John Stewart: Green Lantern Appreciation 2020

[SecretWarrior]

There are lots of other female characters from that show they could've chosen, and there are a couple of other Latinos (or characters with Latin accents) they've pushed in the past they could've chosen. If the show had any effect on the choice, the GL branding did too.

John isn't competing against Jessica since he isn't being pushed and has never really been pushed when you compare their use of him to other characters old and new-- Not even really when JL or JLU were on the air, though the marketing for those shows made him a well recognized character.

As has already been mentioned, they don't care about the black kid demo--only licensing does. People behind the scenes only care when they have to expand. That's why you see Falcon often included with the founding Avengers on marketing materials. DC is notoriously bad with characters from a certain background and phenotype, so I'm not surprised about anything. That's actually the one thing they've been consistent on. Despite having a different ethnic background, Jessica is the same racial phenotype as Harley Quinn. Nothing is new here. DC follows clear patterns. Giving a character an accent in an animated film doesn't change that, especially when you realize that accent doesn't carry over to foreign market releases like Brazil or Japan.

The only time DC or WB ever handled black characters well was when McDuffie was involved and making an active push. He knew-- And licensors know-- You don't succeed doing that by having a character who doesn't look equal to their team mates or whose name calls attention to their race. (When black creators are involved, they don't call their character "Black" anything.)

At the end of the day, they can't erase JL or JLU, in which McDuffie clearly demonstrates how to do it right.

[Vampire Savior]

If that's true, shouldn't John be more prominent now, since the JLU generation is in their late 20s and early 30s? I mean they do a lot of BTAS stuff these days. Based on some Gen Y youtube channels, JL and JLU are still picking up fans. I think there's something more to this.

I don't believe so. Comics saw a big boom in the mid-80s and early 90s, and a lot of people came into the hobby then. Jim Shooter was smart enough to lure many kids in with quality G.I. Joe and Transformers comics, and more mature comics were coming out for people who wanted them, like Watchmen. Indie-comics with a very different flavor were starting to spring up like Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and Cerebus, and superstars like McFarlane, Liefeld, and Lee caused a ton of enthusiasm among fans and brought in even more people. Some of those people are still in the hobby today. Generally speaking, they're probably in their 40s now. And you still have some people today that were reading all the way back in the 70s. I think U.S. comics primarily appeal to these sorts. Sure, younger people get into the hobby, too, but they can easily check out something like Geoff Johns' Green Lantern, because it's there and people will probably tell them to, and that will likely not endear them to John Stewart.

[mace11]

She looks like she has as much native or African brownness as Ariana Grande, i.e. a tan, and no one would call her black. Let me know when she has afro-texture hair or recognizably native facial features. Those wouldn't be in keeping with previous illustrations of the character though. Again, when the movie is translated for Brazil or Japan, they're not going to racially distinguish her from Barry Allen.

Yeah i think we getting of topic here but i think this is an issue that need to be address in another thread when it comes to latinos and phenotype and who is white or not but me let say this.

So are saying jessic cruz is really a white latino and not brown because you think she looks racially like barry allen.
Don't say that in the latino dc thread because folks will be coming after you.
Fire looks more white then jessica and she is called brown and to many she does even look white still.

Jessica in comics look more like these women.
Kristal Silva


Becky G

They look brown like her,not white.
Racially they both look different then barry allen and so do these women above.
Anybody calling jessica or these women white looking,would be incorrect.


Other women that looks jessica look closer too are
Eiza Gonzalez
https://i.pinimg.com/236x/a0/30/d1/a...k-eyebrows.jpg

Maybe Diane Guerrero,they voice of jessica cruz in one of dc animated movies.
She is in doom patrol so i don't think they will get her.

They may get a actress who looks alot like Jay Hernandez who played El Diablo too.

He does not have clear native or black phenotype but he does not like white either.

[SecretWarrior]

I don't believe so. Comics saw a big boom in the mid-80s and early 90s, and a lot of people came into the hobby then. Jim Shooter was smart enough to lure many kids in with quality G.I. Joe and Transformers comics, and more mature comics were coming out for people who wanted them, like Watchmen. Indie-comics with a very different flavor were starting to spring up like Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and Cerebus, and superstars like McFarlane, Liefeld, and Lee caused a ton of enthusiasm among fans and brought in even more people. Some of those people are still in the hobby today. Generally speaking, they're probably in their 40s now. And you still have some people today that were reading all the way back in the 70s. I think U.S. comics primarily appeal to these sorts. Sure, younger people get into the hobby, too, but they can easily check out something like Geoff Johns' Green Lantern, because it's there and people will probably tell them to, and that will likely not endear them to John Stewart.

I lived in Manhattan 3 years ago, the readership at Forbidden Planet was mostly 20s-30s. I wonder if that's different in other locations.

[SecretWarrior]

Yeah i think we getting of topic here but i think this is an issue that need to be address in another thread when it comes to latinos and phenotype and who is white or not but me let say this.

So are saying jessic cruz is really a white latino and not brown because you think she look racially like barry allen.
Don't say that in latino dc thread because folks will be coming after you.
Fire looks more white then jessica and she is called brown and to many she does even look white still.

Jessica in comics look more like these women.


Becky G

They look brown like her,not white.
Racially she looks different then barry allen and so do these women above.


Other women that looks jessica look closer too are
Eiza Gonzalez
https://i.pinimg.com/236x/a0/30/d1/a...k-eyebrows.jpg

Maybe Diane Guerrero,they voice of jessica cruz in one of dc animated movies.
She is in doom patrol so i don't think they will get her.

They may get a actress who looks alot like Jay Hernandez who played El Diablo too.

He does not have clear native or black phenotype but he does not like white either.

They are white Hispanics in the same way southern Italians are non-white Hispanics. They may have some Native ancestry, but they are phenotypically and racially white. It's just Betty vs Veronica.

Do they face discrimination for not looking Anglo, Germanic, or Scandinavian? Yes, but they are in fact white.

Brazilians and other central and South Americans would classify them as White.

Again, what does this have to do with DC's trend regarding black characters?

[El_Gato]

She looks like she has as much native or African brownness as Ariana Grande, i.e. a tan, and no one would call her black. Let me know when she has afro-texture hair or recognizably native facial features. Those wouldn't be in keeping with previous illustrations of the character though. Again, when the movie is translated for Brazil or Japan, they're not going to racially distinguish her from Barry Allen.

DC has a consistent track record with Black characters, so I'm not surprised by what they're doing. This has been going on forever and extends to all of DC's flavors of the month. It's just funny now that we're in [current year].

Reminds me of how during the New year 52 they tried to get rid of Wally as main Flash and undercut his prominence by introducing Wallace, probably hoping black fans would attack Wally OGs for wanting the character to look like he did everywhere else rather than be relegated to the secondary status of black bff. I mean, if DC really cares about promoting equality, then why not make Barry Allen black? Why not make Arthur Curry Polynesian?



Also reminds me of how DC planned to kill off John right after they introduced Baz, probably to undercut anyone from arguing that you know who should be central GL. That blew up on them pretty badly, but unlike with the Dick Grayson death rumors, John didn't later get a push.

Not looking for a character who's rendered brown only when it's convenient. Thanks.

Probably has to do with the fact artists don’t know how to depict Native features, but even then a lot of Natives have features that are supposed to be “White features” like the Pacifid or Margid types. Either way Jessica is diverse and would not be mistaken for a White Woman. She stands out next to Diana, Harley and Dinah...etc

[mace11]

They white Hispanics in the same way southern Italians are non-white Hispanics. They may have some Native ancestry, but they are phenotypically and racially white. It's just Betty vs Veronica.

Do they face discrimination for not looking Anglo, Germanic, or Scandinavian? Yes, but they are in fact white.

Brazilians and other central and South Americans would classify them as White.

Again, what does this have to do with DC's trend regarding black characters?

Okay i think i know where you coming from.
Near white folks to you look like whites.
Now there are some that could either way but i don't jessica and the women above look white.
They latino actress on doom patrol does not really look near white to me by the way.
She clearly looks like a poc.

[SecretWarrior]

Okay i think i know where you coming from.
Near white folks to you look like whites.
Now there are some that could either way but i don't jessica and the women above look white.
They latino actress on doom patrol does not really look near white to me by the way.
She clearly looks like a poc.

Please define white for me. I'd like to know if your definition matches censuses in North, Central, and South America.

How would you phenotypically classify Superman, Batman, or Wonder Woman?

Antonio Banderas is Spanish and White, not Latin, yet he plays White Latinos like Zorro without a fuss for a reason.

[mace11]

Either way Jessica is diverse and would not be mistaken for a White Woman. She stands out next to Diana, Harley and Dinah...etc

I agree.
By the way some native americans look racially brown and not asian looking.
The female actress playing dani in the upcoming new mutants is called white by some but she really looks racially intermediate but has a near white look.
I would say she is racially brown.
If a person does not have a clear native/asian(mongolid) or black phenotype but does not look white either,i put them in the intermediate race group.
They range in varied features and skin tone,some looking near white,some looking near black or in middle or some could go either way.
Jessica cruz,kamala khan,america chavez,the actor who plays ghost rider on aos,and ghost rider robbie in 616 marvel are good examples.
Godspeed in dc comics would be another example of a brown latino.

[mace11]

Please define white for me. I'd like to know if your definition matches censuses in North, Central, and South America.

How would you phenotypically classify Superman, Batman, or Wonder Woman?

Which superman,batman or wonder woman?
They are black,latino and east asian versions of these characters too.

[SecretWarrior]

The most marketed versions.

Which superman,batman or wonder woman?
They are black,latino and east asian versions of these characters too.

I think all three can be played by White Hispanics like Jessica. If telenovella actors and actresses sent in headshots for these roles, many would qualify for an audition if the focus was on looks. Many would look more right for these roles than some who have previously been cast in them.

I don't see what any of this has to do with DC's track record with black characters.

[mace11]

The most marketed versions.





I think all three can be played by White Hispanics like Jessica. If telenovella actors and actresses sent in headshots for these roles, many would qualify for an audition if the focus was on looks.

I don't see what any of this has to do with DC's track record with black characters.

The three above are white,and so is gal by the way.
Of course i had another debate with someone saying gal was really brown and not white.
She is white.
Jessica cruz is not white or native/asian looking or black looking latino.

Oh the reason i replied to this because you mention jessica was a white latino,so that is what i chose to reply to you about even if what you said was off topic and my reply to you was off topic.

[SecretWarrior]

The three above are white,and so is gal by the way.
Of course i had another debate with someone saying gal was really brown and not white.
She is white.
Jessica cruz is not white or native/asian looking or black looking latino.

Oh the reason i replied to this because you mention jessica was a white latino,so that is what i chose to reply to you about even if what you said was off topic and my reply to you was off topic.

Is Ariana Grande white?

Without any knowledge of her background, could she serve as a visual model for Jessica Cruz?

[mace11]

Is Ariana Grande white?

Without any knowledge of her background, could she serve as a visual model for Jessica Cruz?

Currently no,but i heard she may have had changes overtime(making herself different etc..)
If not then no,her current self does not look white.
I am not clear how she looked when she started out however.
I need to see more pics.
By the way she is partly from southern italy,so we have keep that mind.
Some southern Italians do not look white by the way.

[SecretWarrior]

Currently no,but i heard she may have had changes overtime(making herself different etc..)
If not then no,her current self does not look white.
I am not clear how she looked when she started out however.
I need to see more pics.
By the way she is partly from southern italy,so we have keep that mind.
Some southern Italians do not look white by the way.

Southern Italians are white. White is more than Anglo, Germanic, and Scandinavian.

And DC is still doing a bad job with Black characters in [current year].