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  1. #8611
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chief12d View Post
    I’ve been an advocate of Kaspar becoming the Coal Tiger and becoming the resident representative of the Hatut Zeraze for a while now for all the reasons you mentioned. Alongside Shuri, Okoye, and T’Challa’s love interest, I think Kaspar should be part of the core supporting cast appearing basically every other issue and getting development as a side character. So much potential is being wasted with him and it’ll probably take the MCU introducing him for the comics to realize the value he has as T’Challa’s personal intelligence agent/spymaster.
    If this happens (Which I'm good with) I think w'kabi needs to come back as well. Balance out his supporting cast, I do think that the HZ should look more like dogs then panthers, but hos new look overall works and should be standardized for the HZ as a whole. But Kasper I would say I prefer Kasper over Hunter now thinking about it. Its more I would tolerate Hunter so long as his role is very minor

  2. #8612
    The Professional Marvell2100's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chief12d View Post
    I’ve been an advocate of Kaspar becoming the Coal Tiger and becoming the resident representative of the Hatut Zeraze for a while now for all the reasons you mentioned. Alongside Shuri, Okoye, and T’Challa’s love interest, I think Kaspar should be part of the core supporting cast appearing basically every other issue and getting development as a side character. So much potential is being wasted with him and it’ll probably take the MCU introducing him for the comics to realize the value he has as T’Challa’s personal intelligence agent/spymaster.
    Kasper Kole should become the American Panther.


  3. #8613
    Fantastic Member Vanguard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cville View Post
    I think it will be some Vb armor upgrade.
    My whole belief on the Vibranium upgrades over physical stat based upgrades, is writers liking an upgrade they can write around. I believe thatís why you donít see a lot of characters generally get way stronger and faster. If itís tech based, or magic based, or the like, there can be any number of excuses as to why the character could win or lose. Thatís what I think is the reason.

  4. #8614
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marvell2100 View Post
    If anything it will be vibranium related.

    My idea for an event is this:

    World War Wakanda!

    40 years ago, Wakanda is embroiled in a decades old cold war with a nation whose technological might rivals its' own, Kiber Island! Frederick Kiber was a scientific genius whose brilliance was matched only by his ruthlessness! Filled with dreams of global domination, he built Kiber Island as a launching pad in his quest to rule the world! The only thing missing was the one precious metal that he desperately needed for his plan, Vibranium which brought him into conflict with King T'Chaka and Wakanda! After years of war, the two nations had finally reached a stalemate in their long battle. But one day, inexplicably, there was a huge explosion on Kiber Island causing it to sink and with it killing every living soul!

    Today, from the bottom of the ocean, Kiber Island rises again, rebuilt and more powerful than before! But even more surprising, Kiber blames Wakanda for the explosion that sunk his island and accuses them of genocide in the deaths of millions. As nations around the world begin to discuss the issue, there is talk of those who believe Kiber and want Wakanda held accountable and punished. Some nations have already begun to enact The Wakanda Protocols, a comprehensive detail plan on how to attack the most powerful nation on the planet. They have even assembled a team of superhumans whose sole mission is to take down the Black Panther.

    King T'Challa denies Wakanda having anything to do with the destruction of Kiber Island and warns the rest of the world not to act against Wakanda or it's interests or suffer the consequences. Wakanda will defend itself by any means necessary!

    Thus begins World War Wakanda.
    Oooh I like this idea! I would add that there needs to be something else, one other event that takes place that initially puts the resteod the world on edge. My idea to add? The Black order has returned! They are threatening the earth and ad the nation's around the world prepare for
    the worst against the invading Armada, the world is stunned when they are defeated by Wakanda, who activated their Black order contingency.

    So while some nation's are relieved that earth was saved others are scared, How did Wakanda have the means to defeat them? Last time they invaded it was devastating, had Wakanda become this powerful since the last encounter? Have they always been this powerful and they just never noticed to this extent? They won't push for more territory will they? I mean they took Africa under their protection but they won't go further right?

    Enter Kiber and his accusation that Wakanda destroyed them. These other nations curious about Wakandas might see this as the fuel to flame their fears, that Wakanda isn't as peaceful as they claim and this they need to mobilize. This gives that fear factor Hudlin wanted if he were to have written DW and segues into your idea

  5. #8615
    The Professional Marvell2100's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezyo1000 View Post
    Oooh I like this idea! I would add that there needs to be something else, one other event that takes place that initially puts the resteod the world on edge. My idea to add? The Black order has returned! They are threatening the earth and ad the nation's around the world prepare for
    the worst against the invading Armada, the world is stunned when they are defeated by Wakanda, who activated their Black order contingency.

    So while some nation's are relieved that earth was saved others are scared, How did Wakanda have the means to defeat them? Last time they invaded it was devastating, had Wakanda become this powerful since the last encounter? Have they always been this powerful and they just never noticed to this extent? They won't push for more territory will they? I mean they took Africa under their protection but they won't go further right?

    Enter Kiber and his accusation that Wakanda destroyed them. These other nations curious about Wakandas might see this as the fuel to flame their fears, that Wakanda isn't as peaceful as they claim and this they need to mobilize. This gives that fear factor Hudlin wanted if he were to have written DW and segues into your idea
    A pre-Black Order event would be a good lead up especially since Wakanda should remember that the world sold them out in TRO. During the Kiber incident, you might even have some Wakandans wanting to go to war with the rest of the world and make them pay for turning their backs.

  6. #8616
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezyo1000 View Post
    If this happens (Which I'm good with) I think w'kabi needs to come back as well. Balance out his supporting cast, I do think that the HZ should look more like dogs then panthers, but hos new look overall works and should be standardized for the HZ as a whole. But Kasper I would say I prefer Kasper over Hunter now thinking about it. Its more I would tolerate Hunter so long as his role is very minor
    Imma be honest, how needed is W'Kabi as a character lol? I've thought about it and I'm not seeing where he fits in anymore. Obviously, he's a male friend of T'Challa's and he could use more of those, but his role is basically taken care of by T'Challa himself and increasingly Okoye.

    Constitutional Council or not, BP has unilateral control of Wakanda's armed forces already and Okoye, as much as it doesn't really make sense, is being pushed as Wakanda's standard head of security. Hasn't she even been referred to as a general both in the MCU and comics?

    But I agree that maybe giving Kaspar a title based on a big cat doesn't make sense if he's leading an organization based on dogs. I'd be fine with White Wolf, since due to the MCU there's now precedent for the title going to non-Wakandans.

    Hell, that could be the traditional title of the HZ's leader to expand on the lore. I like them as this ancient order of Wakandan assassins and intelligence gatherers so adding on that tidbit of worldbuilding would be cool.

  7. #8617
    Uncanny Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Besouro View Post
    Frankly speaking Hunter isn't much of an antagonist.

    Do u know how easy it would have been if Tchalla had remained the only child.....just to have him be mortally wounded then BAM! Hunter is now crown prince.

    Hudlin was very smart to introduce Uncle Syan and create Shuri so that if Tchalla is absent (for whatever reason) then the crown goes to Shuri....if both Shuri and Tchalla are absent then the crown goes to the uncle of the king/Syan....if Syan is absent, it goes to Syan's son or daughter whereby in which case the Bashenga royal bloodline retains the crown leadership.

    Despite the above, Hunter still carries a "white saviour" narrative being a protector and "nationalist" of a black nation.

    Ross is far better and was introduced into the BP mythos more organically using international affairs between countries having Ross working in the US state department assigned to BP. Even if he is with the CIA as in the BP movie, it still works.
    The best antagonists are often those that aren't much of an antagonist.

    Hunter isn't evil for the sake of being evil... he's a nationalist who wants to protect his people by any means necessarily. And that makes him a villain who, while wrong, can at times at least make sense. In the end they still get punched out by the hero, by the antagonist at least doesn't come off looking like a Saturday Morning cartoon villain from the 80's (not that a few of those sort of villains aren't nice to have around too).

    In some ways it's a T'Challa without the same moral compass... which I think can be nice to have in the story. He's not after power or revenge like Killmonger or M'Baku... but he's not this white savior either in that he crosses obvious lines which people with actual moral compass (like BP and presumably most readers) won't tolerate. And to me that makes for a better villain a lot of the time.

    That said, I will agree he was sort of ham fisted into the mythos (and I would make the same complaint about Shuri). Having a sibling show up one with without even an attempt at explaining why we've never seen or heard of them before isn't the most organic way to bring a character into the narrative. That said, they exist and they theoretically should be important parts of the main characters lives. So to me at this point, it's more jarring to not use them despite how ham fisted their introduction might have been.

  8. #8618
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    My BP event ties in with my idea for the source of vibranium. Planted on earth by an elder of the universe, whose focus is music, as part of one of his solar system destroying performances. Everyone on earth, or maybe the solar system, gets an earworm piece of music stuck in their head. Each a little different but part of the whole. As people perform, or hum, or sing their small or larger parts serendipitous together wierd and destructive events happen. These events escalate as T'Chall investigates. Klaw is involved somehow, of course. Not sure how, though. It is determined that the vibranium mound is absorbing and distributing the energy from the music causing the wierd destruction. Of course it is all part of the grand symphonic cacophony orchestrated at the direction of the elder. Not only would the event mean confrontation with the elder, but cosmic audience members upset with the interuption of the performance as well as some more sensitive or accomplished musicians obsessed with completing the piece of music which would ultimately be the mound absorbing the music in the proper sequence and exploding with enough energy to take out most of the solar system and be one hell of a finale/light show to end the concert.

    One hell of a run on sentence there. But that's the gist.
    Reality is for those who are afraid of science fiction.

  9. #8619
    Uncanny Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chief12d View Post
    Imma be honest, how needed is W'Kabi as a character lol? I've thought about it and I'm not seeing where he fits in anymore. Obviously, he's a male friend of T'Challa's and he could use more of those, but his role is basically taken care of by T'Challa himself and increasingly Okoye.

    Constitutional Council or not, BP has unilateral control of Wakanda's armed forces already and Okoye, as much as it doesn't really make sense, is being pushed as Wakanda's standard head of security. Hasn't she even been referred to as a general both in the MCU and comics?

    But I agree that maybe giving Kaspar a title based on a big cat doesn't make sense if he's leading an organization based on dogs. I'd be fine with White Wolf, since due to the MCU there's now precedent for the title going to non-Wakandans.

    Hell, that could be the traditional title of the HZ's leader to expand on the lore. I like them as this ancient order of Wakandan assassins and intelligence gatherers so adding on that tidbit of worldbuilding would be cool.
    For a solo book at least, having a supporting cast is important. If you look at a TV show like Buffy the Vampire Slayer for example... on paper did they need Xander? Technically no (and I say that as a HUGE Xander fan). But you need characters like that for the main characters to interact with, and to occasionally be normal human non super powed POV characters for the readers. If T'Challa need to explain his plan to defeat Killmonger to the readers, he can tell it to W'kabi. Or if he just wants to talk to someone about his marriage ending or whatever, he can do it with a character like W'Kabi that he can't necessarily do with his sister or his mother.

    Killing T'Challa's male supporting cast, IMO at least was one of the more unecessary decisions made in the comics. Not that W'Baki can't in theory be replaced in that capacity by Kasper or Eden or whatever... but it was a waste.

  10. #8620
    The Professional Marvell2100's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chief12d View Post
    Imma be honest, how needed is W'Kabi as a character lol? I've thought about it and I'm not seeing where he fits in anymore. Obviously, he's a male friend of T'Challa's and he could use more of those, but his role is basically taken care of by T'Challa himself and increasingly Okoye.

    Constitutional Council or not, BP has unilateral control of Wakanda's armed forces already and Okoye, as much as it doesn't really make sense, is being pushed as Wakanda's standard head of security. Hasn't she even been referred to as a general both in the MCU and comics?

    But I agree that maybe giving Kaspar a title based on a big cat doesn't make sense if he's leading an organization based on dogs. I'd be fine with White Wolf, since due to the MCU there's now precedent for the title going to non-Wakandans.

    Hell, that could be the traditional title of the HZ's leader to expand on the lore. I like them as this ancient order of Wakandan assassins and intelligence gatherers so adding on that tidbit of worldbuilding would be cool.
    Still need more dudes in BP and plus he's head of the Rhino clan. We haven't seen much of a Wakandan male supporting character lately.

  11. #8621
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    Quote Originally Posted by chief12d View Post
    Iíve been an advocate of Kaspar becoming the Coal Tiger and becoming the resident representative of the Hatut Zeraze for a while now for all the reasons you mentioned. Alongside Shuri, Okoye, and TíChallaís love interest, I think Kaspar should be part of the core supporting cast appearing basically every other issue and getting development as a side character. So much potential is being wasted with him and itíll probably take the MCU introducing him for the comics to realize the value he has as TíChallaís personal intelligence agent/spymaster.
    Is Coal Tiger a good name though?

  12. #8622
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    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    For a solo book at least, having a supporting cast is important. If you look at a TV show like Buffy the Vampire Slayer for example... on paper did they need Xander? Technically no (and I say that as a HUGE Xander fan). But you need characters like that for the main characters to interact with, and to occasionally be normal human non super powed POV characters for the readers. If T'Challa need to explain his plan to defeat Killmonger to the readers, he can tell it to W'kabi. Or if he just wants to talk to someone about his marriage ending or whatever, he can do it with a character like W'Kabi that he can't necessarily do with his sister or his mother.

    Killing T'Challa's male supporting cast, IMO at least was one of the more unecessary decisions made in the comics. Not that W'Baki can't in theory be replaced in that capacity by Kasper or Eden or whatever... but it was a waste.
    I agree that killing off W'Kabi in the first place was stupid but I was speaking more in terms of how relevant he should be to the mythos and in actual stories. I don't think he's necessary as anything more than being a friend, seeing as his role of head of security is covered by T'Challa and Okoye.

    In which case I wonder if Kaspar and a more MCU-influenced M'Baku wouldn't work better as the male supporting cast. I think they offer more than W'Kabi ever did story-wise and could easily be those friends he talks to about personal guy stuff.

    But like Marvell2100 said, if they made him head of the Border Tribe that could work. Maybe the Border Tribe also administers the new space territories or something? We need a point-man on Wakandan cosmic stuff now and I see either W'Kabi or Vibraxas filling that role.
    Last edited by chief12d; 10-18-2020 at 10:47 AM.

  13. #8623
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marvell2100 View Post
    A pre-Black Order event would be a good lead up especially since Wakanda should remember that the world sold them out in TRO. During the Kiber incident, you might even have some Wakandans wanting to go to war with the rest of the world and make them pay for turning their backs.
    The reason I said the black order is because it's to establish that Wakanda isn't a joke, they aren't going to turn into the jobber to show how big a threat is, frak that. Its to remind everyone (mu and fans) that you see Wakanda, you die. Plus there's plenty within the black order thst need their heads mounted on vibranium pikes. The Black order is dangerous enough to get the message across, but aren't going to be missed if they get killed off so they aren't protected by editorial. And I would rather T'Challa juggle the kiber issue, the rest of the world issue Ontop of some Wakandans wanting to go to war, using the argument about tro as the reason to actually pay them back, with the end game to showcase why T'Challa is Bast champion and why he is the best BP

  14. #8624
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chief12d View Post
    Imma be honest, how needed is W'Kabi as a character lol? I've thought about it and I'm not seeing where he fits in anymore. Obviously, he's a male friend of T'Challa's and he could use more of those, but his role is basically taken care of by T'Challa himself and increasingly Okoye.

    Constitutional Council or not, BP has unilateral control of Wakanda's armed forces already and Okoye, as much as it doesn't really make sense, is being pushed as Wakanda's standard head of security. Hasn't she even been referred to as a general both in the MCU and comics?

    But I agree that maybe giving Kaspar a title based on a big cat doesn't make sense if he's leading an organization based on dogs. I'd be fine with White Wolf, since due to the MCU there's now precedent for the title going to non-Wakandans.

    Hell, that could be the traditional title of the HZ's leader to expand on the lore. I like them as this ancient order of Wakandan assassins and intelligence gatherers so adding on that tidbit of worldbuilding would be cool.
    Maybe Taku then lol he can be the leader of the Wakandan Intelligence Network (W.I.N) and have him come out of the techno jungle some times, but that is where he and his team support, report and monitor situations with HZ and other Intelligence around the world and even in space to some capacity

    As for the WW title, I like that but I would say it was kinda always a secret police until T'Challa changes the leader to ab outsider as part of his initiative to open to the rest of the world, these people would always be hand picked by T'Challa himself and trained by him

  15. #8625
    Astonishing Member Blind Wedjat's Avatar
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    Regarding the Marvel's Avengers game, the Black Panther expansion is coming in 2021 (probably January).

    According to mmmmmmmmiller on Twitter (community figurehead of the game's Discord and 'leaker'), it's the most impressive thing the game has pulled off and it's pretty huge.

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