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  1. #376
    Extraordinary Member Phoenixx9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Maximoff View Post
    Attachment 99726
    Attachment 99727
    Sue can make her force field soundproof.

    Attachment 99728
    She has even stopped ultrasonic attacks.

    So ultimately Songbird isn't really a good opponent for Sue.
    I love the first pic which is from a long time ago. Sometimes there was information presented in them that we all forget about Sue's Force Fields.

  2. #377
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    Just do the Star Wars/Karnak method of a character who can shatterpoint tap shields into oblivion.

  3. #378
    Extraordinary Member Crimz's Avatar
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    Sue's force fields naturally let sound through, but she can block it out. If she knows that she's up against someone with those powers she can defend against them. She's faced Klaw and Songbird before so she knows their powers. Songbird effected her at a time when Sue didn't know what her powers were. A fight today would go very differently.

    This kind of fits my theory that Sue's force fields naturally block most attacks but she can manipulate them to defend against specific ones that get through the basic force field. Such as sound or air (her force fields usually have a breathable skin to let air through so she can breathe but she can make them airtight).

    Her powers are all about control and for some attacks against her is less about it being automatically immune and more her manipulaing it so that it can defend against that particular attack.
    Last edited by Crimz; 08-13-2020 at 03:17 PM.
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  4. #379
    Extraordinary Member Crimz's Avatar
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    Also it makes sense that these three thinhs get through her force field:

    Sound
    Air
    Light

    She needs to breathe, see, and hear. Blocking them out is not a smart move during battle. She'd blind, deaf, and slowly suffocating in every fight. She can definitely block them out but it only makes sense for her to do so when she knows an enemy can use one of these things against her.

    That's why the biggest advantage is if she doesn't know you can manipulate one of these things and catch her by surprise. If she does then it won't work.
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  5. #380
    FF purist/snob CaptCleghorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crimz View Post
    Also it makes sense that these three thinhs get through her force field:

    Sound
    Air
    Light

    She needs to breathe, see, and hear. Blocking them out is not a smart move during battle. She'd blind, deaf, and slowly suffocating in every fight. She can definitely block them out but it only makes sense for her to do so when she knows an enemy can use one of these things against her.

    That's why the biggest advantage is if she doesn't know you can manipulate one of these things and catch her by surprise. If she does then it won't work.
    This makes a lot of sense. I'd love to add some brilliant addition onto this this, but this covers it quite well and all I can add is my admiration.

  6. #381
    Spectacular Member Billy Maximoff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marvel Forever View Post
    It has been shown in the past that Sue's force field is not immune to the power of sound waves. Klaw has had some success against her, especially in a more recent fight in Hulk #19. We also had the Plunderer using a sonic disruptor to wipe out Sue's force field and knock her unconscious in FF #191. A sound wave attack also defeated Sue's force field in FF #201. There is plenty of evidence that shows that Susan Storm is not immune to sound waves. I say bring it on, Songbird! I want a catfight!
    https://comicvine.gamespot.com/invis...n-616-2093434/

    Check the Special/Unique Capabilities category in Sue's respect thread, there are about ten times Sue's force field blocks sound, so she can do it pretty consistently.

    Also Klaw didn't use his sound-based attack through Sue's force field in Hulk 19

  7. #382
    Incredible Member Marvel Forever's Avatar
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    Yes, I know He used trickery to defeat her.

  8. #383
    Incredible Member Marvel Forever's Avatar
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    Marvel has made Sue far too powerful in recent decades. It is unfair to both FF foes and to other Marvel heroes that Sue is so powerful. I would much rather that Sue receive a boost in her intellect, but a major downgrade to her powers. The way she is at present, there are not that many foes that could give her a decent fight. Susan Storm has been my favorite comic book character for over 5 decades now. However, FF writers went too far in trying to shake her more passive Silver Age image. The old saying "moderation in all things" applies even to Marvel's depiction of Sue. One can almost make a case that they have raised her powers to a near God-like level and this does not serve her well, in my estimation.
    Last edited by Marvel Forever; 08-13-2020 at 09:28 PM.

  9. #384
    Extraordinary Member Crimz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marvel Forever View Post
    Marvel has made Sue far too powerful in recent decades. It is unfair to both FF foes and to other Marvel heroes that Sue is so powerful. I would much rather that Sue receive a boost in her intellect, but a major downgrade to her powers. The way she is at present, there are not that many foes that could give her a decent fight. Susan Storm has been my favorite comic book character for over 5 decades now. However, FF writers went too far in trying to shake her more passive Silver Age image. The old saying "moderation in all things" applies even to Marvel's depiction of Sue. One can almost make a case that they have raised her powers to a near God-like level and this does not serve her well, in my estimation.
    Hard disagree. There are plenty of heroes just as powerful: Storm, Jean Grey, Thor, Hulk and many more. There is nothing wrong with how powerful Sue is and it being "unfair" makes no sense. Not every hero is the same in power and that is better for diversity of heroes. If everyone was the same power as Silver Surfer or Punisher then things would be dull.
    It's also not "unfair" to their villains. Many of the FF's villains have stagnated since Lee/Kirby left and that's due to writers having no clue/Not bothering to update them. It's nothing to do with Sue's power.

    Heck, look at Franklin - the literal God! Sue's fine in term of her power and I want to see more creative uses of her powers, especially her invisibility.
    Last edited by Crimz; 08-14-2020 at 12:08 AM.
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  10. #385
    FF purist/snob CaptCleghorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crimz View Post
    Hard disagree. There are plenty of heroes just as powerful: Storm, Jean Grey, Thor, Hulk and many more. There is nothing wrong with how powerful Sue is and it being "unfair" makes no sense. Not every hero is the same in power and that is better for diversity of heroes. If everyone was the same power as Silver Surfer or Punisher then things would be dull.
    It's also not "unfair" to their villains. Many of the FF's villains have stagnated since Lee/Kirby left and that's due to writers having no clue/Not bothering to update them. It's nothing to do with Sue's power.

    Heck, look at Franklin - the literal God! Sue's fine in term of her power and I want to see more creative uses of her powers, especially her invisibility.
    Sue's had some very creative uses of her power and her current level of power is due to that creativity. In old-time professional wrestling, Andre the Giant was a veritable titan and a wrestler no one could defeat. But then everybody else bulked up and we have a plethora of giants running around the ring. The FF's foes have not done that (except for Doom). I would consider Sue's power levels as important to the FF's balance as Reed's pulling a device out of his nether regions is far too often the answer. Ben's spirit and heart, Reed's intellect, Sue's growth are all aspects of the FF that make the team.

    If their foes aren't growing to match the FF's development, that is solely on Marvel editorial and writers. And this has been yet another comment by the fantastic Crimz I agree with totally.

  11. #386
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    I’d argue that Annihilus “bulked up” as a foe, similar to how Doom did.

  12. #387
    Mighty Member Oberon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crimz View Post
    Sue's force fields naturally let sound through, but she can block it out. If she knows that she's up against someone with those powers she can defend against them. She's faced Klaw and Songbird before so she knows their powers. Songbird effected her at a time when Sue didn't know what her powers were. A fight today would go very differently.

    This kind of fits my theory that Sue's force fields naturally block most attacks but she can manipulate them to defend against specific ones that get through the basic force field. Such as sound or air (her force fields usually have a breathable skin to let air through so she can breathe but she can make them airtight).

    Her powers are all about control and for some attacks against her is less about it being automatically immune and more her manipulaing it so that it can defend against that particular attack.
    In the classic run up to #200, Reed, possessed by the Molecule Man observed that Sue's Ff had "not true molecular structure" (or something like that). Which goes with Hyper space later theorized too. Her 'energy' can do Marvel-los things and maybe there is a lot more.

  13. #388
    Extraordinary Member Phoenixx9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oberon View Post
    In the classic run up to #200, Reed, possessed by the Molecule Man observed that Sue's Ff had "not true molecular structure" (or something like that). Which goes with Hyper space later theorized too. Her 'energy' can do Marvel-los things and maybe there is a lot more.
    Yeah, I always took that to mean that Sue's IFF had a shifting molecular pattern, (constantly shifting faster than the eye can see, if the eye could see it) which could be why it is so strong and durable to so many things.

  14. #389
    Mighty Member Oberon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crimz View Post
    Hard disagree. There are plenty of heroes just as powerful: Storm, Jean Grey, Thor, Hulk and many more. There is nothing wrong with how powerful Sue is and it being "unfair" makes no sense. Not every hero is the same in power and that is better for diversity of heroes. If everyone was the same power as Silver Surfer or Punisher then things would be dull.
    It's also not "unfair" to their villains. Many of the FF's villains have stagnated since Lee/Kirby left and that's due to writers having no clue/Not bothering to update them. It's nothing to do with Sue's power.

    Heck, look at Franklin - the literal God! Sue's fine in term of her power and I want to see more creative uses of her powers, especially her invisibility.

    Sue, is the mother of God, means you have to be a Goddess to birth a God.

    But seriously, Sue has always been my favorite character too. I certainly love a lot of others. I don't think she is overpowered. I think that Ben has lost his standing as one of the strongest, so maybe that should be addressed.

    Johnny can go Nova. How powerful is that?

    Reed - well maybe his powers of stretching do not lend to 'over power' (or ?)

    So Sue is about right, and her power was built, from the beginning, to keep expanding and evolving.

  15. #390
    Mighty Member Oberon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenixx9 View Post
    Yeah, I always took that to mean that Sue's IFF had a shifting molecular pattern, which could be why it is so strong and durable to so many things.

    I thought that too. Since then, with the other things that come to explain or denote origin, I think that is sound and lends to the idea that it is sort of a non molecule thing. Not like anti matter from the Negative Zone - which has interacted with her, the others on occasion,

    but that the origin may come from Hyper-space - which I still don't understand why that connects to the Celestials, but her shields and her vision-ability powers are not anti matter based - people would blow up when she used them, lol. So . . . a force field with no true energy/signature, that is not 'anti-matter' could be this... hyper space thing/energy.

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