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  1. #946
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Inquisitor View Post
    They've taken up Magneto's goal to take over the Earth, and not wait while humanity dies out. They're using "peaceful methods" (which include green lighting Sabre tooth to steal tech from Reed Richards and Tony Stark and having their own CIA) who are subverting human governments with money and influence, Magneto was very up front that they're doing it to control humanity with their own methods. Through this they get to be the driver's over humanity future. Sure they want power, they own Otherworld now and Xavier knows is ok with it - read Excalibur. They want complete control over mutants over the world, and make a priority for having Omega's for a coming race war with humanity. The X-men have embraced Magneto's beliefs, just not his tactics. Magneto openly admits that mutants are the new gods of Earth and the X-men smile in the background while he does it. Magneto won.
    #MagnetoWasRight

    Not to stray away from the thread too much, but I think what makes Magneto a compelling villain/anti-hero is that his philosophy makes sense, only his (old/classic) method didn't. But yeah, just because the X-Men aren't twirling proverbial mustaches (or attacking New York City), doesn't mean they're not buying into or supporting mutant supremacy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Inquisitor View Post
    The reason I'm a fan of Scott Summers is that he's a leader who will do the right thing, no matter the cost. He's very smart at coming up with plans and thinks ten times ahead of his enemies to win. He's a man who will stand up for equality between the races because that's the ethical thing to do. Over the years he's become more cynical and sided more with Magneto's thinking than Xavier's (as in past Xavier, not the current Xavier who may as well be a plant person switched by Moira), this direction was intriguing. Scott joining magneto? Being a terrorist rather than the teacher's pet? Lots of interesting stories to cover with that. Only this made him weak, his principles became compromised and he gave into hate and Magneto's mutant supremacist philosophy changed Cyclops just like it did with Xavier (Onslaught).
    To me, Cyke's change (as well as Utopia) made sense in the context of decimation. I might be recalling incorrectly, but I remember a panel from back during the San Fran / pre-Utopia days where Cyke mentions to Emma how their new method was only temporary, or something along those lines. Think it was in Dark X-Men: The Confession. Krakoa, on the other hand, is built on mutant supremacy--- the notion that humans will always be jerks, while mutants are not only powerful but will also replace humanity, so might as well put the jerks in a corner while mutants rule the world. The last is hyperbole, of course.

    But back to my point, instead of "doing the right thing no matter the cost", it became "the mutant species must survive at all costs", which was why the setup for AvX was juicy to me. Up until that point, Cyke maintained that he was protecting _all_ of Earth, but Gillen's run showed, during Unit's introduction, that if Hope was in trouble, Cyke would abandon everything to secure her.
    Last edited by xiyon; 06-01-2020 at 08:02 AM.
    Let your wallet talk.

    Never forget, Cyke fans~ https://twitter.com/i/status/1246248602768486402

    When will Logan call out Jean for drafting children in her X-Squad?

    You'd think the WatXM staff are clear hypocrites for supporting The Crucible~

    "It's only wrong when Cyclops does it."

    Hickman is building towards AvX 2.0 but, this time, the X-Men are actually the villains~

    Hilariously, the X-Men have now fully embraced Magneto's philosophy of mutant supremacy XD

  2. #947
    Out Fighting for Peace! AJpyro's Avatar
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    ...Really starting to re-evaluate Bendis Uncanny.
    Le Suck it, Dolphin!

    -God I am so tired.

    SCOTT SUMMERS AND EMMA FROST DESERVED BETTER.

  3. #948
    Astonishing Member Glio's Avatar
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    A true hero


  4. #949
    Mugga, please. xhx23x's Avatar
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    I have my complaints about Bendis's X-Men, but I really did like all of this stuff with cops and authority he put on the books.

  5. #950
    Astonishing Member Glio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xhx23x View Post
    I have my complaints about Bendis's X-Men, but I really did like all of this stuff with cops and authority he put on the books.
    It is a pity that later he was lost in plots like that of Charles Xavier's will or Battle of the Atom because the foundation was very good.

  6. #951
    Astonishing Member Veitha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glio View Post
    It is a pity that later he was lost in plots like that of Charles Xavier's will or Battle of the Atom because the foundation was very good.
    My same feels. I would have rather seen Scott and co. going around the world freeing mutants and such.

  7. #952
    Mugga, please. xhx23x's Avatar
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    It's one of the frustrating things about. He laids out a solid base and then gets... bored with it? uninspired?

    Cyclops felt so lost in the back end of that run

  8. #953
    Ultimate Member Havok83's Avatar
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    Its my understanding that Secret Wars was a contributer. There was trouble planning it and it got delayed multiple times. Bendis ended up stretching the will story longer thanoriginally planned as a result and then was given a finite number of issues to end the run at #600, which is why the end was a collection of one shots, when they could have been arcs in and of themselves. Those final issues were pretty good (especially the one featuring the X-kids) but the Malloy story which went on forever killed the momentum the book at going

  9. #954
    Astonishing Member Glio's Avatar
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    Another aspect of that era is that he made the rest of the X-Men comically evil with Scott. Like when he loses control of his powers because of Dark Beast and is yelling "IT'S NOT ME, I CAN'T CONTROL IT, IT'S NOT ME" and Storm accuses him of destroying the school on purpose.

    My headcanon is that there was a gas leak at the Jean Gray School and everyone went stupid.

  10. #955
    Ultimate Member Gray Lensman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glio View Post
    It is a pity that later he was lost in plots like that of Charles Xavier's will or Battle of the Atom because the foundation was very good.
    Even Battle of the Atom started out incredibly strong. That first issue was one of the best openers for a crossover - or actually just ANY story - that I had seen in YEARS. That such a strong issue was the beginning of a crossover (whose stories are typically weaker, IMO - due to rampant plot-shoehorning) made it stand out even more. And made the lackluster ending stand out more too, sadly.
    "Theory: The Phoenix doesn't corrupt the characters, it corrupts the authors." Gambit, King of Thieves

  11. #956
    Ultimate Member Havok83's Avatar
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    BoTA was a crossover that did not need as many issues as it did. I think it would have been better had it been self contained in Bendis' two books

  12. #957
    Ultimate Member Gray Lensman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    BoTA was a crossover that did not need as many issues as it did. I think it would have been better had it been self contained in Bendis' two books
    It concerned Wolverine's side of things enough that Aaron's book probably needed to be represented, but they could have cut out the other X-title centered in the Jean Grey School easily enough. Or just had those two only take up one issue each instead of two.

    Of larger concern for me is how the antagonists of that series just flamed out so badly. Xavier Jr had the potential to be a great villain for Cyclops - the actual son of Xavier, who has nothing but contempt for his father's dream, vs the adoptive son, who is trying to keep the dream alive, a villain born of what Scott probably considers his greatest mistake (his guilt over killing Charles while possessed is a constant theme in Bendis' run).

    Plus the Grimdark future version of Jean - again, Scott facing off against someone who is effectively born from someone he truly loved, and someone who he felt he betrayed, when this version has basically betrayed herself. Even though Evil!Jean would have been more of a foe to Jeen, she still would have had a secondary interaction with Scott.

    They had so much thematic potential, all of it wasted.
    Last edited by Gray Lensman; 06-01-2020 at 01:43 PM.
    "Theory: The Phoenix doesn't corrupt the characters, it corrupts the authors." Gambit, King of Thieves

  13. #958
    Ultimate Member Havok83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gray Lensman View Post
    It concerned Wolverine's side of things enough that Aaron's book probably needed to be represented, but they could have cut out the other X-title centered in the Jean Grey School easily enough. Or just had those two only take up one issue each instead of two.
    Bendis could have written those characters just as he was already doing in his books. Rememeber that All New X-men took place at the Jean Grey School and Wolverine's cast was already appearing regular in that book. WaTX as a title did not need to be involved

  14. #959

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    It kinda felt like Bendis was going for two different stories - revolutionary Cyclops and Cyclops having a mental breakdown, but he showed too little of him appearing mentally unstable I'm the first half of the story in order for me to believe it in the second part. The characters who saw him as mentally unstable early on were basing it on mostly him doing things that actually made sense?

    But what I love about Bendis' run is having Cyke being a part of a team with Emma, Ilyana and Magneto instead of having him on a team with do-gooders.

  15. #960
    Astonishing Member Glio's Avatar
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    There was certainly an abrupt leap. Eva Bell accuses Cyclops of fucking it for ... Trying to use the Eye of Agamotto to help the almighty mutant? How is that something morally repressible? Everyone else was trying to euthanize that mutant and Scott wanted to help him control his powers. It was a very contradictory message.

    In that story Scott was guilty of being killed by SHIELD. Like ... wow.

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