Cassie Sandsmark: Wondergirl Appreciation 2020

[Gaius]

Why the Hell should she ditch that?
It would be better that she ditch the relationship with Diana and the Amazons.

Pre-Flashpoint was PERFECT when Cassie was the daughter of Zeus and Diana a woman made out of clay.

In Pre-Flashpoint Cassie was ALWAYS the better character than Diana and Donna, but had 2 major problems:

1. she was displayed like an "ordinary" Amazon, but instead should have been given more powers like Elektrokinesis to channel Zeus lightning.
I always HATED the "honorary Amazon" etc. and prefered the Hercules,Jason situation DEMI-GODS, NOT "honorary Amazons" etc.
2. she was never aged up and I didnt like her costumes, appearance etc.

If they would have been given her the powers of channel Zeus lightning, would have her aged up and displayed like in Rebirth the Titans of Tomorrow Cassie (in her Wonder Woman Costume) she would have easily had the chance to become maybe even more popular than Diana and especially Donna.

Jason (Dianas brother), Thor of Marvel and Raiden of Mortal Kombat are examples how you could have displayed her....

I preferred Cassie’s original origin of being a normal girl who was later granted power for having the nerves of steel to ask the King of Gods for them. A neat enough way to differentiate her from Diana and Donna. If there was anything I’d change I’d just change the god in question who grants the power to one of the Goddesses or Ares.

[Masterff]

Cassie will never be more popular than Diana. I like her a lot, but come on, dude.

Moreover, ditching her connection to the Wonder family is essentially a sure way to get her removed from books entirely. A lot of her prominence is as a Wonder Woman representative on teams.

NO

If we go back to the Pre-Flashpoint Origins than Diana was made out of Clay and Cassie was Zeus REAL daughter.

This was a good start for Cassie to become a popular character, but she had 2 problems:

1. The TRUTH is many characters are in part popular because of their look:
Black Canary,Nightwing,Diana,Donna,Poison Ivy,Harley,Zatanna.....have become so popular because they are displayed as handsome guy/beautiful woman.

Cassie was (UNFORTUNATELY) never aged up and most costumes which she was wearing were simple (T-Shirt and Jeans) etc.

The REBIRTH Titans of Tomorrow Cassie showed that if she grows up she is as beautiful as (for example) Black Canary is and this costumes was (at least for me) also her best and most recognisable one.

2. She is like a street-level version of Diana who can never be as powerful as Diana is, because Diana spent many years with training etc. and she has only the same basic powers which Diana has.
This is the second hindrance for me to let Cassie become more popular.


I would go back to the Pre-Flashpoint Origins (Diana made out of clay, Cassie as daughter of Zeus)
Let Diana be 35 and Cassie be 22 years old
Give her a look like Artemis (Pre-Flashpoint) with blonde hairs or Black Canary
take the lasso etc. away and give her not only the same powers as Diana has, but give her additional powers like channeling Zeus lightning like Jason did

Diana and Cassie are then both equally powerful, but very different:
Diana is the traditional Amazon with lasso, sword and shield
Cassie is the demi-goddess with additional powers

So Cassie is like Black Canary with Marvels Thor Powers.

For Books:
-If Supergirl,Barbara and Cassandra Cain have a series Cassie can also have her own series: she a big supporting cast with her father Zeus, her half-brother Ares, half-brother Hercules, her nemesis Lycus-the whole TT/YJ Cast
-she can co-star a series with Conner like the Wonder Woman/Superman Series with Diana/Clark
-she still can be in TT/YJ


I am disappointed that Cassie and Conner werent created as part of Nightwings Generation, because I am sure that these 2 would have become very popular if they would have had the chance to grow up and get new Code-Names etc. like Nightwings Generation had.

[Perseus]

NO

If we go back to the Pre-Flashpoint Origins than Diana was made out of Clay and Cassie was Zeus REAL daughter.

This was a good start for Cassie to become a popular character, but she had 2 problems:

1. The TRUTH is many characters are in part popular because of their look:
Black Canary,Nightwing,Diana,Donna,Poison Ivy,Harley,Zatanna.....have become so popular because they are displayed as handsome guy/beautiful woman.

Cassie was (UNFORTUNATELY) never aged up and most costumes which she was wearing were simple (T-Shirt and Jeans) etc.

The REBIRTH Titans of Tomorrow Cassie showed that if she grows up she is as beautiful as (for example) Black Canary is and this costumes was (at least for me) also her best and most recognisable one.

2. She is like a street-level version of Diana who can never be as powerful as Diana is, because Diana spent many years with training etc. and she has only the same basic powers which Diana has.
This is the second hindrance for me to let Cassie become more popular.


I would go back to the Pre-Flashpoint Origins (Diana made out of clay, Cassie as daughter of Zeus)
Let Diana be 35 and Cassie be 22 years old
Give her a look like Artemis (Pre-Flashpoint) with blonde hairs or Black Canary
take the lasso etc. away and give her not only the same powers as Diana has, but give her additional powers like channeling Zeus lightning like Jason did

Diana and Cassie are then both equally powerful, but very different:
Diana is the traditional Amazon with lasso, sword and shield
Cassie is the demi-goddess with additional powers

So Cassie is like Black Canary with Marvels Thor Powers.

For Books:
-If Supergirl,Barbara and Cassandra Cain have a series Cassie can also have her own series: she a big supporting cast with her father Zeus, her half-brother Ares, half-brother Hercules, her nemesis Lycus-the whole TT/YJ Cast
-she can co-star a series with Conner like the Wonder Woman/Superman Series with Diana/Clark
-she still can be in TT/YJ

I understand where your coming from because I believe that Cassie could be more popular then she is right now BUT.... Cassie will never become more popular than Diana no matter how many things you do.

I want Cassie to be older too, that changes some story elements and lets her do more thing as a young adult but its not a "compete with WW" game changer. Cassie also will always be weaker than Diana and have fewer powers. Giving her command of Zeus's Lightning (an ability Diana also has) isn't changing that. Diana has time, experience, and a whole host of other abilities besides lightning that Cassie doesn't.

I actually think she should be Ares's daughter or she gets power from Ares by going up and asking him as a "deal with the devil" sort of angle but with some teenage moxxi.

I also think she shouldn't date Connor or Tim for that matter, time to find someone new.

Diana is already DC's Thor, Cassie could be like Valkyre I guess.

[Gaius]

I understand where your coming from because I believe that Cassie could be more popular then she is right now BUT.... Cassie will never become more popular than Diana no matter how many things you do.

I want Cassie to be older too, that changes some story elements and lets her do more thing as a young adult but its not a "compete with WW" game changer. Cassie also will always be weaker than Diana and have fewer powers. Giving her command of Zeus's Lightning (an ability Diana also has) isn't changing that. Diana has time, experience, and a whole host of other abilities besides lightning that Cassie doesn't.

I actually think she should be Ares's daughter or she gets power from Ares by going up and asking him as a "deal with the devil" sort of angle but with some teenage moxxi.

I also think she shouldn't date Connor or Tim for that matter, time to find someone new.

Diana is already DC's Thor, Cassie could be like Valkyre I guess.

I had a similar idea. Only that because I kind of liked the pre-Flashpoint idea Ares treats Cassie nicely, there’s no “deal with the devil” aspect. The only benefit he gets is he knows it would piss Diana off.

[Perseus]

I had a similar idea. Only that because I kind of liked the pre-Flashpoint idea Ares treats Cassie nicely, there’s no “deal with the devil” aspect. The only benefit he gets is he knows it would piss Diana off.

I genuinely like the complex relationship between Diana and Ares that Rucka and even Jimenez had going. Ares and Diana are honest with each other, the sly jabs when they talk to each other, Ares and Diana knowing dang well that Diana cannot beat Ares on her own sheer power alone, etc... its one of the reasons GWW's last pages on the Just War were my favorite, Diana and Ares just talking. Its one of the reason I like the grandfather angle too, Diana has always been at odds with her family, no need to have daddy Zeus origin. But I'm ranting.

Yes, I think Ares would treat Cassie nicely as a sort of warrior with potential. This could also play into the "are you the father?" trope with him.

[sifighter]

Alright well this issue also comes out with Young Justice this week, so I'm just going to post the page from DCeased: Dead Planet #4 where Cassie is standing alongside the new Justice League Roster....well okay maybe its just Jon, Wallace, and Mary Marvel since there are other heroes like Mera, Dinah Lance-Queen, Black Lightning and his kids, Harley Quinn & Poison Ivy, Hawkgirl, Cyborg, Dr. Fate, Zatanna, Swamp Thing, Cassandra Cain, Jason Todd, Firestorm, Red Tornado, and Krypto still hanging around (yeah when you start to list them it really makes you think how a surprising number of characters lived)

IMG_0953.jpg

[Robanker]

NO

If we go back to the Pre-Flashpoint Origins than Diana was made out of Clay and Cassie was Zeus REAL daughter.

This was a good start for Cassie to become a popular character, but she had 2 problems:

1. The TRUTH is many characters are in part popular because of their look:
Black Canary,Nightwing,Diana,Donna,Poison Ivy,Harley,Zatanna.....have become so popular because they are displayed as handsome guy/beautiful woman.

Cassie was (UNFORTUNATELY) never aged up and most costumes which she was wearing were simple (T-Shirt and Jeans) etc.

The REBIRTH Titans of Tomorrow Cassie showed that if she grows up she is as beautiful as (for example) Black Canary is and this costumes was (at least for me) also her best and most recognisable one.

2. She is like a street-level version of Diana who can never be as powerful as Diana is, because Diana spent many years with training etc. and she has only the same basic powers which Diana has.
This is the second hindrance for me to let Cassie become more popular.


I would go back to the Pre-Flashpoint Origins (Diana made out of clay, Cassie as daughter of Zeus)
Let Diana be 35 and Cassie be 22 years old
Give her a look like Artemis (Pre-Flashpoint) with blonde hairs or Black Canary
take the lasso etc. away and give her not only the same powers as Diana has, but give her additional powers like channeling Zeus lightning like Jason did

Diana and Cassie are then both equally powerful, but very different:
Diana is the traditional Amazon with lasso, sword and shield
Cassie is the demi-goddess with additional powers

So Cassie is like Black Canary with Marvels Thor Powers.

For Books:
-If Supergirl,Barbara and Cassandra Cain have a series Cassie can also have her own series: she a big supporting cast with her father Zeus, her half-brother Ares, half-brother Hercules, her nemesis Lycus-the whole TT/YJ Cast
-she can co-star a series with Conner like the Wonder Woman/Superman Series with Diana/Clark
-she still can be in TT/YJ


I am disappointed that Cassie and Conner werent created as part of Nightwings Generation, because I am sure that these 2 would have become very popular if they would have had the chance to grow up and get new Code-Names etc. like Nightwings Generation had.

Why is your answer for every one of the YJ4 to be "as powerful as their mentor."

You're basically asking DC to make their biggest, most successful characters irrelevant to push a supporting character. It literally makes zero sense.

Furthermore, a street level Wonder character is actually something the Wonder family doesn't have and would make her more unique. You're just turning her into diet Shazam, and we already have seven of them, one of which leads his own IP. You unintentionally hit the niche Cassie could actually carve out for herself: a more youthful, down-to-earth Wonder character. I'm not saying I think it should happen, but that's the one thing they're lacking the same way the Superman family doesn't have a good magic representative.

Don't get me started on the Artemis costume from pre-Flashpoint. Not only was that a pretty awful costume, but it doesn't suit Cassie as a character at all. I swear, dude, you only think about power levels.

Not every character needs to be a world beater.

[Agent Z]

Why is your answer for every one of the YJ4 to be "as powerful as their mentor."

You're basically asking DC to make their biggest, most successful characters irrelevant to push a supporting character. It literally makes zero sense.

Furthermore, a street level Wonder character is actually something the Wonder family doesn't have and would make her more unique. You're just turning her into diet Shazam, and we already have seven of them, one of which leads his own IP. You unintentionally hit the niche Cassie could actually carve out for herself: a more youthful, down-to-earth Wonder character. I'm not saying I think it should happen, but that's the one thing they're lacking the same way the Superman family doesn't have a good magic representative.

Don't get me started on the Artemis costume from pre-Flashpoint. Not only was that a pretty awful costume, but it doesn't suit Cassie as a character at all. I swear, dude, you only think about power levels.

Not every character needs to be a world beater.

Isn't Artemis more a street level Wonder? At least, she isn't as powerful as Diana or the Wonder Girls.

[Digifiend]

Well, considering Artemis was co-starring in Red Hood, and bat family books do tend to be street level...

[Gaius]

Why is your answer for every one of the YJ4 to be "as powerful as their mentor."

You're basically asking DC to make their biggest, most successful characters irrelevant to push a supporting character. It literally makes zero sense.

Furthermore, a street level Wonder character is actually something the Wonder family doesn't have and would make her more unique. You're just turning her into diet Shazam, and we already have seven of them, one of which leads his own IP. You unintentionally hit the niche Cassie could actually carve out for herself: a more youthful, down-to-earth Wonder character. I'm not saying I think it should happen, but that's the one thing they're lacking the same way the Superman family doesn't have a good magic representative.

Don't get me started on the Artemis costume from pre-Flashpoint. Not only was that a pretty awful costume, but it doesn't suit Cassie as a character at all. I swear, dude, you only think about power levels.

Not every character needs to be a world beater.

The green-and-white swimsuit? Yeah, that was pretty bad. Think the only look Artemis had pre-Rebirth I liked was her Jimenez “civilian attire”.

Though I can’t really say Cassie’s ever had a costume I think was aces in my opinion.

[Agent Z]

I liked the green and white suit if only because I felt the Wonder family had too much red.

[Koriand'r]

The green-and-white swimsuit? Yeah, that was pretty bad. Think the only look Artemis had pre-Rebirth I liked was her Jimenez “civilian attire”.

Though I can’t really say Cassie’s ever had a costume I think was aces in my opinion.

WW WG wonder_girl_by_alisakiss-d4rvaar.jpgWW WG wonder_girl_by_alisakiss-d4rvaar.jpg

Switch the top with the WG eagle toga top and you have a winner. I like this top too but the toga doesn't show as much midriff and keeps her from looking like early Britney Spears.

[Robanker]

The green-and-white swimsuit? Yeah, that was pretty bad. Think the only look Artemis had pre-Rebirth I liked was her Jimenez “civilian attire”.

Though I can’t really say Cassie’s ever had a costume I think was aces in my opinion.

Whatever the case, her Rebirth look is outstanding, particularly under Soy's pencils. I can't respect any opinion wanting to go back to the pre-FP look when we have something objectively superior.

[Frontier]

I'm a fan of her YJ cartoon look but the current costume has grown on me .

[Gaius]

I'm a fan of her YJ cartoon look but the current costume has grown on me .

Better than the dregs she’s sporting in DCeased at least.