Young Avengers Appreciation 2020

[GenericUsername]

I think suspension of disbelief has its own limits too. Saying that Vision can have biological kids would require an essential change to who he is as a character, 'cause even in the Marvel Universe, synthetic androids are not considered biological beings (unless they're cyborgs), and every time each one of them has had a child, it was not in any biological way. So even though Marvel could technically defy reality in this specific case, they decided not to, 'cause those are the rules of their universe. It's quite selective, yes, but that's fiction for you. Creators get to decide what makes sense and what doesn't.

It doesn't change him one bit. That was Englehart's intention with him, to make him more human than synthezoid. It's only stories after that, that kept pushing him away from that concept, because writers chose to do the opposite. But he was supposed to be like Data. Regardless, he is still the father of the original Billy and Tommy. And he went through his own grieving process after he got back his memories and emotions. He's been through a lot and never should be erased for Mephisto of all characters.

[Drops Of Venus]

Tommy and Kate were the ones who encouraged Cassie to curse.... I just know it.

[Journey]

So I've come to the conclusion Billy and Tommy are never gonna get that invite to Krakoa. 1 Wanda is considered the pretender that's a conflict of interest, 2 X-Men potentially ally with the shiar who last I checked opposed the Skrull and Kree who now fall under Teddy who will one day marry Billy hopefully in the nearby future, 3 my boy is now showing Precog abilities and that's a big no no!! Tommy gets the **** end for being related to Wanda and Billy sucks too I feel he would thrive in the X-World.

[Sutekh]

Before Tommy could get an invite to Krakoa, someone would have to remember he exists.

In my head, he and Coat of Arms are in a club somewhere, being frenemies with benefits, sipping mojitos and taking a break from this whole super-thing.

[hulkling]

So I've come to the conclusion Billy and Tommy are never gonna get that invite to Krakoa. 1 Wanda is considered the pretender that's a conflict of interest, 2 X-Men potentially ally with the shiar who last I checked opposed the Skrull and Kree who now fall under Teddy who will one day marry Billy hopefully in the nearby future, 3 my boy is now showing Precog abilities and that's a big no no!! Tommy gets the **** end for being related to Wanda and Billy sucks too I feel he would thrive in the X-World.

please no I dont want them to be mutants making him a mutant would mean that he isnt omega, so he isnt the most powerful magic manipulator in existence. I refuse to believe that.

[HipHopAvenger]

So I've come to the conclusion Billy and Tommy are never gonna get that invite to Krakoa. 1 Wanda is considered the pretender that's a conflict of interest, 2 X-Men potentially ally with the shiar who last I checked opposed the Skrull and Kree who now fall under Teddy who will one day marry Billy hopefully in the nearby future, 3 my boy is now showing Precog abilities and that's a big no no!! Tommy gets the **** end for being related to Wanda and Billy sucks too I feel he would thrive in the X-World.

Sunspot (is courting Deathbird who will sit on the Shi’ar throne) is friends with Teddy and Billy they could make an alliance or an even bigger empire. Though knowing Marvel they’ll make a big ol event with Krakoa (and Shi’ar) vs Wanda w/ Tommy, Billy, and Teddy (and his empire backing her up), Pietro and Avengers, deaths and alliance then probably war with Noh-Varr’s Kree. Where in the end it will be revealed that Wanda was actually a mutant and so are Billy and Tommy.

[Journey]

please no I dont want them to be mutants making him a mutant would mean that he isnt omega, so he isnt the most powerful magic manipulator in existence. I refuse to believe that.

I mean he probably would be an omega. Had Marvel and Fox not had their BS over movie rights which eventually led to Axis Wanda and Pietro would still be mutants, and Wanda and Billy would both be considered omega level. Now due to the mess with Wanda all the writers have avoided addressing the issue of T and B's Mutantcy. As soon as someone bothers to give a definitive answer he would probably be put on the list.

Also if you take into question the sliding timeline that makes it so YA Vol 2, New Avengers, Deathshead, and Now Strikefirce all take place in the same year. Billy hasn't really been all that active as a superhero so he falls under the radar.

[Journey]

Sunspot (is courting Deathbird who will sit on the Shi’ar throne) is friends with Teddy and Billy they could make an alliance or an even bigger empire. Though knowing Marvel they’ll make a big ol event with Krakoa (and Shi’ar) vs Wanda w/ Tommy, Billy, and Teddy (and his empire backing her up), Pietro and Avengers, deaths and alliance then probably war with Noh-Varr’s Kree. Where in the end it will be revealed that Wanda was actually a mutant and so are Billy and Tommy.

I would honestly read the **** out of that story......

[H-E-D]

I thought the general consensus was Tommy and Billy's souls went back in time and hijacked two babies kicking out their souls to wherever the ****, and the magic that was used to get them there warped their looks/DNA so their twins in every sense.

You know considering the whole thing is obscure to begin with who's to say this was even Wanda's doing, they could retcon it say it was Mephisto, Chiton, or even Demiurge Billy forcing himself into existence if they wanted to. Their are many routes to explore if they ever bother to address that elephant.

My professional opinion is that they didn’t hijack two babies; but that those babies didn’t exist. Wanda created those vessels and their history in the world ex nihilo after House of M.

Now, where their souls came from in the first place? Don’t know. Don’t care. Doesn’t seem important to me.

All I know is that trying to assign a complex origin to how they became Tommy Shepard and Billy Kaplan, instead of just the Witch and Vision’s kids, isn’t necessary. It adds nothing. There’s no point to it.

[HipHopAvenger]

I would honestly read the **** out of that story......

As long as it's written by Al Ewing & Hickman

[Drops Of Venus]

So I've come to the conclusion Billy and Tommy are never gonna get that invite to Krakoa. 1 Wanda is considered the pretender that's a conflict of interest, 2 X-Men potentially ally with the shiar who last I checked opposed the Skrull and Kree who now fall under Teddy who will one day marry Billy hopefully in the nearby future, 3 my boy is now showing Precog abilities and that's a big no no!! Tommy gets the **** end for being related to Wanda and Billy sucks too I feel he would thrive in the X-World.

I don't even think point 2 will be a factor, honestly. Like I said before, I think it all boils down to editorial not considering them mutants. The X-Men editorial is currently all about bringing pretty much all mutants to Krakoa, specially the most powerful ones, so the fact that Billy has been actively appearing in comics for the last several months and no one bothered to mention Krakoa is very telling.

Before Tommy could get an invite to Krakoa, someone would have to remember he exists.

In my head, he and Coat of Arms are in a club somewhere, being frenemies with benefits, sipping mojitos and taking a break from this whole super-thing.

Everyone getting excited about Tommy appearing in the promotional material for Outlawed, but I'm just here fully preparing myself for his role in the book to be like this. Tommy fans were born to suffer.

please no I dont want them to be mutants making him a mutant would mean that he isnt omega, so he isnt the most powerful magic manipulator in existence. I refuse to believe that.

Even as a powerful non-mutant, I wonder where he currently stands on the magical hierarchy, due to the concept of mutant magic that's been established on Exalibur. The book is kind of trying to sell that as a superior kind of magic, but then again, Billy is is destined to become the person who rewrites the laws of magic, and we know that in at least one reality, Doctor Doom lost his powers because of the Demiurge, so... how would Billy go up against mutant magic? That's an interesting story to explore, if Tini ever decides to do an Excalibur/Strikeforce crossover.

[Dermie]

So I've come to the conclusion Billy and Tommy are never gonna get that invite to Krakoa. 1 Wanda is considered the pretender that's a conflict of interest, 2 X-Men potentially ally with the shiar who last I checked opposed the Skrull and Kree who now fall under Teddy who will one day marry Billy hopefully in the nearby future, 3 my boy is now showing Precog abilities and that's a big no no!! Tommy gets the **** end for being related to Wanda and Billy sucks too I feel he would thrive in the X-World.

Even if they received an invitation, I can't see either one of them accepting it -- their main experience involving X-Men is Wolverine repeatedly arguing to murder Billy because he is the son of the Scarlet Witch and she caused the Decimation. The X-Men may have chosen to forgive and forget (given that they are inviting all their deadliest mortal foes to live with them and join their teams these days), but I doubt Billy or Tommy will be eager to trust them.

Both of them have too many ties to the non-mutant world to want to go live on Krakoa anyway. There's a handful of mutants out there who have never really been connected to the X-books who I don't think would choose to go isolate themselves that way.

[Digifiend]

I mean he probably would be an omega. Had Marvel and Fox not had their BS over movie rights which eventually led to Axis Wanda and Pietro would still be mutants, and Wanda and Billy would both be considered omega level. Now due to the mess with Wanda all the writers have avoided addressing the issue of T and B's Mutantcy. As soon as someone bothers to give a definitive answer he would probably be put on the list.

Also if you take into question the sliding timeline that makes it so YA Vol 2, New Avengers, Deathshead, and Now Strikefirce all take place in the same year. Billy hasn't really been all that active as a superhero so he falls under the radar.

YA Vol 2 would be the previous year, and Deaths Head and Strikeforce may be in a third. Runaways said it's been two years since they formed, but Secret Wars had an eight month timeskip - enough to send Squirrel Girl up a year at college. So that's where the divide between the first and second year is. That's backed up by Fantastic Four, as when Reed, Sue and the kids returned having been gone since Secret Wars, a year had passed for Ben and Johnny.

[Sutekh]

I mean he probably would be an omega.

It would be interesting if he was explicitly not an 'omega,' at least, not *yet.* Limited range, maybe a temporary duration, limited area of effect (not, say, *every mutant on earth* if he says 'nomoremutants!', just *a* mutant, right in front of him, and only for a limited time).

Just because he's going to become the Demiurge someday at the end of the universe, doesn't mean he has to jump to the finish and become 'omega' quite so early in (what I hope to be!) a long, long career. And there's no need for 'reality manipulation' to be utterly cosmic in scope. A more limited ability to manipulate *local* reality, and limits like range, duration, area, or even difficulty affecting strong-willed people directly (such as not being able to 'nomoremutants' someone like Xavier, but being totally able to make his fancy helmet turn into a locked prisoner of Azkaban mask, or make *himself* temporarily totally immune to telepathy), could be mitigating factors.

[Journey]

The Demiurge and the Emperor!! Teddy and no doubt Billy obviously getting ready to wreck both the Avengers and the Fantastic 4 for his man! Franklin is sitting somewhere shook and crying in awe by the true god of the multiverse!!! Avengers and X-Men somewhere shook in the fetal position fearing M-Day Times 2!!! Skrulls and Kree somewhere bowing and getting ready to kiss their rings!! We love to See It!!!