The Fantastic Four Appreciation 2020

[Crimz]

I think the group being referred to is very important here. The Richards family (Reed, Sue, Franklin, Val, Johnny) are nuclear. The FF, with the addition of the Future Foundation kids, is becoming an unusual assortment of additions.

I'm talking about the main four. Who people usually think of when they say the Fantastic Four. Frank and Val usually come up after that initial thought. Also, I don't think even Johnny fits into the nuclear family if you only go by the Richards. Uncles, Aunts, and the like are often not included in the description. Having to remove Ben or Johnny to fit the description tells me that the FF aren't a nuclear family, they just aren't complete without them.

Yeah, the Fantastic Four is a nuclear family. Mom, Dad, two kids, an uncle, a family friend the kids call uncle, and that friend's wife.

The Future Foundation are a found family though, with all the other kids added (a lot of whom are wards of Sue and Reed) as well as Spider-Man and Dragon Man. If the theory that the Grimms adopt the Kree and Skrull kids is correct, then that's also a found family.

I think nuclear only applies if you look at Reed and Sue with their kids. I'm talking strictly about the main 4 from the beginning they weren't a tradition nuclear family in my opinion. It's something that has been ascribed to them later on to make them seem more dated than they are.

[CaptCleghorn]

I think nuclear only applies if you look at Reed and Sue with their kids. I'm talking strictly about the main 4 from the beginning they weren't a tradition nuclear family in my opinion. It's something that has been ascribed to them later on to make them seem more dated than they are.

The FF certainly didn't start out as a family. The characters were totally copies of Sea Devils and Rip Hunter's crew. A scientist, his GF, his brawny buddy, and the GF's little brother. Cave Carson had the same four, but the GF and kid weren't related. The FF came about taking a formulaic grouping of characters and in addition to incredible adventures, gave them real emotions (for early Silver Age anyway). You know the rest. Reed marries Sue and they have a child. I don't think the FF had any sort of nuclear family tone until Franklin, but they've been a family for over 50 years. They are family now, even if they didn't start out that way.

[Crimz]

The FF certainly didn't start out as a family. The characters were totally copies of Sea Devils and Rip Hunter's crew. A scientist, his GF, his brawny buddy, and the GF's little brother. Cave Carson had the same four, but the GF and kid weren't related. The FF came about taking a formulaic grouping of characters and in addition to incredible adventures, gave them real emotions (for early Silver Age anyway). You know the rest. Reed marries Sue and they have a child. I don't think the FF had any sort of nuclear family tone until Franklin, but they've been a family for over 50 years. They are family now, even if they didn't start out that way.

I think they did start out as a family though, just a really unconventional one and that's what I'm getting at. That the FF aren't a conventional family like many try to say they are.

[Crimz]

Antithesis bored me. It felt like another FF story trapped by nostalgia and I wasn't a fan of the art tbh.

[Crimz]

[danielsan52]

Antithesis bored me. It felt like another FF story trapped by nostalgia and I wasn't a fan of the art tbh.

I usually do not comment on art or writing. but I think it should be an established rule at Marvel that Ben's teeth are not huge and are rarely seen.

[CaptCleghorn]

I usually do not comment on art or writing. but I think it should be an established rule at Marvel that Ben's teeth are not huge and are rarely seen.

Neal Adams on Fantastic Four. Neal became famous in the comics community for a hyper realistic style. His work boosted the price of a back issue and he was quite popular. The sentence "If superheroes existed, they would look like how Neal draws them" was said. Now the FF has been fitted with a Joe Sinnott inking style and a far more traditional comic book look. It's like the opposite of a Manga style of art.

[Iron Maiden]

The FF certainly didn't start out as a family. The characters were totally copies of Sea Devils and Rip Hunter's crew. A scientist, his GF, his brawny buddy, and the GF's little brother. Cave Carson had the same four, but the GF and kid weren't related. The FF came about taking a formulaic grouping of characters and in addition to incredible adventures, gave them real emotions (for early Silver Age anyway). You know the rest. Reed marries Sue and they have a child. I don't think the FF had any sort of nuclear family tone until Franklin, but they've been a family for over 50 years. They are family now, even if they didn't start out that way.

I always thought the template for the FF was more like another Kirby work, Challengers of the Unknown? At least a lot of sources I've read over the years have advocated this.

[Digifiend]

Yeah, it was. In fact, the Challengers were who the FF were merged with in Amalgam Comics.

[CaptCleghorn]

I always thought the template for the FF was more like another Kirby work, Challengers of the Unknown? At least a lot of sources I've read over the years have advocated this.

And therein lies a conflicting opinion I have about three existing DC franchises and their amazing similarities to the FF's cast. It's amazing how anybody can seriously ignore the exact cast of characters in two other series and a very similar cast in the third. Where the Challengers have the advantage in being the "inspiration" was the variety of adventures. The three I mention were all underseas, underground, or through time. Those were also three types of stories included in the FF's first five issues. But regardless of "inspiration", the cast similarities are indisputable fact. And that was my point. No one thought of any of those three DC teams as family and the FF at the time was identical until Reed and Sue were engaged in Annual 2. That was the point where the family aspect started in my opinion.

[markhyperion]

I liked Antithesis. Nostalgia done right in my opinion. Just a fun story so far. Maybe we just have a bunch of limited series and not a main ongoing.

Seems to get the characters right so far. Art isn't perfect but I liked it.

[Marvel Forever]

I vote for a closer match with DC's Sea Devils. Dane was the leader, like Reed. Biff was the strongest like Ben. Nicky and Judy were brother and sister, aka Johnny and Sue. Also, Judy was Dane's girlfriend, just like Sue and Reed.

[K7P5V]

I liked Antithesis. Nostalgia done right in my opinion. Just a fun story so far. Maybe we just have a bunch of limited series and not a main ongoing.

Seems to get the characters right so far. Art isn't perfect but I liked it.

I also liked the art. IMHO, Neal Adams' version of Annihilus looked rather imposing...

[Reviresco]

That is an impressive Annihilus, but the art was uneven. Great panels, and then some not so great panels. Not sure what the deal was.

I usually do not comment on art or writing. but I think it should be an established rule at Marvel that Ben's teeth are not huge and are rarely seen.

Co-signed 200%!

[Will Evans]

What’s everyone’s opinion on Sky?

I know Johnny’s girlfriends are a dime a dozen. But what’s your opinion on the current one?