Jon Kent: Superboy Appreciation 2020

[Korath]

No he's an on the rack version of a young Clark who does nothing but look around like an idiot while a bunch of random shit pops off and he just tries to keep up. Crushed by who his dad is my butt, what you label as "enduring Earth 3" is him not even acknowledging what should be a traumatic experience for being tortured for who nows how long in a Volcano by a man who looks exactly like his dad down to every cell simply cause Bendis can't even keep up with his own plot. He has no personality, charisma, substance of any kind and was shoved into some basic romance straight out of a YA novel for shock value. If you like the character that's fine but let's be factual now grass growing is more interesting than teen Jon.

You're entilted to your opinion.

I think you're absolutely wrong about everything you just wrote, of course, but it's your right to feel the way you do.

I just hope that if (when?) Kid Jon will return, it won't mean that the far better teen version will have to be destroyed.

[Journey]

You're entilted to your opinion.

I think you're absolutely wrong about everything you just wrote, of course, but it's your right to feel the way you do.

I just hope that if (when?) Kid Jon will return, it won't mean that the far better teen version will have to be destroyed.

And you're entitled to your opinion that being said I hope Teen Jon is wiped from memory never to be seen or heard from again cause he's brought nothing to the character in over a year and 1/2 of content IMO.

[Jackalope89]

And you're entitled to your opinion that being said I hope Teen Jon is wiped from memory never to be seen or heard from again cause he's brought nothing to the character in over a year and 1/2 of content IMO.

He did bring one thing; loathing for how he's been handled since Tomasi and Jurgens were forced off. Bendis did absolutely nothing for the character. Even the things in Bendis' own story that SHOULD have had SOME impact, were merely brushed off. Instead, Bendis just makes him Clark 1.5.

[manwhohaseverything]

...Awkward around bland psychic girls, I guess? I don't know. Aside from that poorly written exchange before the world's most awkwardly drawn kiss, I don't really see anything in this Jon that I wouldn't see in a young Clark. Or even current Clark. So I'll give props to Future State Jon, at least. He's...definitely not his old man.

He has a phobia about closed spaces and being trapped. He has alien tech and gadgets on his suit. He has a huge appetite and thinks about bathroom, poop.. Etc jokes all the time. He uses wierd alien sounds sometime in between talks. Other than that, he is clark kent from 1950's.As for damian being defanged its a bunch of nonsense. Its like saying superman was defanged from action comics 1930's with max fleischer cartoon. There is such a thing as demographics to target. Batbooks, titans... Etc are aimed at a different demographics. So, the character is put in limitations in things like supersons. Superman went from smashing cars and beating up the corrupt to pulling a train as working class man. But, as long as the concept and characterisation is intact everything is fine for me. As if superman smashes the klan should or must have something for older audiences.

Also, Damian - a batbrat deserved every bit of the punch he got from superboy after all the decades of jobbing and being turned into the villain for a character that basically ripped of superman.

As for what teen jon brought, it was transition. If teen jon gives me silverage sun god man of tomorrow who has been missing since 1980's.I am all for it. Just lose the postcrisis ma! Pa! Nonsense and postcrisis naive farmboy clark kent personality. I am sold. This is effing man of tomorrow. He is back. Alan moore doesn't have to wonder anymore.

And it cements why it's a Fake Damian in Supersons and why Jon is detrimental to a far more interesting character...

I really hate Kid Jon, even more now.

Good! Good! Let the hate rise!

[Light of Justice]

Also, Damian - a batbrat deserved every bit of the punch he got from superboy after all the decades of jobbing and being turned into the villain for a character that basically ripped of superman.

Wait, I don't understand. You're saying that Damian is ripped of superman? I often see Damian being called rip of Jason Todd, Cassandra Cain, or Conner Kent, but never Superman. What makes you think that?

As for what teen jon brought, it was transition. If teen jon gives me silverage sun god man of tomorrow who has been missing since 1980's.I am all for it. Just lose the postcrisis ma! Pa! Nonsense and postcrisis naive farmboy clark kent personality. I am sold. This is effing man of tomorrow. He is back. Alan moore doesn't have to wonder anymore.

I don't mind his sun god man of tomorrow portrayal, but I will like it more if we have some sort of development journey instead of instant story 7 years on space that was resumed on 3-4 issues. Never a fan of instant boost, even on my favourite character. And yes, throw the positive naivety away into the deepest ocean. He's also Lois's kid for Rao's sake.

Good! Good! Let the hate rise!

I assumed that you hate Supersons portrayal of Jon? if so you should read this analysis https://hiranayuki.tumblr.com/post/1...r-sons-yet/amp. For me I prefer Jurgens Jon that more like "So dad, you are actually Superman? Can you tell it to me before those soldiers barged into our home and made me realized that I am super powered being myself?" than Tomasi's Jon who's more like "Wow, cool, my dad is Superman *thumbs up*". Not that I hate Tomasi's Jon though.

[manwhohaseverything]

Wait, I don't understand. You're saying that Damian is ripped of superman? I often see Damian being called rip of Jason Todd, Cassandra Cain, or Conner Kent, but never Superman. What makes you think that?


I don't mind his sun god man of tomorrow portrayal, but I will like it more if we have some sort of development journey instead of instant story 7 years on space that was resumed on 3-4 issues. Never a fan of instant boost, even on my favourite character. And yes, throw the positive naivety away into the deepest ocean. He's also Lois's kid for Rao's sake.


I assumed that you hate Supersons portrayal of Jon? if so you should read this analysis https://hiranayuki.tumblr.com/post/1...r-sons-yet/amp. For me I prefer Jurgens Jon that more like "So dad, you are actually Superman? Can you tell it to me before those soldiers barged into our home and made me realized that I am super powered being myself?" than Tomasi's Jon who's more like "Wow, cool, my dad is Superman *thumbs up*". Not that I hate Tomasi's Jon though.

No, As a batcharacter which is a variant of either a) bruce wayne - batman or b) dick grayson - robin . These guys are all variants of superman the first superhero or a vigilante who wore the skin tight suit and fought the corrupt, had the double identity, physical abilities ... Etc. Superman is the original concept. Batman is a superman variant. Every batcharacter is a batman or robin variant even the female batgirls, womans.. Etc

Superman is like a good joke. If you need to explain everything then the joke isn't doing its job of laughter. There is a reason all star does "doomed planet, desperate scientist, last hope, kindly couple...etc".The idea that jon kent superman needs more explanation while siegel and shuster basically gave clark kent's origin in one page is wierd. Jon only needs snapshots. Even by that standard, Jon had two years with bendis that's leading upto future state. While people can complain about jon being like clark. The buildup is there. Everything is setup in legion of superheroes and superbooks.

Are you kidding me? I love supersons. I was just goofing around. Also, jurgens lois and clark had fair bit of thing bendis did expand on. The space prince thing is from that. If you like jurgen's jon, that arc is from lois and clark. If you ask me, Tomasi's jon way better than superboy(clark kent) in secret origins by geoff johns by miles. Secret origins was one of the attempts to encorporate silverage elements like bizzaro world, krypto, supergirl(cousin).. Etc. In this case, the superboy and legion of superheroes concept which was not part of postcrisis interpretation. But, it was boring and entirely stupid for me. Overall jon has been a better superboy in modern times than clark has ever managed to. In case you didn't know, the superboy as concept was a big marker of goldenage to silverage transition. Silverage superman was superboy.Byrne farmboy superman was never superboy and never meant to be. He was just a farmer from kansas .postcrisis superman and silverage superman are different in nuances. Silverage superman doesn't exist anymore. So, jon being more like that is very welcome change for me.

[Agent Z]

And it cements why it's a Fake Damian in Supersons and why Jon is detrimental to a far more interesting character...

I really hate Kid Jon, even more now.

It's a fake Damian because he got knocked out?

I mean, this is pretty much in line with the obnoxious jackass that Damian fans seem to love so much.

[Korath]

It's a fake Damian because he got knocked out?

I mean, this is pretty much in line with the obnoxious jackass that Damian fans seem to love so much.

No, it's a fake Damian because he, of all peoples, should understand the needs for him, a sa beacon, to be rendered unconcious. He wouldn't need slapstick comedy to achieve this, normally. Because h's experimented, to the point of being over-confident, but never dumb. In Supersons, is's dumb as a rock.

[OpaqueGiraffe17]

doesn't matter how much of a badass you are, a sucker punch is a sucker punch.

[manwhohaseverything]

No, it's a fake Damian because he, of all peoples, should understand the needs for him, a sa beacon, to be rendered unconcious.

Damian is not exactly rationalist, that doesn’t take emotional decisions. Teen titans book is full of such decisions . Didn't know damian was faster than a speeding bullet nor that he had spidersense? Lol! What beacon?beacon for the jerks and assholes of the society. Guess what? Bully's get bullied, that's what superman is meant to be. Damian's a brat who orders around people that could easily slug him to mars and beyond if they want to only because he is batman's son. Nothing more, nothing less. He has good lovable side. But, he ain't some beacon.Infact, none of these so called superheroes are. So, giving more importance to concept than its worth. Aren't we?

[Light of Justice]

Superman is like a good joke. If you need to explain everything then the joke isn't doing its job of laughter. There is a reason all star does "doomed planet, desperate scientist, last hope, kindly couple...etc".The idea that jon kent superman needs more explanation while siegel and shuster basically gave clark kent's origin in one page is wierd. Jon only needs snapshots. Even by that standard, Jon had two years with bendis that's leading upto future state. While people can complain about jon being like clark. The buildup is there. Everything is setup in legion of superheroes and superbooks.

Yeah I am aware that super doesn't really need any build up or training to develop just like bat does. Their natural power is amazing enough, . I just like it more if we can see how Jon develops his ability, because on Tomasi's run, Supersons, or even Jurgens Jon develops his power little by little. Like on Jurgens he can float a bit but on Supersons he can fly. His cold breath also didn't always appear as he likes, and on the first time he used it, Superman was proud and amazed, knowing that his baby is growing. That aspect is so endearing for me, and I rooted for Jon's growth process. That's why I feel almost like being cheated when Jon got his age up with his instant boost, and Superman once again lost his chance to see his son's growth.

[Light of Justice]

I don't want to post this because here is Jon thread and not Damian thread, and for @Korath, it's not the place to rant about Damian characterization in Supersons, but for those who wonders why some of Damian fans hate Supersons, that's because the book is clearly for Jon. Damian fans don't need Supersons. We have Robin : Son of Batman who was focused on Damian's development as character and it's so amazing for us. Imagine our feeling when the books were cancelled because higher ups want Damian to play good cop bad cop with Jon, who is quite new character. I know Rebirth reboot played part on that too but still, we just endured his death for more than one year, then when he came back Bruce went amnesic, Synder refused to use him and prefer to use Duke, he get thrown to Teen Titans and Supersons, and his character get thrashed on those books (especially ON TEEN TITANS. Ugh.)

Damian is indeed arrogant, but that doesn't mean he's only big talk and no ability. The fact that he is indeed can back up for his boast is what makes him so infuriating. Damian is indeed overconfident, bu that doesn't mean he's unreasonable person who's only acknowledge his own opinion. He's more experienced than Jon on superhero fields, he knows when you need to back down on a fight, and when you have to help people in need. On Supersons and TT crossover, when Damian turned into gramps and became a joke for Jon and Teen Titans, my inner Damian fans groaned. On Kraklow planet when Jon concerned about the citizen and Damian only thought about how they can go home, my inner Damian fans facepalmed. And on those panels when real Damian would know well how capable and on the same dangerous Future Tim is, could asses the situation and willing to get some help without have to be sucker punched by Jon, I was on acceptance stage and just accept that Damian is a support character for Jon on that book. Sure the book have some good on Damian and the fanbase, but just like @Blue22 said, the books was simply fun-adventure for Damian, and it's frustrating that fans depicts Damian's character based on that book (For example, some people that say Damian went dark because Jon left him, I mean excuse me? Damian isn't that desperate for Jon, he already has connection with many people, Dick, Bruce, Alfred, Colin, Maya, Suren, Steph, Maps, even Rose. DC just need to let Damian keep it instead of threw it away for the sake of edgy and to prop other character).

And now, Damian once again get trashed for the sake of new characters, a.k.a new and kinda problematic character like Emiko and Wallace also reeeeaallly new characters like Crush, Djinn, and Roundhouse. HahahahahahaHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Huft. As Damian fans, I don't even have energy left to get angry.

So, let's we stop debating about Damian on Jon thread, shall we? I am one of few people who doesn't like Damian and Jon get joined by hips and always paired together, despite both of them have their own lives. And for some Jon fans, Damian fans will be very much appreciated if you guys don't judge Damian based on Supersons alone.

[manwhohaseverything]

Yeah I am aware that super doesn't really need any build up or training to develop just like bat does.

Actually, power had nothing to do with what i said. Superman originally did train, did feats to mark breaking a limit, like all pulp characters usually did.As said, batman was based on characters like shadow, zorro, superman... Etc. What i said was, a supercharacter's origin is the least interesting thing about the character. He is moses in a strongman suit. The end. Now, on to better things.As for jon developing powers, tomasi and jurgens did alot of homework on that.Supersons had jon fly because jon had an arc where he defeated Manchester black in superman books of tomasi. There is fair bit of material on jon's progress throughout the three writers. Jon learned to use heat vision by burning his dad and killing his cat. Jon learned to fly by beating manchester black. Jon learned to use freeze breath by stopping superman and batman from fighting. Jon developed superintelligence when he was working on cosmic cube. Clois were forced to start jon's training because of his life being in danger constantly because of himself and villains. They didn't endorse child Vigilantism.

Bendis expanded on tomasi's supersons of tomorrow arc where jon loses control of the solar flare ability as well.Jon basically learned to live alone without parents in abusive environment and kept his optimistic attitude. So, jon doesn't need his parents for being moral or to solve his problems. That was the only thing bendis did. He made a man out of the boy.

A snapshot of his origin can be easily and clearly sketched with
lois and clark->superman/action comics rebirth->supersons->man of steel->Bendis's run-> legion of superheroes.now on to future state.

While i understand that supersons was cutshort. Jon didn't get to fully explore dc. The only other drawback to bendis's jon is atrocious voice for the character and His clois as parents being suddenly a bunch of neglectful jerks who let their kid suffer and didn't save him,instead were too busy with each other.

[Journey]

I'm just gonna say I don't think D and J need eachother by any means to flourish not to say their isn't a market that loves them cause there is and they do sell. As far as what they did do for one another Damian was both a friend and brother figure to Jon somewhat for him to look up to outside of the Clark Veil it was good for him. Jon helped Damian relax and take the lead outside of the batfamily veil in the eyes of someone who didn't see him as an overbearing control freak with murderous tendencies, Jon just saw him as a rude jerk because he was short and eventually warned up to that crusty personality. Both got something out of the relationship as it was it doesn't work now though cause the dynamic is completely changed and there acting like it's not unless Jon is fixed they shouldn't interact IMO cause they have no real reason too anymore.

[manwhohaseverything]

Jon needs a superpet asap. Bring back titano or beppo.

Let's lighten the mood. People need to chill. Krypto eating slime.

Clark playing the glasses game with baby jon. Also, silverage used to have superboy books along with superman books. So, it's not an either or situation.