Thor Odinson: God of Thunder Appreciation 2020

[Intothevoid]

I think people need to let go what happened many decades ago, whether Thor was bulletproof or not, doesn't really matter, he is now. Hell i remember Hulk had literally no healing factor back in those times but nowadays he has one of the most broken healing factors in Marvel, things change and evolve.

Even though Stan himself wrote the instance above where Thor cant be hurt even by atomic blast, he also wrote this



and this



So not even back then were comics that consistent nor did writers care that much about power levels as we'd like to think, so just leave it at that and move on, you can't change the past.

[Cronus]

I think people need to let go what happened many decades ago, whether Thor was bulletproof or not, doesn't really matter, he is now. Hell i remember Hulk had literally no healing factor back in those times but nowadays he has one of the most broken healing factors in Marvel, things change and evolve.

Even though Stan himself wrote the instance above where Thor cant be hurt even by atomic blast, he also wrote this



and this



So not even back then were comics that consistent nor did writers care that much about power levels as we'd like to think, so just leave it at that and move on, you can't change the past.

To be fair, the first scan is ambiguous which, as I understand from my conversation on this thread, was how Stan wanted it to be. But you have to agree there's a big difference between being knocked out by mortar shell and the scan of him just prior to this one enduring a nuclear level event.

I'm also not arguing that Mr. Busiek's interpretation is wrong (if you actually read the prior discussion pages ago)...I'm saying I prefer the other interpretation.

I just don't see why that is causing such a tremendous stir...

[Kurt Busiek]

I understand you were responding to another poster, but took your comments to mean "in general", as in directed to "angry Thor fans with Superman envy" (I'm paraphrasing).

You said in the post I linked to that you assumed it was a response to you. I pointed out that it wasn't. Not to you, not about you, not to Thor fans in general.

With respect, it's your interpretation on Thor's "bullet immunity" (or lack thereof...?) that I disagree with.

And you're welcome to. I do wish you wouldn't claim I was rude to you when I wasn't talking to or about you, or claim that I insist that my perspective on the matter is the only correct one.

It's the one I have, so when asked about it, it's the one I describe. But you're certainly not required to agree with it.

I wish you continued success.

Thanks.

kdb

[charliehustle415]

So you're saying writers never get it wrong?

Ah, you got me.

Aaron got it so wrong that he wrote Thor for 7 years and changed the face of the mythos completely and now they are making a multimillion dollar film based on his stories.

I apologize for assuming critical & commercial acclaim was getting it right

[Cronus]

Ah, you got me.

Aaron got it so wrong that he wrote Thor for 7 years and changed the face of the mythos completely and now they are making a multimillion dollar film based on his stories.

I apologize for assuming critical & commercial acclaim was getting it right

Oh, I see. Money makes right? Got it.

The Lord of The Rings Trilogy was a HUGE commercial success, but I'm pretty sure that wasn't true to the books either.

See, this is the Thor Appreciation Thread. Often times, in order to actually enjoy the books churned out, impediments to said enjoyment, like propping up Jane Thor (=Mary Sue), while painting Thor, as one poster termed it, a drunken red neck....need to be removed.

But thanks for the insight.

[Cronus]

You said in the post I linked to that you assumed it was a response to you. I pointed out that it wasn't. Not to you, not about you, not to Thor fans in general. And you're welcome to.

Thank you for that Mr. Busiek. You can see why I might've drawn that conclusion when you addressed a forum of Thor fans right? Especially more so, since I've made comparisons to Superman?

I do wish you wouldn't claim I was rude to you when I wasn't talking to or about you,

Well, hopefully you understand in the link I posted why I might draw that conclusion. When you said this, "but some people have Superman-envy about Thor, and don't want Superman to be able to do anything that Thor can't approximate". You later apologized to the poster for "the snark". I'm glad you clarified it wasn't me. I would hate for you think that I was one of the people you were describing in that way.

or claim that I insist that my perspective on the matter is the only correct one.

As I said here....

It appears I conflated an online interview I read of yours from a number of years ago with recent comments on this thread.

A retraction. An apology. Not sure what else you'd be looking for. I truly hope we can both move on.

It's the one I have, so when asked about it, it's the one I describe. But you're certainly not required to agree with it.

The funny thing is....I never asked you initially. You quoted another poster responding to me. Then you responded. You responding to his question would've made no sense unless my comment gave it the context it did. Nevertheless, thank you for giving me permission to have my own perspective. Much appreciated!

Thanks.

kdb

For what it's worth. And thanks again Mr. Busiek!

[Kurt Busiek]

Thank you for that Mr. Busiek. You can see why I might've drawn that conclusion when you addressed a forum of Thor fans right? Especially more so, since I've made comparisons to Superman?

Not really, no. I think when someone says "some X," they don't mean "all X" or even "that guy over there."

In any case, I hope you have a good evening.

kdb

[CaptainMar-Vell92 of the Kree]

Ah, you got me.

Aaron got it so wrong that he wrote Thor for 7 years and changed the face of the mythos completely and now they are making a multimillion dollar film based on his stories.

I apologize for assuming critical & commercial acclaim was getting it right

He changed the mythos for the worse. He turned the asgardians into a bunch of simpletons with a potty mouth that bow to a human nurse with no battle experience. And a movie centered around Aaron's waifu Fosthor is just another clue that the MCU should have ended with Endgame and that Feige doesn't get the character.

The Thor from EMH is still the best version of the character outside of the comics.

[CaptainMar-Vell92 of the Kree]

Oh, I see. Money makes right? Got it.

The Lord of The Rings Trilogy was a HUGE commercial success, but I'm pretty sure that wasn't true to the books either.

See, this is the Thor Appreciation Thread. Often times, in order to actually enjoy the books churned out, impediments to said enjoyment, like propping up Jane Thor (=Mary Sue), while painting Thor, as one poster termed it, a drunken red neck....need to be removed.

But thanks for the insight.

How the LOTR movies differ from the books aside for removing the Scourge of the Shire and Tom Bombadil?

The Hobbit movies on the other hand, yeah. What the heck was Jackson thinking?

[Cronus]

How the LOTR movies differ from the books aside for removing the Scourge of the Shire and Tom Bombadil?

A regular that frequents Rumbles once described some of the differences. They're more than I realized.

The Hobbit movies on the other hand, yeah. What the heck was Jackson thinking?

Right? Dont get me wrong, I enjoyed the movie mythos of both stories though.

[Wall-Crawler]

I find it wrong when Aaron supporters bring the word "success" to describe his run. If you look at actual numbers it was never a best selling book, it never outperformed previous runs, it stayed pretty much in line with what Thor has sold in the last two decades, not to mention his "War of the Realms" event was the worst selling Marvel event in the last two decades as well.

There is a difference between success and publicity, the latter which Aaron's run got in spades due to the sheer fact that we live in a politically correct/female empowerment era. Like many have said, Jane was never the problem, it was everyone around her acting bad, out of character, and a shell of their former selves in order to prop her up as the best thing in the world, but the constant complaints from the fanbase everywhere you look does tell you where his run stands in the eyes of the fanbase, with half of them placing him as the best, and half of them placing him as the worst.

I personally have voiced how MANY parts of his run does show greatness and excellent storytelling coupled with good ideas, and even some of the bad parts are only bad because he is ignoring previous canon, if this was a creator owned story I'd be praising the hell out of it, but it isn't, he disrespected every single aspect of the Thor mythos, and then there are the parts that are simply really bad and cringeworthy.

What I despise the most though, is his petty attitude towards anyone who dares criticize him.

[Cronus]

Mmm one would expect after some writers have spent years in the industry a certain amount of criticism is expected.

Does anyone else feel like other characters' fanbase is treated with more respect, like...writers and editors actually listen to the fans and acquiesce to their wishes a little more?

[Wall-Crawler]

Mmm one would expect after some writers have spent years in the industry a certain amount of criticism is expected.

Does anyone else feel like other characters' fanbase is treated with more respect, like...writers and editors actually listen to the fans and acquiesce to their wishes a little more?

Aaron doesn't like criticism and attacks anyone who dares doing so.

No, not really, one thing that I'd really like to change is this feeling of persecution the Thor fanbase seems to have, modern writers don't hate Thor, Marvel isn't out to ruin him, quite the contrary, as I have mentioned many times in the past, Thor's franchise is very strong and Marvel sees the potential in it, having based 3 linewide events in this last decade alone on his franchise, being one of the top players, difference maker, and main character in the others.

Now, does that mean he hasn't been mishandled ? Of course he has, there have been many questionable decisions done with him, as has happened with many characters, in fact, many of those mishandlings have happened due to the massive exposure Thor has been getting, he's gotten so popular that he guest stars in many books, half of them he does great stuff, and the other half he is really bad (Aaron and Ewing, please stop using Thor), but I doubt there is some evil scheme or conspiracy on Marvel to ruin Thor, we gotta leave this feeling of persecution behind. This is just a phase, as was the 90s where many people didn't like the direction Marvel was headed and thought they could never recover and they recovered. Thor has been through a rough patch since 2012, but I believe he is getting back up and will come back stronger than ever, with the newfound popularity he has gained and solidified as an A-Lister and one of Marvel's biggest players.

My biggest concern right now is honestly the MCU with what they did to him in Endgame and what will happen in Love and Thunder, I am terrified that they will follow Aaron's path and step all over Thor to make Jane look better. This movie will probably define how the general audience sees Thor for many years to come, so you can see why I am very worried about it.

[Cronus]

Aaron doesn't like criticism and attacks anyone who dares doing so.

Honestly, it's the worst I've seen.

No, not really, one thing that I'd really like to change is this feeling of persecution the Thor fanbase seems to have, modern writers don't hate Thor, Marvel isn't out to ruin him, quite the contrary, as I have mentioned many times in the past, Thor's franchise is very strong and Marvel sees the potential in it, having based 3 linewide events in this last decade alone on his franchise, being one of the top players, difference maker, and main character in the others.

IDK about persecution, just not valued as much as others maybe?

Now, does that mean he hasn't been mishandled ? Of course he has, there have been many questionable decisions done with him, as has happened with many characters, in fact, many of those mishandlings have happened due to the massive exposure Thor has been getting, he's gotten so popular that he guest stars in many books, half of them he does great stuff, and the other half he is really bad (Aaron and Ewing, please stop using Thor), but I doubt there is some evil scheme or conspiracy on Marvel to ruin Thor, we gotta leave this feeling of persecution behind. This is just a phase, as was the 90s where many people didn't like the direction Marvel was headed and thought they could never recover and they recovered. Thor has been through a rough patch since 2012, but I believe he is getting back up and will come back stronger than ever, with the newfound popularity he has gained and solidified as an A-Lister and one of Marvel's biggest players.

Well, I like your optimism. And I'm hopeful for what Cates is doing.

My biggest concern right now is honestly the MCU with what they did to him in Endgame and what will happen in Love and Thunder, I am terrified that they will follow Aaron's path and step all over Thor to make Jane look better. This movie will probably define how the general audience sees Thor for many years to come, so you can see why I am very worried about it.

I dont like it either. I'm just hoping it doesn't bleed back into the comic book. As long as the current marvel comic universe remains separate from the MCU, I can live with whatever nutty story they come up with in Love and Thunder. I also hate they borrowed from one my favorite Thor arcs (Blood and Thunder).

If I'm being really pessimistic, I'd say Aaron's Jane Thor is a deliberate attempt to shake loose the old Thor fan base and make way for a new generation of readers.

[Wall-Crawler]

IDK about persecution, just not valued as much as others maybe?

Not really, if companies and writers listened to every wish the fanbase had, there would be no stories to tell and challenge the reader, no acclaimed stories or disliked stories, there simply wouldn't be a place for the medium. Look at Spider-Man, the character with the second biggest fanbase (the first one being Batman) has been ignored for ten years, everyone has been asking for them to have Peter and Mary Jane with their marriage back and they have ignored that request for more than 10 years and only now are they in the path to solve it. In the meantime, we still got some great stories like Big Time, Spider Island, Dying Wish, Superior Spider-Man, Spider-Verse, Red Goblin, Spectacular Spider-Man and other countless acclaimed stories in between. Just because the fanbase doesn't get exactly what it wants doesn't mean they are not valued, there will always be great stories that won't exactly line up with what the fanbase asks.

Well, I like your optimism. And I'm hopeful for what Cates is doing.

Me too, so far Cates has been doing a really great job, the only thing I'd change is Thor's jerk-ish attitude, I really want the noble Thor back.

I dont like it either. I'm just hoping it doesn't bleed back into the comic book. As long as the current marvel comic universe remains separate from the MCU, I can live with whatever nutty story they come up with in Love and Thunder. I also hate they borrowed from one my favorite Thor arcs (Blood and Thunder).

I don't think it will bleed back into the comic book, whatever happens, but it will stil be viewed by millions and will affect the general perception of Thor, remember that the amount of people that watch the movies as opposed to the comic book fanbase are outnumbered a thousand to one, so please Taika, do a good job, I have faith thanks to Ragnarok.

If I'm being really pessimistic, I'd say Aaron's Jane Thor is a deliberate attempt to shake loose the old Thor fan base and make way for a new generation of readers.

Well, it did bring a ton of new fans to the book while alienating long time readers, but again, I don't think it was deliberate nor a conspiration to do that from the beginning, remember Jason Aaron began his Thor run with one of the greatest and most epic Thor stories, "The God Butcher".