Just not as effective. The allusions to him and Sue having a relationship was unneeded as well.

    I so very much agree with never showing Doom's face, or certainly some years after he is on screen; like a great reveal when no one is expecting.

    (fan favorite idea: I adore the one Byrne cover where Sue is raising his mask from ashes or slag and they all look horrified. Now that would be awesome to recreate that scene)

    anyway. being a little older I'm more familiar with Kang. They should follow those cues you mention; ape Vader, perhaps, but more - keep the "is he/is he not *really* Doom" mystery involved in it. Its MCU... who knows maybe they would put Doom and Reed more in association and with Kang.

  13. #1198
    FF purist/snob CaptCleghorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crimz View Post
    There was sentence between each other in Iron Man a while ago, but that's it...
    Kamala and Reed team-up is one of those things that make so much sense I don't know why it hasn't happened. But weirdly she has not interacted with FF in general, not even Ben who usually gets to meet every hero in the MU at some point.

    Same case with Miles, he and Sue should have a team-up too.
    It seems unlikely that Marvel limits meeting to avoid big combinations, but the FF are pretty much associated with Peter and to a lesser extent, Lunella. I'd certainly like to see a powers matchup between Reed and Kamala, but they seem to have little else in common, but I'm not overly familiar with her. Miles I know almost nothing about but with with the kids freshly back from a five year multiverse recreation mission, they understandably might want to see other kids. Five years with a few kids and your parents seems restrictive socially.

    Future Foundation as an all ages (or even T) book and Marvel Two-In-One as an FF team-up book are a couple of things on my wish list which could bring Kamala and Miles into the FF world.

  14. #1199
    Invincible Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Or indeed, the Champions as a whole. I wonder how Valeria would react to Nadia and Riri?



    FANTASTIC FOUR #27
    • DAN SLOTT (W) • R.B. SILVA (A) • Cover by MARK BROOKS
    • Knullified Variant by Juan Ferreyra
    • Everything is about to come to an end here on Yancy Street. Literally everything. Say goodbye to the Earth, our galaxy and life as we know it, because this entire dimension is destined for destruction. Whose fault is it? And why, with the stakes so high, would they choose this moment to abandon us? Guest-starring the Silver Surfer!
    • 32 PGS./Rated T …$3.99


    Hi there, Dragon Man. I guess they're going to address the whereabouts of the Future Foundation then.
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  15. #1200
    Spectacular Member Billy Maximoff's Avatar
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    I wonder where Sue and Johnny are? I swear if they're are being replaced (even for a while without a darn good excuse) I'm rioting!
    Last edited by Billy Maximoff; 09-17-2020 at 08:50 AM.

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