Dick Grayson: Robin / Nightwing Appreciation 2020

[Robanker]

Oh, on a totally unrelated note; another reason I found to push a Nightwing-Power Girl romance; they both have crap real names that have become synonymous with bad things; the loud overbearing middle aged blonde white woman who wants to speak to your manager is a Karen (Power Girl's earth name) while any d-bag who's rude and inconsiderate is a dick.

As your fellow brother in PowerWing, goddamn dude that's a streeeeetch worthy of Eel O'Brian.

For those asking, yeah, the didn't interact much but they did for a moment during her solo series in issue #17. They had some fun chemistry, but otherwise they don't operate in the same circles as Ascended mentioned. It really is just what could be, not that the DickBabs and DickFire shippers will ever allow anything outside their preferred ship. PowerWing can and should be the neutral zone both come together in. Blessed be.

[K. Jones]

I can't ship anyone Prime Universe with Power Girl anymore without the WEIRD overtones of them also being friends with Supergirl.

Except Jimmy Olsen. For some reason I feel like he could find himself in that strange dynamic and he's just such a chill dude that the cringe of it all would roll off him. Cringey? Fringe. Fringey? That kind of stuff happened on Fringe a lot, yeah? The sketch nature of having f***ed this person who is ... pretty young ... but you know ... alternate reality. Humans all start young and grow into adults, adulthood and ... well, adult content ... but when you're Dick Grayson and you're FRIENDS with this like 17 year old blond girl who his one of your BFF's little cousin, and then you're like, presented with some kinky Earth-2 statutory rape avoidance method, when in your universe, on your timeline, the girl you know, baseline, is underage, is sketccchhhhhy.

Justice League kids should definitely have a "No Multiversal Fraternization Policy" just for the ethics involved, not just the cosmic screw-ups that could result.

Now all that being said ... I like Kara a lot and she's been around since the early 1960s. She's not the plucky teenage side character anymore and has aged up almost as much as Dick has to the point where her key Pop Culture "known version" is a young Adult person just like Dick Grayson. And I like all the Karen Starr motifs and additional character ticks and beats and stuff (although I still can't really figure how Supergirl "growing up" involves a complete change in body type and huge jugs other than you know, Men Wrote This).

So I can see a young adult Kara/Karen evolution-fusion graduating to be Prime Earth Power Girl and trading blue for white and being a good SHIP-MATCH for Dick Grayson, and passing the Supergirl mantle on to a new plucky teen. Dick and Kara could be a solid match chemistry-wise. I'd like to think the Supers are more sensible people less prone to interpersonal drama, though, and that Kara would be smart enough to think back about Dick's relationship history and track record and be like "yeah gonna pass on that."

Just kind of had an idea for an art where Superman and Superboy and a new Supergirl wear blue, Kara/Powergirl (halfway-grown-up-hybrid-version) wears white and Conner wears red.

[Hizashi]

Ha! Sorry to disappoint.

I'd agree with getting back to basics, but....what's "back to basics" here? Back to Bludhaven? Back to Bat-lite? Back to the NTT? DC has eroded Dick's status so utterly and for so long I don't even know what the "basics" would be now, and I'm not sure if I want them in the first place.

To hell with playing it safe and getting back to basics, I'd rather see Nightwing built up and invested in; I want new and improved, not same old same old. Find the core of the character and his appeal again, yes, if that's the basics then I'm in total agreement with you. But I don't want the basics if it's treated as the endgame and not the starting point. Take the essential core, but then build up and out, with an eye towards sculpting Nightwing as a viable, sustainable solo property.

Absolutely the latter, I don’t want him anywhere near Blüdhaven.

[dropkickjake]

I can't ship anyone Prime Universe with Power Girl anymore without the WEIRD overtones of them also being friends with Supergirl.

Except Jimmy Olsen. For some reason I feel like he could find himself in that strange dynamic and he's just such a chill dude that the cringe of it all would roll off him. Cringey? Fringe. Fringey? That kind of stuff happened on Fringe a lot, yeah? The sketch nature of having f***ed this person who is ... pretty young ... but you know ... alternate reality. Humans all start young and grow into adults, adulthood and ... well, adult content ... but when you're Dick Grayson and you're FRIENDS with this like 17 year old blond girl who his one of your BFF's little cousin, and then you're like, presented with some kinky Earth-2 statutory rape avoidance method, when in your universe, on your timeline, the girl you know, baseline, is underage, is sketccchhhhhy.

Justice League kids should definitely have a "No Multiversal Fraternization Policy" just for the ethics involved, not just the cosmic screw-ups that could result.

Now all that being said ... I like Kara a lot and she's been around since the early 1960s. She's not the plucky teenage side character anymore and has aged up almost as much as Dick has to the point where her key Pop Culture "known version" is a young Adult person just like Dick Grayson. And I like all the Karen Starr motifs and additional character ticks and beats and stuff (although I still can't really figure how Supergirl "growing up" involves a complete change in body type and huge jugs other than you know, Men Wrote This).

So I can see a young adult Kara/Karen evolution-fusion graduating to be Prime Earth Power Girl and trading blue for white and being a good SHIP-MATCH for Dick Grayson, and passing the Supergirl mantle on to a new plucky teen. Dick and Kara could be a solid match chemistry-wise. I'd like to think the Supers are more sensible people less prone to interpersonal drama, though, and that Kara would be smart enough to think back about Dick's relationship history and track record and be like "yeah gonna pass on that."

Just kind of had an idea for an art where Superman and Superboy and a new Supergirl wear blue, Kara/Powergirl (halfway-grown-up-hybrid-version) wears white and Conner wears red.

How does Karen being from Earth2 make things cringe for Dick? He doesn't really have much interaction with Supergirl that I know of anyway.

[Drako]

How does Karen being from Earth2 make things cringe for Dick? He doesn't really have much interaction with Supergirl that I know of anyway.

They became friends during James Robinson's JLA.

About going back to basics or not, doesn't really matter. What is really important is the writer. A good writer can do a great back to basics story or make new stuff.

The real decision is who DC will choose to write him.

[Ascended]

As your fellow brother in PowerWing, goddamn dude that's a streeeeetch worthy of Eel O'Brian.

I know! Don't even care! No logic is too thin in my eternal quest to make PowerWing happen!

I can't ship anyone Prime Universe with Power Girl anymore without the WEIRD overtones of them also being friends with Supergirl.

I gotta say, that's an odd logic my friend.

Dick and Kara aren't even close; back in the day Kara had a crush on Dick (who doesnt?) and Dick treated her the same way he treats most of the young heroes he mentors. There was definitely nothing deeper than that, as far as I saw.

Karen and Kara aren't even similar people, despite being the "same" person from different earths; Karen's older, has a completely different personality, a completely different body type....they're nothing alike and basically only share a name and blonde hair. If anything, the PowerWing-Supergirl dynamic would be like a high school basketball coach who ends up dating the (much) older sister of one of his players; yeah it might be a tad awkward at Thanksgiving but it's far from being some kind of weird statutory stand-in.

You're right that CW Supergirl is close to Dick's age, and if comic Kara caught up in age to Dick and basically became Power Girl, then....sure? I guess? But at that point, the character isn't Kara anymore and has just replaced Karen. Doesn't seem like we'd actually gain anything we don't already have.

[Digifiend]

Yeah, in the comics Supergirl doesn't grow up. The pre-Crisis one died when barely into her 20s, and the only version older than that is the Arrowverse one. The 80s movie one was at high school. 90s Linda was also a teenager, as was the post-Crisis Kara eventually introduced near the end of that run. Then she got rebooted again with the New 52, and was back at high school again in Rebirth. Power Girl, meanwhile, is supposed to be mid to late 20s. And yeah, the common things they use to differentiate the two are shorter hair and bigger boobs. Frankly, classic Power Girl is dated, they're better off using her legacy character Tanya Spears from now on. In which case, Supergirl would be the older one. Kara should at least be aged up enough to have left school, but too much would probably break her continuity.

[SiegePerilous02]

Was Kara older than Dick pre-COIE? Babs was, so I assumed she was too though perhaps not as much.

She really should at least be in the same vague early 20s age range as Dick and current Babs.

[dropkickjake]

Was Kara older than Dick pre-COIE? Babs was, so I assumed she was too though perhaps not as much.

She really should at least be in the same vague early 20s age range as Dick and current Babs.

I'm pro powerwing. I'll say that at the outset.

However, my first real look at the character of Supergirl was the early n52 run. I think that run is a bit outside the norm of supergirl's character? Either way, I actually found that concept incredibly intriguing. Having been a teenager on Krypton, having memories of a lost home, showing up on distant shores as a refugee and immigrant who doesn't speak the language or understand the culture... this makes the character super interesting to me. Gives a (very natural) segue to being a comics take on the immigrant experience the way that X-Men was a comics take on civil rights.

If you started with that character and aged her to just her early 20s, I'd be pro Dick/Supergirl.

[Aahz]

Was Kara older than Dick pre-COIE?

Kara age in relation to Dicks pre-COIE is kind of wired (at least based on what I can see with quick look at DC wikia).
She was apparently 15 when she landed on Earth (published 1959) which would make her roughly the same age as Dick, it seems that she aged much faster than Dick, for example (based on DC wika) she went to collage in 1966 and graduated in 1971, while Dick went to collage in 1969 and was basically in his fist year and at the age of 18 until the early 80s. I'm not sure how old she was in Crisis on Infinite earth, but she was very likely older than Dick and more Barbaras age at that point.

[AmiMizuno]

How bad would it be to make Kara the same age as Dick so they can date each other

[Restingvoice]

Kara age in relation to Dicks pre-COIE is kind of wired (at least based on what I can see with quick look at DC wikia).
She was apparently 15 when she landed on Earth (published 1959) which would make her roughly the same age as Dick, it seems that she aged much faster than Dick, for example (based on DC wika) she went to collage in 1966 and graduated in 1971, while Dick went to collage in 1969 and was basically in his fist year and at the age of 18 until the early 80s. I'm not sure how old she was in Crisis on Infinite earth, but she was very likely older than Dick and more Barbaras age at that point.

She got an Age Reset in the 80s. She did graduate and work, then quit the job to go back to college in the 70s, but in 1982, she started college again as a high school graduate.

Meanwhile, according to Marv Wolfman, Dick was 21 years old in 1984 when he became Nightwing

[Ascended]

I'm pro powerwing. I'll say that at the outset.

However, my first real look at the character of Supergirl was the early n52 run. I think that run is a bit outside the norm of supergirl's character?

For backstory, no, that's standard, classic Supergirl (and it *is* interesting stuff). For personality.....I dunno if we can say the New52 was outside the norm, because Kara hasn't really had a "norm" for thirty-something years.

She usually bounces between "All-American sweetheart" and "angry, angsty teen" depending on which way the wind is blowing outside DC's offices.

If you started with that character and aged her to just her early 20s, I'd be pro Dick/Supergirl.

I wouldn't be completely against it either, though I think Karen is still the more interesting match.

[Artemisfanboy]

Yeah, in the comics Supergirl doesn't grow up. The pre-Crisis one died when barely into her 20s, and the only version older than that is the Arrowverse one. The 80s movie one was at high school. 90s Linda was also a teenager, as was the post-Crisis Kara eventually introduced near the end of that run. Then she got rebooted again with the New 52, and was back at high school again in Rebirth. Power Girl, meanwhile, is supposed to be mid to late 20s. And yeah, the common things they use to differentiate the two are shorter hair and bigger boobs. Frankly, classic Power Girl is dated, they're better off using her legacy character Tanya Spears from now on. In which case, Supergirl would be the older one. Kara should at least be aged up enough to have left school, but too much would probably break her continuity.

No. Keep Karen as Power Girl and with the JSA, where she should be once they relaunch them with the team from Doomsday Clock, since she was there with them, hopefully next year.

Tanya can either get her own new code name or go by her actual name, if somebody comes up with a plan for her.

[WonderNight]

Is the JSA get in the past or present?