Thor Odinson: God of Thunder Appreciation 2020

[Frontier]

To be honest Ewing never struck me as the type who would have a team job to hype up his own characters (especially with Thor of all people) but maybe he couldn't resist with The Hulk...

But, yeah, count me in the camp that thinks Thor shouldn't really be on the Avengers right now. Beyond my own issues with how he's been depicted on the team, there are enough story reasons to explain why he shouldn't be on the team right now.

[Sunny]

To be honest Ewing never struck me as the type who would have a team job to hype up his own characters (especially with Thor of all people) but maybe he couldn't resist with The Hulk...

But, yeah, count me in the camp that thinks Thor shouldn't really be on the Avengers right now. Beyond my own issues with how he's been depicted on the team, there are enough story reasons to explain why he shouldn't be on the team right now.

I thought he retired? Wasn't that in the first issue of his solo? What, he didnt like the pension package and went back to work

[Frontier]

Thor #11 preview.

[Intothevoid]

I never liked the idea of Thor getting OF like this because it will create this kind of problems where most writers will ignore it.

Btw, good on Ewing for using Avengers as hype tools again.

His boner for Hulk is unmatched.

I mean Ewing has made his views clear on Hulk, that in a straight up brawl no one can beat him, that's just how he sees it so he tries to have Hulk be weakened all the time or for his enemies to use things that give them an advantage like acid that stops healing factor or exploiting his weakness to Sunlight etc...

I don't think it's because he has a boner for Hulk, i think it has more to do with he just doesn't really care at all about the battle stuff much, he just views it as it is and moves on with it. I mean he had Thing beat Hulk up into a crying state, if he had such a boner for Hulk, he would have had him crush Thing after losing to him in the FF book.

[GodThor]

To be honest Ewing never struck me as the type who would have a team job to hype up his own characters (especially with Thor of all people) but maybe he couldn't resist with The Hulk...

pretty much.

it's whatever tbh.

don't really care about his writing when it comes to Thor and his mythology anyway.

I thought he retired? Wasn't that in the first issue of his solo? What, he didnt like the pension package and went back to work

I think that was temporarily.

either way, he shouldn't really be here.

[The Cool Thatguy]

I mean Ewing has made his views clear on Hulk, that in a straight up brawl no one can beat him, that's just how he sees it so he tries to have Hulk be weakened all the time or for his enemies to use things that give them an advantage like acid that stops healing factor or exploiting his weakness to Sunlight etc...

I don't think it's because he has a boner for Hulk, i think it has more to do with he just doesn't really care at all about the battle stuff much, he just views it as it is and moves on with it. I mean he had Thing beat Hulk up into a crying state, if he had such a boner for Hulk, he would have had him crush Thing after losing to him in the FF book.

At the end of the day, Hulk will always enjoy a certain disposition in that he simply cannot be beaten in combat. He's an anti-hero, usually on the wrong side of the law.

If someone on the right side of the law could beat him with an effort that could be duplicated, then internal logic would dictate that they do that all the time, every time.

So regardless of the writer, there will always be some degree of PIS when it comes to Hulk fights

[Intothevoid]

At the end of the day, Hulk will always enjoy a certain disposition in that he simply cannot be beaten in combat. He's an anti-hero, usually on the wrong side of the law.

If someone on the right side of the law could beat him with an effort that could be duplicated, then internal logic would dictate that they do that all the time, every time.

So regardless of the writer, there will always be some degree of PIS when it comes to Hulk fights

I wouldn't say he can't be beaten in combat, it's just that it's very difficult to do so in a straight up brawl but less difficult once more hax gets involved.

There are plenty of anti-heroes in comics that can be beaten by just about anyone, the reason Hulk is different is not because his status as an anti-hero would be shaken but he was made that way by design, he was one of the strongest beings in Marvel back in the day, hell there is even a writer/editor note from Marvel where they openly admit when it comes to raw physical strength Hulk has more of it than characters like Juggernaut, Ego, Destroyer, Uatu, etc... Such raw physical power coupled with a being whose sole instinct is to rage is very hard to contain.

Honestly after reading Hulk for so long i still don't get where this "PIS" some people talk about comes from, CIS i would agree with although that's kinda natural, characters make bad decision in comics as in real life all the time, so it's not unusual to me when i see someone like Doctor Strange opting not to just BFR Hulk to another dimension when he could so do so easily, but when it comes to PIS i am just not seeing it. Apart from Hulks broken strength, he is downright unkillable, even before this Immortal Hulk retcon, his healing factor was among the best in Marvel, his resistance to things is also probably better than any character on his level, from heat to cold to molecular/atomic manipulation to soul manipulation to even time and reality warping which verges on being downright stupid, although Jim Starlin did say it best that the most dangerous thing about Hulk is just how STUPID his strength can get, where he does stupid things like punch through time.

I just think people are disposed to look down on "brick" type characters, despite there being very powerful bricks out there that could beat whole teams of complex superheroes like Juggernaut, Doomsday, Mangog, Shaggy, etc...

I think once people start to view Hulk the same way writers in comics do, as an unstoppable force of nature, everything becomes much easier to understand, it's not PIS, it's how the character was designed to be from the get go. Hulks been fighting the Avengers and other teams of heroes for decades now, it's actually fairly consistent for the character and consistency is the opposite of PIS.

Anyway enough about Hulk, this is a Thor thread, one thing i do agree is that it seems everyone else except for Cates ignores that Thor has the OF now, well Aaron doesn't really ignore it but he writes Thor so poorly you would think he either doesn't understand the OF or thinks very lowly of it.

[The Cool Thatguy]

I wouldn't say he can't be beaten in combat, it's just that it's very difficult to do so in a straight up brawl but less difficult once more hax gets involved.

There are plenty of anti-heroes in comics that can be beaten by just about anyone, the reason Hulk is different is not because his status as an anti-hero would be shaken but he was made that way by design, he was one of the strongest beings in Marvel back in the day, hell there is even a writer/editor note from Marvel where they openly admit when it comes to raw physical strength Hulk has more of it than characters like Juggernaut, Ego, Destroyer, Uatu, etc... Such raw physical power coupled with a being whose sole instinct is to rage is very hard to contain.

Honestly after reading Hulk for so long i still don't get where this "PIS" some people talk about comes from, CIS i would agree with although that's kinda natural, characters make bad decision in comics as in real life all the time, so it's not unusual to me when i see someone like Doctor Strange opting not to just BFR Hulk to another dimension when he could so do so easily, but when it comes to PIS i am just not seeing it. Apart from Hulks broken strength, he is downright unkillable, even before this Immortal Hulk retcon, his healing factor was among the best in Marvel, his resistance to things is also probably better than any character on his level, from heat to cold to molecular/atomic manipulation to soul manipulation to even time and reality warping which verges on being downright stupid, although Jim Starlin did say it best that the most dangerous thing about Hulk is just how STUPID his strength can get, where he does stupid things like punch through time.

I just think people are disposed to look down on "brick" type characters, despite there being very powerful bricks out there that could beat whole teams of complex superheroes like Juggernaut, Doomsday, Mangog, Shaggy, etc...

I think once people start to view Hulk the same way writers in comics do, as an unstoppable force of nature, everything becomes much easier to understand, it's not PIS, it's how the character was designed to be from the get go. Hulks been fighting the Avengers and other teams of heroes for decades now, it's actually fairly consistent for the character and consistency is the opposite of PIS.

Anyway enough about Hulk, this is a Thor thread, one thing i do agree is that it seems everyone else except for Cates ignores that Thor has the OF now, well Aaron doesn't really ignore it but he writes Thor so poorly you would think he either doesn't understand the OF or thinks very lowly of it.

The PIS comes in oh so many people trying overpower THE HULK.

Rarely does anyone use any tactics against Hulk other than punching. Nothing to drain his gamma energy, nothing about exploiting his healing factor, etc.

I've been a marvel fan for decades, and I can only remember a handful of times when people fought the Hulk with tactics other than 'Attack attack attack'. Always by those not in Hulk's weight class.

Hulk's situation demands that he be free more often than not. So anything that can take him down in a fight, few and far between and usually too terrible to reuse. Remember when Devil Hulk fought the Avengers, they had to use a space gun to bring him down (even though basic sun lamps did the job elsewhere), destroying a town in the process.

[Séb]

https://twitter.com/Marvel_FFightUS/...53610052583424

Next Marvel Future Fight update seems to be Thor focused. Hope his new uniform always brings a rework to his T3 skill.

[Intothevoid]

The PIS comes in oh so many people trying overpower THE HULK.

Rarely does anyone use any tactics against Hulk other than punching. Nothing to drain his gamma energy, nothing about exploiting his healing factor, etc.

I've been a marvel fan for decades, and I can only remember a handful of times when people fought the Hulk with tactics other than 'Attack attack attack'. Always by those not in Hulk's weight class.

Hulk's situation demands that he be free more often than not. So anything that can take him down in a fight, few and far between and usually too terrible to reuse. Remember when Devil Hulk fought the Avengers, they had to use a space gun to bring him down (even though basic sun lamps did the job elsewhere), destroying a town in the process.

spoilers:

That has more to do with CIS, a lot of super heroes want to prove themselves, like i can understand that it's dumb for someone like Ironman to engage Hulk in a brawl but for guys like Thor or Gladiator or Sentry it's also a matter of pride, you want to be the top dog, more importantly you believe yourself to be the top dog. There are like dozens and dozens of examples of people trying to drain his gamma or trying to overcome his healing, that goes back to what i was saying he has high resistances to all of these, Hulk has resisted being drained for 7 hours by being that drain entire stars, has resisted being drained by Loebforce Rulk, resisted being drained by Rogue, resisted being drained by the Kree who in the same comic drained Surfer, Strange and Namor of their powers, etc... Even with healing, several times it has been turned off by others in some way only for him to find a way to overcome it, hell it happened recently in the IH series where they used acid that stops his healing. But that's the thing, the character is extremely resistant to all of these things, so it's not as easy as just going up to him and taking away his gamma and now Hulk is powerless. It works sometimes for sure but there are plenty of times it doesn't, so literally nothing stops a writer(other their laziness and unimaginative nature) to just bring out all these things and have each and every one of them fail against Hulk. I like both Hulk and Thor and when people tell me Thor should just use Godblast on Hulk and be done with it... I mean i don't know if you wanna see that happen, because if it happened in a Thor book, it would more than likely work, if it happened in a Hulk book it probably wouldn't even if it vaporizes most of Hulk, the writer could just have him heal and then Hulk just overcame Thors greatest trump card and i don't want that to happen. Yet people are so confident than all of these things can work when the character has feats to give any writer reasonable leeway to him surviving just about anything and you wouldn't be able to call it PIS either because guess what someone can just point to the fact that Hulk got pretty much vaporized at the end of issue 35 and came back in literally moments like nothing had happened. That's kinda every fight in Marvel, i don't remember many real tactics being used in fights, 90% of the time it's just characters piling in on each other, this is hardly a problem unique to Hulk but more endemic on writers lacking any and all creativity when it comes to their fights and resorting to the Dragon Ball level of mindless fighting, that unfortunately also seems to be the most popular, people wanna see others just throw punches at each other endlessly. The problem is they didn't know if those Sun lamps by themselves would work, also that was done not because of Hulk himself but to serve the story, Ewing clearly wanted to show that the heroes can and often do, go too far in taking down a threat. So that issue actually had more to do with the Avengers than the Hulk, Ewing even did an interview where he specifically asks, just how far are the heroes willing to go, to stop the Hulk. The answer is pretty far, also the whole space laser thing was a theory as they were not certain what effect it would have on Hulk if any at all and they were kinda in a desperate situation there to begin with. Not to mention that Sun weakness is imposed there by the writer, it's not a weakness Hulk carries with him all the time it's specifically given in this series to make it easier for others to take down a character that Ewing pretty much views as unstoppable otherwise.

end of spoilers