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  1. #316
    Astonishing Member manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Masterff View Post
    Kingdom Come Supermans Logo looks different.

    This Logo (red S with black background) is a logo which I only know from Conner and by Superman (who was wearing it around 2001).
    Jon was wearing the same logo design as clark of preflashpoint era was from the get go. I don't know what the issue is with it going black?
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 03-27-2020 at 11:44 PM.

  2. #317
    Astonishing Member sifighter's Avatar
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    You know what might help if we can compare them all, so hereís Titans of Tomorrow Conner, Kingdom come Superman, and DCeased Jon. I can only attach three images here so Iíve got to put Finch art in another post. I think itís best to compare from the interior art to Dead Planet, I think Finchís cover over did it on the design to look like Superman especially when the probable age for Jon after the 5 year time jump for Dead Planet is between Iím guessing 18 to very early 20ís.

    7F9620DF-7733-4225-8350-BB99640AF80A.jpg
    9ED3950E-B970-47A1-920D-E2E961862527.jpg
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    "It's fun and it's cool, so that's all that matters. It's what comics are for, Duh."
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  3. #318
    Astonishing Member sifighter's Avatar
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    "It's fun and it's cool, so that's all that matters. It's what comics are for, Duh."
    Words to live by.

  4. #319
    Astonishing Member manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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  5. #320
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    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    Jon was wearing the same logo design as clark of preflashpoint era was from the get go. I don't know what the issue is with it going black?
    Like I already said, I think it should remain unique to Conner and his part of the family (possible children etc.) AND its another thing which happened to Conner and now also to Jon.
    (friendship with Robin, the possibility to have other superpowers than Clark, the red S on black background, teaming up with Cassandra Sandsmark-as Wonder Woman in the future....)

    In fact I had doubts if its Jon or Conner, because the red S with black background reminded me of Conner and teaming up with Cassie also looked more like Conner than Jon.

  6. #321
    Astonishing Member manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Masterff View Post
    Like I already said, I think it should remain unique to Conner and his part of the family (possible children etc.) AND its another thing which happened to Conner and now also to Jon.
    Yeah! What if clark decides to go back to wearing black s? Dude! The black was Clark's in Pre-Flashpoint itself . His s was used from the get go by jon. Now that, just because yellow went black. You have a problem? why? its a goldenage motif used over and over again both in kingdom come, Pre-Flashpoint.. Etc. Superman is a zombie. Jon earned the title by keep superman from killing everyone long enough for green lanterns to return.Jon is Superman. It isn't a possible future or darK future. This is the present of another universe. Lois was narrating the extinction event in the last book.

    Conner has no specific owner ship on this logo. Jon ain't wearing the leather jacket, sunglasses and other things. This is standard superman stuff. It's fair game as a legacy, he is for the time being superboy or superman . Bendis made jon the legion member. Jon doesn't have other superpowers. The last thing i want is telekinesis for jon. Its basically same power as Manchester black.jon and damian might be robin and superboy but they are different from tim and conner. That is, they are supersons of superdads. Its the rivalry between the four(dads and sons) that keeps them going. Tim and conner are best friends. Jon and damian are brothers.They fight, they bicker, they compete, they support each other and with each other.

    As for cassie, jon and damian doesn't have a representation in their generation for a wonder woman. So, they chose cassie. Jon and Damian's relationship with her is up in the air. Tim was older than damian in the first issue. So, cassie might be older too.
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 03-29-2020 at 06:18 AM.

  7. #322
    Astonishing Member sifighter's Avatar
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    Hey!....let’s not forget Wallace now, the new DCeased-verse Flash. He managed to survive too, he should get some mention here

    In all seriousness though I think no matter what symbol Jon is wearing we should look forward to DCeased Dead Planet, it’s a so far well written world where Jon gets to be the new Superman because he stepped up as the world ended and that can’t be taken away. This is about as next generation justice league as we are gonna get with Jon, Damian, Cassie, and Wallace.

    Although, Jon’s probably gonna have a rough time in the sequel. Sure he will probably be fine against normal zombies, much like his father in the original. However unless she gets taken out in Unkillables then the zombie Wonder Woman is still very much a problem. Not to mention the possibility of golden sun zombie Superman showing up.
    "It's fun and it's cool, so that's all that matters. It's what comics are for, Duh."
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  8. #323
    Astonishing Member CPSparkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ascended View Post
    I don't know if it was intended to be a last hurrah, but if it had sold well then DC would've done more, regardless of what their original intentions might've been.



    As often as Metropolis gets blown up and rebuilt? It'd be a wonder if anybody *did* notice!
    DC cancelled the 1st series which had decent sales and ended the Supersons. A week or so after DC announced the cancellation Tomasi tweeted his disappointment with the Cancellation but told fans that while this was the end Supersons comic they were arranging a little something as a parting gift. some days later DC announced that they were going to release the Dyno mutt/Supersons story and a 12 issue maxi of the boys adventures from the past.

    The decision was already made and if it was sales then they wouldn't have cancelled the series which at the point of cancellation was doing better than more than half of the DC titles on Comichron and I'm not including the stuff like Mother panic, snaggle puss or Pearl.
    Titles that you generally don't expect great numbers from if you get what I mean.
    Selling well wasn't the problem. If it was Ric won't have lasted so long and Tomasi's Superson wouldn't have gotten cancelled

    Bendis and his contract details was. In an interview after his signing it was revealed that part of the sweetners to snare him was a certain amount of control above that normally given to writers along with other extras that we see with Wonder comics etc.
    Last edited by CPSparkles; 03-29-2020 at 07:14 AM.

  9. #324
    Astonishing Member CPSparkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue22 View Post
    Real Jon makes an appearance in the Robin Anniversary comic to talk about how awesome his best friend is.


    I miss this. So much. Dammit Tomasi, COME BACK!
    Jon's eyes. They always get me. So full of wonder and joy.
    I was a refreshing viewing the the world of Heroes through his eyes. Teen Jon afetr all his being through has matured and isn't so full of Wonder. He isn't as fun and refreshing to read. He's another DC hero.

    I miss kid Jon.

  10. #325
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    Quote Originally Posted by CPSparkles View Post
    DC cancelled the 1st series which had decent sales and ended the Supersons. A week or so after DC announced the cancellation Tomasi tweeted his disappointment with the Cancellation but told fans that while this was the end Supersons comic they were arranging a little something as a parting gift. some days later DC announced that they were going to release the Dyno mutt/Supersons story and a 12 issue maxi of the boys adventures from the past.

    The decision was already made and if it was sales then they wouldn't have cancelled the series which at the point of cancellation was doing better than more than half of the DC titles on Comichron and I'm not including the stuff like Mother panic, snaggle puss or Pearl.
    Titles that you generally don't expect great numbers from if you get what I mean.
    Selling well wasn't the problem. If it was Ric won't have lasted so long and Tomasi's Superson wouldn't have gotten cancelled

    Bendis and his contract details was. In an interview after his signing it was revealed that part of the sweetners to snare him was a certain amount of control above that normally given to writers along with other extras that we see with Wonder comics etc.
    Not to mention the fact that Adventures of the Super Sons was advertised as a maxi-series and had no variant covers to speak of. That set up doesn't lend itself to sales. Yet even so, Adventures of the Super Sons was doing a lot better than other titles in the same boat.
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  11. #326
    Mighty Member Blue22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sifighter View Post
    Hey!....let’s not forget Wallace now, the new DCeased-verse Flash. He managed to survive too, he should get some mention here
    I've disliked Wallace for as long as he's existed. So I try not to pay too much attention to him. Kinda forgot he survived the first series...and I kinda wish he hadn't. Give me Bart, instead XD

    Quote Originally Posted by CPSparkles View Post
    Jon's eyes. They always get me. So full of wonder and joy.
    I was a refreshing viewing the the world of Heroes through his eyes. Teen Jon afetr all his being through has matured and isn't so full of Wonder. He isn't as fun and refreshing to read. He's another DC hero.

    I miss kid Jon.
    Pretty much, all of this. I don't think Bendis and DC realized just how important Jon being a child was to him as a character. Something like his age seems trivial but in this case, it's the little things that are most important. It was important to what made the character so likable and unique. It gave a perspective into the hero world that we don't often see. Meanwhile teenage characters in this universe are a dime a dozen. And he just joined the largest group of them.

    Of course he'd have to age up eventually, but if he had gotten to do it naturally instead of that hyperbolic time chamber bullshit, we likely could have seen him grow and change to the point where an older version of himself would be more than just a generic teen at best and a Clark clone at worst. Plus it would, overall, be a lot less jarring.

    I've tried giving the Earth-3 impostor a chance. Both in Superman and in Legion. And...it's just not the same. He's not the same. All the charm and magic the character had before is gone and now he's just a superfluous teen member of a hero family that already has two WAY better teen/young adult characters (And I'm not thanking Bendis for Conner's return. It looked like he was already on his way back before the hostile takeover). Not helped at all by his slow transformation into teen Clark II. There's just...nothing special about him anymore.

    I don't know when Clark or Damian is supposed figure out that the real Jon is still stuck in space but...can they hurry up with that? XD
    Last edited by Blue22; 03-29-2020 at 12:31 PM.

  12. #327
    Astonishing Member sifighter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue22 View Post
    I've disliked Wallace for as long as he's existed. So I try not to pay too much attention to him. Kinda forgot he survived the first series...and I kinda wish he hadn't. Give me Bart, instead XD



    Pretty much, all of this. I don't think Bendis and DC realized just how important Jon being a child was to him as a character. Something like his age seems trivial but in this case, it's the little things that are most important. It was important to what made the character so likable and unique. It gave a perspective into the hero world that we don't often see. Meanwhile teenage characters in this universe are a dime a dozen. And he just joined the largest group of them.

    Of course he'd have to age up eventually, but if he had gotten to do it naturally instead of that hyperbolic time chamber bullshit, we likely could have seen him grow and change to the point where an older version of himself would be more than just a generic teen at best and a Clark clone at worst. Plus it would, overall, be a lot less jarring.

    I've tried giving the Earth-3 impostor a chance. Both in Superman and in Legion. And...it's just not the same. He's not the same. All the charm and magic the character had before is gone and now he's just a superfluous teen member of a hero family that already has two WAY better teen/young adult characters (And I'm not thanking Bendis for Conner's return. It looked like he was already on his way back before the hostile takeover). Not helped at all by his slow transformation into teen Clark II. There's just...nothing special about him anymore.

    I don't know when Clark or Damian is supposed figure out that the real Jon is still stuck in space but...can they hurry up with that? XD
    Unfortunately if Bart did exist from what I've seen from Good Day to die he probably went the way of Booster Gold where he ceased to exist, especially after the whole zombie Barry incident. Wallace is our zombie apocalypse Flash for now.

    As for Jon, I'm not saying I want to do away with Teen Jon in fact I'd be fine if both he and Damian stuck around at about a young-ish 14 or 15. However its a pretty easy fix, older Jon can jump in the Legions time machine and grabs his younger self before the black hole incident and puts him back in the present.
    "It's fun and it's cool, so that's all that matters. It's what comics are for, Duh."
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  13. #328
    Mighty Member Blue22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sifighter View Post
    As for Jon, I'm not saying I want to do away with Teen Jon in fact I'd be fine if both he and Damian stuck around at about a young-ish 14 or 15. However its a pretty easy fix, older Jon can jump in the Legions time machine and grabs his younger self before the black hole incident and puts him back in the present.
    I joke about the teen Jon being some Earth-3 counterpart that left the 11 year old Jon stranded there to take his life and have a fresh start somewhere else...but shit if they really wanted to go that route, they could.

    Have Earth-3 Jon feel remorseful about fucking over the real Jon. Then he teams up with Superman/the Legion/Damian/whatever to bring him back. They all go through some emotional bullshit and forgive him. He stays in the future with the legion, occasionally coming back to help with big threats, and real Jon stays in the present. Everyone wins.

    Wouldn't be the first time Bendis' bad choices have led to two versions of the same characters existing at the same time. It worked for X-Men...once Bendis was taken off of that series.

  14. #329
    Extraordinary Member Jackalope89's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue22 View Post
    I joke about the teen Jon being some Earth-3 counterpart that left the 11 year old Jon stranded there to take his life and have a fresh start somewhere else...but shit if they really wanted to go that route, they could.

    Have Earth-3 Jon feel remorseful about fucking over the real Jon. Then he teams up with Superman/the Legion/Damian/whatever to bring him back. They all go through some emotional bullshit and forgive him. He stays in the future with the legion, occasionally coming back to help with big threats, and real Jon stays in the present. Everyone wins.

    Wouldn't be the first time Bendis' bad choices have led to two versions of the same characters existing at the same time. It worked for X-Men...once Bendis was taken off of that series.
    That's the "theory" (my head canon) I've been putting forward. And real Jon is stuck in the daycare from hell on Earth 3, eating his least favorite foods, watching awful puppet shows, and keeping the "underground rebellion" alive (like being sent to timeout). Think PG rated Apokolips.

  15. #330
    Spectacular Member Knightsilver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackalope89 View Post
    That's the "theory" (my head canon) I've been putting forward. And real Jon is stuck in the daycare from hell on Earth 3, eating his least favorite foods, watching awful puppet shows, and keeping the "underground rebellion" alive (like being sent to timeout). Think PG rated Apokolips.
    I think a retcon of some kind to bring back kid Jon is inevitable. Teen Jon hasn't really caught on,and Bendis isn't exactly setting the sales charts on fire on any book,so restoring popular elements that he got rid of is their best bet.

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