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  1. #1096
    Spectacular Member Waking Replica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Journey View Post
    I'm just surprised everyone was able to get dressed that stunning in under 5 minute's! Exception being Tommy whom you'd think would be the most equipped to get wedding ready in under 5 minutes! But hey at least he tried!
    Tbh I'm now forming a headcanon where everyone had an outfit prepared already because they knew it was coming one of these days; like Kate gets the call and is like "figured you guys were gonna pull something like this, lemme go get the dress I picked out and I'll call America to come pick me up!"

    Also, side note, since they did include Noh here, I'm fully expecting Teddy and Billy to show up in GOTG, since one of the future issues has Noh as an ambassador to the Alliance
    Last edited by Waking Replica; 08-06-2020 at 12:40 PM.

  2. #1097
    Astonishing Member Beetle's Avatar
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    Billy probably dressed them himself

    Which would explain Tommy's outfit


  3. #1098
    Invincible Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waking Replica View Post
    Yay at Al acknowledging the Kaplans! A small win for us! Plus Teddy thanking Allan is like, on both a story and meta-level, really sweet!

    But holy shit is the timeline of Teddy's departure so messy sdkjfkd like, there was time for declarations of love, sex, rooftop cuddling, a Vegas wedding, and some couch cuddling to top it all off, not to mention the joint teleport to the Alliance ship?!

    I feel like Tini and Anthony/Chip got two different drafts/note sets of the story. They must've been still working out the kinks around the time of Incoming (plus there's the fact that it teased Outlawed, and well... we know how that's going now) or something of the sort. Or maybe like Tom said, they kept the marriage under wraps, but even from the writers, which is how we have such a wild timeline of events.

    Still, I'm so glad that it looks like we're about to get badass Billy to the rescue! Love to see it!
    The timeline is a mess. Based on Incoming, Teddy left for space before Outlawed started. And indeed, the Fantastic Four don't seem to be affected by Outlawed yet (I suspect the arc starting in October will be though). But you'd think, starting three months before Empyre, that Iron Man 2020 would come first. But it turns out that needs to be after Outlawed starts, because Ironheart's 2020 tie-in was also an Outlawed story. And because of that, it has to be after Empyre as well... which doesn't make sense as Iron Man 2020 specifically starts on January 1st, and Empyre is definitely several months later, according to Empyre #1, which is set the same amount of time after Incoming as it was published. The three events seem to be not keeping time linear.
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  4. #1099
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dante Milton View Post
    I think the dramatic moment of the wedding/reception will be Loki showing up and everyone expecting him to start shit, cuz trickster god, but he really is just there to support Billy and Teddy.

    As for X-characters, a lot of the NXM kids showed up at the end of Gillen's run, so I wouldn't mind seeing a couple of them. I can picture Anole openly sobbing. And I kind of do want Magneto to make an appearance despite the retcon.

    I also wouldn't mind seeing some of the Runaways, at least Nico and Karolina (Xavin would also be nice, but I'm sure that's not happening).

    I'm perfectly fine with Death's Head being ignored for the rest of time, and don't particularly care about Jonas.
    I think the Kaplan's will be there, but Wanda and Vision probably won't be there.

    Really, Death's Head is more likely to be at the wedding than Vision. Mind you, Death's Head and his mother Pyra showing up would be fun, though. Especially if Pyra met Loki.

  5. #1100
    Spectacular Member Waking Replica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    The timeline is a mess. Based on Incoming, Teddy left for space before Outlawed started. And indeed, the Fantastic Four don't seem to be affected by Outlawed yet (I suspect the arc starting in October will be though). But you'd think, starting three months before Empyre, that Iron Man 2020 would come first. But it turns out that needs to be after Outlawed starts, because Ironheart's 2020 tie-in was also an Outlawed story. And because of that, it has to be after Empyre as well... which doesn't make sense as Iron Man 2020 specifically starts on January 1st, and Empyre is definitely several months later, according to Empyre #1, which is set the same amount of time after Incoming as it was published. The three events seem to be not keeping time linear.
    Tbh, while I don't read much of them, I do feel sorry for the Champions (despite my previous weariness of YA playing second fiddle to them had everything gone as planned).

    Now that I think about it, this would've been a big spring/summer for the younger generation of heroes story-wise. Empyre for Billy and Teddy, and Outlawed for a lot of others (it might have also been another place we got to see Tommy come out of limbo) including some more team tie in books.

  6. #1101
    Mighty Member Journey's Avatar
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    Y'all this is Ewing writing this shit Wanda and Vision we'll definitely be there, Viv too probably. The only questions are whether or not Billy's nameless bothers will be there, and whether or not we'll get a royal coronation aswell both my boys need crowns now.

  7. #1102
    Fantastic Member Storm17's Avatar
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    The way Wiccy said he couldn't find my space king made... I NEED ANSWERS NOW!

    The cutest scenes in a comic book like ever have happened in this event.

    Billy/Teddy relationship... GIVE IT TO ME NOW, I WANT IT

  8. #1103
    Astonishing Member Drops Of Venus's Avatar
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    THIS THREAD IS SO ACTIVE NOW, OMG. Is this what it feels like to be FED? Thank heavens. Can you imagine if we actually get a new YA book?

    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    I can't see Vision approving of that, for the same reason he didn't rebuild Vin Vision, Viv's twin brother.
    I'm not sure Vision is in charge of anything when it comes to Jonas. We just... don't know what the hell happened to Jonas. It's basically a plot hole now that any writer can fill in at any time.

    Quote Originally Posted by Will Evans View Post
    No offense but we’re way past Jonas now.

    We’ve had the original Vision back, Virginia, Vin, Viv and Viv 2.0.

    Jonas ain’t returning.


    Just keep him as the token-staying-dead member of team, so writers aren’t in a rush to kill off other members
    If you brought him back so he could be Vision again, yeah, he would feel redundant. But that's the thing: they don't need to do that. We know the Young Avengers at one point had a backup of him, but we don't know what happened to it. There are many ways they could use his backup to basically turn Jonas into a very different kind of character. He doesn't need to be Vision 2.0 anymore. He could come back as something new. That could actually make for an interesting arc in a YA relaunch; they have his backup, but not his original body. So what do they do with it now? I personally like the idea of him being turned into a holographic A.I. that doesn't really have a physical body unless he takes over an electronic device. Like a techno-ghost. That would make him different enough from the Visions, and it would make for some interesting dynamic with Cassie.... could she still be in love with him if he was even less of a man than he was before? Y'all need to be more creative. There are so many good things they could do with Jonas.

    Quote Originally Posted by Journey View Post
    Does anyone honestly care about Jonas?
    I do. I think a lot of people take him for granted because we have Viv now, but Jonas walked so Viv could run, really. He was the original Vision teen legacy, but he was too similar to the original Vision, so he had to go when Viz came back, and Marvel eventually decided that they STILL wanted a teen Vision legacy because they knew it worked, so we got Viv. But Jonas deserves a second chance to at least be reinvented as a character.

    Also, I think it's not so much a matter of caring about the character, but just addressing the elephant in the room. The Young Avengers only didn't bring him back because Cassie was dead at the time, but now she's alive, so what's their excuse to completely ignore him? It just makes them look like bad friends, much like the Runaways look bad just sitting on their asses while Xavin rots on some space prison. If they want us to believe those kids were ever true friends, they should be fighting to get their friends back! And let's not even get into how completely absurd it is that Cassie has been alive for 6 years now and she hasn't mentioned Jonas ONCE. This girl was brutally murdered at the age of 15, gets resurrected, only to find out her boyfriend was murdered by her ex-boyfriend turned villain.... and there's no trauma to unpack there? There's nothing she would like to say on the subject again, like it never even happened? Come on. I don't care if people don't like Jonas; at this point they should acknowledge him at least for the sake of good writing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dante Milton View Post
    I think the dramatic moment of the wedding/reception will be Loki showing up and everyone expecting him to start shit, cuz trickster god, but he really is just there to support Billy and Teddy.

    I also wouldn't mind seeing some of the Runaways, at least Nico and Karolina (Xavin would also be nice, but I'm sure that's not happening).
    YES to Loki and the Runaways attending. Also: JESSICA JONES (probably accompanied by Luke and Dani)!!! I really want to see the YA interacting with Jessica again.

    Quote Originally Posted by Waking Replica View Post
    Ehhh, I feel like Jonas doesn't really need to come back. I could maybe see Vision somehow having a back up of Jonas in some flash drive, or they take a page out of the MCU and retcon him to have somehow escaped to a hidden server or the internet before getting fried. Still, what purpose would he serve?

    Last time he was with them, they were kids. I could maybe see it as a way to give Cassie another chance at a romance, but I feel like the more likely and dramatic option would just be to bring back Nate (which, btw, how is he?)
    I don't see Nate as a viable romantic option for Cassie at all. He's the one Young Avenger who's probably never coming back to the team. Heinberg's run sort of solidified that he can't. They tried stopping him from becoming Kang and it didn't work (it backfired, actually), so he had to go into the timestream again. In Children's Crusade, it was clear he let all the time travelling get to his head, and it affected him. He wasn't that heroic anymore by that point; he killed Jonas out of spite and showed no remorse. He couldn't just waltz back into the team now like nothing happened. It's not like Cassie would have her arms open for him after what he did. I think the whole point of Heinberg's run was to tell us the story of how Nate went to the dark side, and since he literally can't stop himself from becoming Kang, his days as a Young Avenger were always numbered. I've always figured that by the time the YA see him again, he will definitely be more villainous than before, which WOULD make for some interesting interaction... just not a positive one for them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fokken View Post
    EMPYRE PREVIEW AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!

    https://comicbook.com/marvel/news/em...ng-spoilers/#4
    I'm just like... how the hell did they manage to do all of that during that one hour? LMAO. That's gotta be a new record. Most eventful hour in Marvel History. It's good to know Billy's parents knew about the wedding, at least.

    And looks like it's canon that Billy and Teddy do the nasty while Teddy is on his Hulkling form.... kinky, but also kind of inconsistent with what we saw in Emperor Hulkling, in which Teddy seemed to be more comfortable being intimate with Billy in his white form. So what is the truth? Unless they like to switch it up sometimes. But Empyre hasn't shown us white Teddy ONCE, which genuinely bothers me. It's like some people forget that is supposed to be his default look.

    And OMG, they gave Allan lines! AND TEDDY CALLED HIM BY HIS NAME! ALLAN HEINBERG IS CANON IN THE MARVEL UNIVERSE!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Waking Replica View Post
    I feel like Tini and Anthony/Chip got two different drafts/note sets of the story. They must've been still working out the kinks around the time of Incoming (plus there's the fact that it teased Outlawed, and well... we know how that's going now) or something of the sort. Or maybe like Tom said, they kept the marriage under wraps, but even from the writers, which is how we have such a wild timeline of events.
    Yeah, I get the feeling the writers just weren't on the same page here on what their hour together was supposed to look like, but it's comics, so I guess we'll just have to accept that that makes sense somehow.

    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    The timeline is a mess. Based on Incoming, Teddy left for space before Outlawed started. And indeed, the Fantastic Four don't seem to be affected by Outlawed yet (I suspect the arc starting in October will be though). But you'd think, starting three months before Empyre, that Iron Man 2020 would come first. But it turns out that needs to be after Outlawed starts, because Ironheart's 2020 tie-in was also an Outlawed story. And because of that, it has to be after Empyre as well... which doesn't make sense as Iron Man 2020 specifically starts on January 1st, and Empyre is definitely several months later, according to Empyre #1, which is set the same amount of time after Incoming as it was published. The three events seem to be not keeping time linear.
    That's Marvel for you. An already inconsistent publishing line + Coronavirus screwing up their entire schedule = a bigger mess than usual. And no shade to Outlawed or Iron Man 2020, but Empyre is obviously the bigger and more relevant event, besides being the one that will possibly leave some actual impact in the MU, so I think Marvel might prioritize their timeline over the others.
    Last edited by Drops Of Venus; 08-06-2020 at 03:39 PM.

  9. #1104
    Ultimate Member Wiccan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drops Of Venus View Post
    And looks like it's canon that Billy and Teddy do the nasty while Teddy is on his Hulkling form.... kinky, but also kind of inconsistent with what we saw in Emperor Hulkling, in which Teddy seemed to be more comfortable being intimate with Billy in his white form. So what is the truth? Unless they like to switch it up sometimes. But Empyre hasn't shown us white Teddy ONCE, which genuinely bothers me. It's like some people forget that is supposed to be his default look.
    Billy when they're about to have sex and Teddy isn't in Hulkling mode:

  10. #1105
    Extraordinary Member Fokken's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drops Of Venus View Post
    And looks like it's canon that Billy and Teddy do the nasty while Teddy is on his Hulkling form.... kinky, but also kind of inconsistent with what we saw in Emperor Hulkling, in which Teddy seemed to be more comfortable being intimate with Billy in his white form. So what is the truth? Unless they like to switch it up sometimes. But Empyre hasn't shown us white Teddy ONCE, which genuinely bothers me. It's like some people forget that is supposed to be his default look.
    So I have 4 proposals explaining Teddy's shift (haha) from Human/Hulkling form during his and Billy's sexy time, but in my mind its a combination of the first 3. haha.

    1) Empyre creative team wants to maintain a level of recognizable aesthetic consistency for the event. Basic and boring, but not unrealistic either.

    2) Empyre creative team is referencing the INCOMING pages by Jim Cheung, in which Teddy maintains his Hulkling shape throughout. Again, basic and not the flashiest of explanations but...there you go.

    3) Anthony Oliveira -- a massive gay nerd and proponent for LGBTQ content -- especially the recognition that these relationships not be stripped of their sexuality as they often are-- insisted Teddy be depicted in his Human form, when shown post coital, to emphasize that imagery as two men -- undeniably so-- even when filtered through a superhero lens.

    4) And here's the more cynical(?) explanation, flipping the Anthony/sexuality emphasis coin, which I vehemently choose to NOT acknowledge as truth because Al Ewing is such a strong ally for representation, but even his powers have limits when it comes to content (but then again, they succeeded in Emperor Hulkling, as I said, but that was a one shot and now I'm talking in circles) -- so they chose to show him in Hulkling form because that is potentially easier for non LGBTQ readers and those opposed to such imagery to digest. Clinging to the "Its fiction. Its not real. Your heterosexual sensitivities are still intact. See? Yes they're two men, but one is an Alien so its fine Oooooooh" narrative.

  11. #1106
    Astonishing Member Drops Of Venus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiccan View Post
    Billy when they're about to have sex and Teddy isn't in Hulkling mode:


    Quote Originally Posted by Fokken View Post
    So I have 4 proposals explaining Teddy's shift (haha) from Human/Hulkling form during his and Billy's sexy time, but in my mind its a combination of the first 3. haha.

    1) Empyre creative team wants to maintain a level of recognizable aesthetic consistency for the event. Basic and boring, but not unrealistic either.

    2) Empyre creative team is referencing the INCOMING pages by Jim Cheung, in which Teddy maintains his Hulkling shape throughout. Again, basic and not the flashiest of explanations but...there you go.

    3) Anthony Oliveira -- a massive gay nerd and proponent for LGBTQ content -- especially the recognition that these relationships not be stripped of their sexuality as they often are-- insisted Teddy be depicted in his Human form, when shown post coital, to emphasize that imagery as two men -- undeniably so-- even when filtered through a superhero lens.

    4) And here's the more cynical(?) explanation, flipping the Anthony/sexuality emphasis coin, which I vehemently choose to NOT acknowledge as truth because Al Ewing is such a strong ally for representation, but even his powers have limits when it comes to content (but then again, they succeeded in Emperor Hulkling, as I said, but that was a one shot and now I'm talking in circles) -- so they chose to show him in Hulkling form because that is potentially easier for non LGBTQ readers and those opposed to such imagery to digest. Clinging to the "Its fiction. Its not real. Your heterosexual sensitivities are still intact. See? Yes they're two men, but one is an Alien so its fine Oooooooh" narrative.
    I was thinking something along the lines of 1), as in, each writer/artist taking a different approach. I gotta say I dislike the approach of the main book, though, because it's been pretty well established that Teddy mostly hulks out when action calls, and he prefers his normal self on his down, personal times. I guess I could buy that he wants to look more alien while being the Emperor for the Kree/Skrull, but I find it unnecessary for him to be like that all the time with Billy. The sex scene doesn't even bother me that much 'cause it could just be them trying something different, nothing wrong with that, but him getting married like that really weirded me out. I don't want him to be Hulked out during his entire wedding reception either, but since it's the same creative team on Empyre: Avengers - Aftermath, I'm not even getting my hopes up.
    Last edited by Drops Of Venus; 08-07-2020 at 06:24 AM.

  12. #1107
    Extraordinary Member Fokken's Avatar
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    On a more upbeat(?) AESTHETIC topic: I am LIVING for Schiti's Billy.

    If I can be the absolute gayest possible for a quick second here and say HOLY CATS the LUSH fullness of Billy's devil-may-care LOCKS just easy breezy-ing all over the place is SO SO BEAUTIFUL I could cry. I won't. But I could. I absolutely ADORE every detail of how he's drawn. The strength of his jawline, the blushing tones to his flesh, the lashes for days, the toned solidness of his physique -- its just the perfect man-Billy and I'm going to treasure these issues forEVER.

    Siiiiiiigh.


    SEMI RELATED: Anyone catch the shadow application on Teddy throughout the flashback in Empyre 5 preview?
    The shadow along his temple area implying the shape of where his crown thing would sit? Just an interesting inking detail, or perhaps there is significance?
    Last edited by Fokken; 08-07-2020 at 05:50 AM.

  13. #1108
    Astonishing Member Drops Of Venus's Avatar
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    Schiti's design for Billy slapped HARD. I didn't even notice until someone pointed out that it looks like he's wearing make-up, and honestly, it just made me love it even more. I hope we can get Valerio to stay on art duty on whichever book Billy goes next.

  14. #1109
    Extraordinary Member Fokken's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drops Of Venus View Post
    Schiti's design for Billy slapped HARD. I didn't even notice until someone pointed out that it looks like he's wearing make-up, and honestly, it just made me love it even more. I hope we can get Valerio to stay on art duty on whichever book Billy goes next.
    That would be amazing. And yes, there was a definite softness (and strength) to his features. I LOOVED it. Billy's really blossomed.

  15. #1110
    Astonishing Member Drops Of Venus's Avatar
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    News about MAC appearing in the Doctor Strange movie have resurfaced: https://thedirect.com/article/doctor...ca-chavez-role

    They seem pretty sure that's America, but I don't know... that casting call description is weird. A puerto-rican actress from ages 12-15? That sounds... unnecessary for a character like America. The actress being specifically puerto-rican when America's ethnicity is very ambiguous is the first odd thing to me, and then the age... why would they need someone as young as 12 for the role? America was never that young in comics. IIRC, she debuted at the age of 16 (and Gillen later aged her up to be older than all the other Young Avengers), so the call doesn't even encompass that. And that doesn't mesh well at all with recent news about Hailee Steinfeld, who is 23/24, playing Kate. It doesn't make any sense that the age range for America is so much younger in comparison to Kate like that. I don't doubt the casting call exists, but I have my doubts if it's really supposed to be America. Unless they are really changing her for the MCU, for some reason... which I dislike. Older America is better.
    Last edited by Drops Of Venus; 08-07-2020 at 08:11 AM.

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