The Fantastic Four Appreciation 2020

[Crimz]

Does anyone know if Antithesis is canon?

Sure. So, who 's old flame is Daken ? I don't read anything evermore but I thought that was sorta, like hhmmmmm, maybe. More of an effect of Daken's powers?

But I realize that whatever happened in that story/s is what fuels the Johnny is bi meme.

Some fans thought he wasn't straight before the Daken thing. All it did was add fuel to the fire.

[Shadowcat]

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[Oberon]

I never saw the panels. I've not always been able to see FF adventures in other comics; this must have been from a different series. I heard about this, but didn't know the context, and still don't quite get it.

I consider myself bi, but I've been in a marriage and monogamous for years. So I don't think this bothers me other than not realizing it is a thing.
as I've said, I'm a very long time reader, since I was a kid in the '60s. I probably have every issue of the FF main title from at least # 120 up, but many, dozens, from previous publishing. The Johnny Crystal Inhumans story from the '60s remains as a classic of true love that can never be(up to a point).

But not reading every single thing with FF members, I miss the current things sometimes.

So what else can YOU tell me? Does this scene or 'idea' make you feel any particular way about Johnny or Daken?

[CaptCleghorn]

Does anyone know if Antithesis is canon?

I'm leaning towards no. But until it gets referenced in another book, the choices are "no" and "yes, but we'll just let it be".

[CaptCleghorn]

I never saw the panels. I've not always been able to see FF adventures in other comics; this must have been from a different series. I heard about this, but didn't know the context, and still don't quite get it.

I consider myself bi, but I've been in a marriage and monogamous for years. So I don't think this bothers me other than not realizing it is a thing.
as I've said, I'm a very long time reader, since I was a kid in the '60s. I probably have every issue of the FF main title from at least # 120 up, but many, dozens, from previous publishing. The Johnny Crystal Inhumans story from the '60s remains as a classic of true love that can never be(up to a point).

But not reading every single thing with FF members, I miss the current things sometimes.

So what else can YOU tell me? Does this scene or 'idea' make you feel any particular way about Johnny or Daken?

I don't know anything about Daken. Johnny, OTOH, I do. Johnny not being a strict 0 on the Kinsey scale makes sense to me. How much he desires men is unknown, but he seems to be favoring women over men. Johnny's male/female relationships have been more defined and successful than Bobby Drake's so unlike Bobby, there are straight desires in Johnny. But Johnny was a character in the early sixties when everyone was white, straight, and mostly male. I think bisexuality would be a nice touch and isn't anything that breaks canon.

[cable guy]

Finally read FF#13. Thing vs Hulk. Pretty good stuff.

[CaptCleghorn]

Given that the appeal of Antithesis is the presence of Neal Adams, what would be the appeal of variant covers by other artists?

[Snoop Dogg]

Given that the appeal of Antithesis is the presence of Neal Adams, what would be the appeal of variant covers by other artists?

Because Daniel Acuna is a legend.

[Oberon]

I don't know anything about Daken. Johnny, OTOH, I do. Johnny not being a strict 0 on the Kinsey scale makes sense to me. How much he desires men is unknown, but he seems to be favoring women over men. Johnny's male/female relationships have been more defined and successful than Bobby Drake's so unlike Bobby, there are straight desires in Johnny. But Johnny was a character in the early sixties when everyone was white, straight, and mostly male. I think bisexuality would be a nice touch and isn't anything that breaks canon.

Of course I would not be totally unhappy but I just see him preferring women, to the point of marrying one and almost marrying others.

I see he has had close male friendships that mostly seem straight - Peter Parker, Wyatt, that kind of thing.

Of course some men or women don't realize immediately at puberty or young adult hood that they may be 'bi'. Society has a lot to do with projecting correct behaviors and repressing the incorrect. Obviously all that may change over decades, or even longer periods of time. Acceptance or vilification. So yeah, it adds a nice touch, I guess I would prefer seeing the story of someone who always knew, or realizes as we are reading that story. The Daken stuff is how old? Out of the FF's 60 years almost. Maybe 15? I don't even know.

On the other hand, I would be a hypocrite if I didn't acknowledge my own favorite idea, that some of the comic book character arcs or similar to how Soap Operas handle characters and their development. The mostly rotating 3 cycles: Victim, victimizer and redemptionist. It works different in comic books. Sue in a subtle way is the best example of someone who has been fluid with all those roles. Some characters may never change or only rarely and not between all three.

But I see characters who discover sexual or behavioral things about themselves as part of that fluidity because sometimes, those archetypal roles are involved.

[Billy Maximoff]

https://13thdimension.com/first-look...-antithesis-1/

It says it's a new story from a classic era, does that mean it's canon?

[Mike]

https://13thdimension.com/first-look...-antithesis-1/

I'm a big fan of Adams, but I just can't bring myself to buy/read anything by Waid.

[Crimz]

A review of Antithesis:

https://aiptcomics.com/2020/08/25/fa...esis-1-review/

[Crimz]

Are the FF really a "nuclear" family? I don't think that ever fit them and was like putting a square peg in a round hole. They are more the definition of a found family if anything.

[CaptCleghorn]

Are the FF really a "nuclear" family? I don't think that ever fit them and was like putting a square peg in a round hole. They are more the definition of a found family if anything.

I think the group being referred to is very important here. The Richards family (Reed, Sue, Franklin, Val, Johnny) are nuclear. The FF, with the addition of the Future Foundation kids, is becoming an unusual assortment of additions.

[Digifiend]

Yeah, the Fantastic Four is a nuclear family. Mom, Dad, two kids, an uncle, a family friend the kids call uncle, and that friend's wife.

The Future Foundation are a found family though, with all the other kids added (a lot of whom are wards of Sue and Reed) as well as Spider-Man and Dragon Man. If the theory that the Grimms adopt the Kree and Skrull kids is correct, then that's also a found family.