Kate Kane: Batwoman Appreciation 2020

[Oberon]

No, but Kate had very good reasons for treating her that way. Namely, that she doesn't want Bette to be a vigilante.

To me, that was clear in 'face-value' but I often thought it could be for other reasons, that would never be filled out, addressed.

[Oberon]

but because of who Bette is.

So, after all these years, I have to ask YOU, Caivu, who is Bette? Not just to you, but in terms of Kate and or any other significance.

[Oberon]

I just always think there was something that should have been explored more. Pretty sure, on the surface, Bette is sort of another version of Kate's sister. As cousins, they probably had more going on in 'family terms' than Bruce would have with almost anyone, etc. I always felt that Jacob had a closer connection to Bette, especially after her injuries and near death - than her own "real" parents or family would have?

Hmmmm, now why do we know nothing about Bette's parents, a brother who would be Jacob's brother, right?

Hmmmm, now why did someone send 12 year old Bette to Gotham City where she met the original Batwoman, her aunt by marriage?

hmmmmm.

[Oberon]

My suspicion is that there's some level of discomfort over Bette also being Bruce's cousin, at least by implication since she's a Kane. This didn't matter in the first solo because it wasn't confirmed that Kate and Bruce were related. In fact at the start of the solo with Batman's intro, and his subsequent comments to Kate about having a sidekick, implies they didn't know each other at all.

Now with that retconned, and Kate and Bruce being cousins who having known each other since childhood - trying to fit Bette into that as well would require work. Now Beth tends to be ignored by Bruce too, but that's kinda expected as she's the embarrassing relative he doesn't want to talk about, and so far is exclusively part of Kate's Rogue's gallery. If they put in the work Bette's history etc could be cleared-up, but that hasn't happened yet.

For years I pondered this. I was not thrilled that Bruce and Kate (and Bette) were 1st cousins. I think the more natural / suspension of belief would be if they were 2nd cousins; ie; children of 1st cousins.

But recent years backstory says Martha was a sibling to Jacob, not a cousin. How to resolve?

They're all rich folks; maybe Martha's parent (forget who; Nathaniel?)

adopted his nephew, Jacob and what's his name father of bette. And raised them as SIBLINGS.

SO they're really and should know, cousins, but they were raised as siblings. Problem solved.

[Tsukiakari1203]

For years I pondered this. I was not thrilled that Bruce and Kate (and Bette) were 1st cousins. I think the more natural / suspension of belief would be if they were 2nd cousins; ie; children of 1st cousins.

But recent years backstory says Martha was a sibling to Jacob, not a cousin. How to resolve?

They're all rich folks; maybe Martha's parent (forget who; Nathaniel?)

adopted his nephew, Jacob and what's his name father of bette. And raised them as SIBLINGS.

SO they're really and should know, cousins, but they were raised as siblings. Problem solved.

i like them being first cousins.

[Oberon]

I'll settle if I have to. But I've heard a lot of fans do not. Facts or whatever change as they need to.

At one point Betty and/or Kathy were nearly out of actual canon, but now are, more or less. Morrison did that with INC, and his previous Batman work.

So, someday someone could do that or see that and use it for a story.

But being first cousins, is what clearly plays up the Soap Opera aspects, as I've long believed that comics and other serialized literature or stories are working from similar conventions, in terms of story-arcs and personalities and how they change over time.

[Restingvoice]

My suspicion is that there's some level of discomfort over Bette also being Bruce's cousin, at least by implication since she's a Kane. This didn't matter in the first solo because it wasn't confirmed that Kate and Bruce were related. In fact at the start of the solo with Batman's intro, and his subsequent comments to Kate about having a sidekick implies they didn't know each other at all.

Why would there be discomfort?

[Oberon]

I think the basic idea is 'over-related' means beyond coincidence, too flukey, whatever.

Which is why I'm calling for them to be 2nd cousins to Bruce, per my idea above.

See, it's cool if Batwoman is his cousin, but now it's diluted. Alice, Bette and who knows who else, is a cousin.

[Tsukiakari1203]

Why would there be discomfort?

I have no idea. They can be cousins but just say Bette grew up in California and only spent the summers in Gotham and primarily spent her time there with Nathan and Kathy. And that Bruce wasn't very interested in his little cousin

[Bat-Meal]

Why would there be discomfort?

Because it makes Bruce's family even bigger and seemingly editorial don't want to use Bette or a build a relationship between her and Bruce. Also, the way the family interactions with Bruce goes, especially the example of 'Trial of Batwoman', you'd think Kate was his only cousin (though we know why they don't talk about Beth, heh).

[Tsukiakari1203]

Because it makes Bruce's family even bigger and seemingly editorial don't want to use Bette or a build a relationship between her and Bruce. Also, the way the family interactions with Bruce goes, especially the example of 'Trial of Batwoman', you'd think Kate was his only cousin (though we know why they don't talk about Beth, heh).

Bette's doomed isn't she?

[Oberon]

Bette has been counted out before. I think I enjoyed Batwoman and her cast best, in the first volume, 2011, nu-DC as they say. Their world related to the Gotham stuff, but was a bit off-pace. I loved the supernatural stuff. But I realize that they could not create the whole series around that. The worst part was when editorial dictated that Kate could not marry. The best part was nearly everything else.

[Restingvoice]

Speaking of, they gotta stop naming people Katherine or Elizabeth
Katarina Netz
Katherine Kane
Catherine Hamilton
Catherine Van Derm
Elizabeth Netz
Elizabeth Kane
Mary Elizabeth Kane
Elizabeth Arkham
It's getting ridiculous

[Tsukiakari1203]

Speaking of, they gotta stop naming people Katherine or Elizabeth
Katarina Netz
Katherine Kane
Catherine Hamilton
Catherine Van Derm
Elizabeth Netz
Elizabeth Kane
Mary Elizabeth Kane
Elizabeth Arkham
It's getting ridiculous

Yeesh

Who's Elizabeth Netz?

Don't forget Mary Hamilton from Batwoman?

[Artemisfanboy]

Bette's doomed isn't she?

Not necessarily. While it's unlikely we're going to get a concerted Flamebird push, it still possible for her to appear. Her two most likely venues for showing up would be either Kate getting a new series(either a solo or team book would work) and for the writers choosing to involve Bette, or for her to show up as part of a large Titans reunion. Neither is inconceivable, but both of them need a solid relaunch before you can talk about Bette possibly getting involved.

Basically Bette has about as much as any chance she has of being used while she's in between appearances, only they shipped her to West Point instead of California to get her off-panel. Which isn't saying too much but there's still hope.