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  1. #3736
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blind Wedjat View Post
    Ancient Egypt is just overused when it comes to African Fantasy. I'm kinda over it at this point but I agree that it feels less original. Even though the film uses Bast, I'm so glad the overall aesthetic of the film hardly used Ancient Egypt.

    They could have really just kept it as it was or inspired Wakandan god's by another African pantheon. There are many to choose from.

    In hindsight they should have probably used Sekhmet instead since she's more commonly associated with war. But I think Bast is fine now.
    In hindsight I wish the Panther God were never named Bast. It opened up the entire mythos to being Egyptified in ways that are inconsistent with what Wakanda is supposed to be. I'll admit that Priest covered his bases by tying in the inspiration for the Egyptian gods and culture to black Africa, but the harsh reality is most writers (and general society) don't see it that way. You already have this idea in Western culture that the only African civilization worth a damn is Ancient Egypt so when Wakandan religion is based around that rather than drawing ideas from other African civilizations it's a missed opportunity imo.

    I agree the movie took the right approach and for the most part so have the comics. It's only when I see things like Hickman's Fantastic Four where you got Wakanda looking like a lost Egyptian colony that I'm really bothered by Heliopolitans in the mythos lol. But I'd still prefer the Wakandan gods and faith was 100% original and didn't directly take names from other African cultures regardless of their location. It can still tie in to the Elder Gods and all that, but I've never been big on adding deities from Egypt, West Africa, or even East Africa. Wakandan naming conventions are so arbitrary that there really is no reason to steal names from obscure African gods, like Coates did with the "Orishas".
    Last edited by chief12d; 05-31-2020 at 08:29 PM.

  2. #3737
    Mighty Member Ekie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingNomarch View Post
    Just had a laugh about WGTC latest article saying Shuri creates a nano suit for Wolverine made with anti metal instead of regular vibranium

    New mcu Black panther smh

  3. #3738
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    No, you didn't say he would solo him. But you said BP would have the advantage over him in a fight. And the problem there being if the book shows that BP can beat MK solo, then he has no business being able to fight ALL the Avengers. Seriously, if he can't beat BP what business does he have fighting BP, Captain America, Hulk, Captain Marvel, Ghost Rider, and freaking Thor? He won't last 5 seconds. He'd be lucky to last 1.

    MK needs to look like a threat. And that's harder to do when it appears as though a single Avengers can beat him. It's why T'Challa surrendering him is the best possible outcome. BP isn't beat, but MK still looks strong.

    Let's change the plot a bit in a way you might understand better. Lets say instead of MK the story was BP defeating all the Avengers to save the world from Mephisto. Would you prefer him fighting Captain America or Blade and having them hold the advantage against him until they realizes what the threat is, then realizing that to win is not beating BP but to go to Bast? Or would you think that would make BP look weak in a story which is trying to build him up as a threat to the entire team? I'm 99% sure you would not prefer Steve or Blade looking like they are winning the fight before surrendering to him... and frankly I wouldn't blame you if that were the case. In the first issue at least he should be established as a threat. And that means not looking like hes going to lose to one of the Avengers. That applies to both BP and MK in that position.
    We when. You see him getting smacked around by Danny and the. Later beats Thor pretty easily. I mean. That's a massive difference in power.

    Also have TChalla could beat the avengers as his current form through tech so the story would have to be different. TChalla isn't MK. He is above him and operates on a grander scale so.

  4. #3739
    Uncanny Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezyo1000 View Post
    We when. You see him getting smacked around by Danny and the. Later beats Thor pretty easily. I mean. That's a massive difference in power.

    Also have TChalla could beat the avengers as his current form through tech so the story would have to be different. TChalla isn't MK. He is above him and operates on a grander scale so.
    MK fights Danny hand to hand. With Thor, MK allows the hammer to do all the fighting. Literally. If MK had tried to fight Thor the way he fought Danny, outcome would be very different... but obviously MK is smart enough not to do that.

    And sure you can have BP use tech instead of magic. BUt my point is if BP were in the position MK would be in, I suspect (correct me if I'm wrong) you won't want his opponent beating him until they decide to surrender. And that's how MK should be writtem IMO. For the very first issue in particular, don't have BP or MK look like they can't beat a single Avenger IF the idea is they're supposed to be a threat the whole team.

  5. #3740
    Astonishing Member Cville's Avatar
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    I would say the only missed opportunity is for the to confi5that Tchalla is still King of the Dead. Lol

    MK could have given the order to attack and the Mummies just stood there. Then the same sequence could play out with MK trying to take his powers.

  6. #3741
    Uncanny Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cville View Post
    I would say the only missed opportunity is for the to confi5that Tchalla is still King of the Dead. Lol

    MK could have given the order to attack and the Mummies just stood there. Then the same sequence could play out with MK trying to take his powers.
    Aaron has thrown vampires and mummies at T'Challa, and no usage of King of the Dead whatsoever (though perhaps vampires count as undead... don't know how that works).

    I think we can assume for Aarons run at least, KotD simply doesn't exist. Maybe that aspect of the character has been completely dropped by marvel at that point.

  7. #3742
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    MK fights Danny hand to hand. With Thor, MK allows the hammer to do all the fighting. Literally. If MK had tried to fight Thor the way he fought Danny, outcome would be very different... but obviously MK is smart enough not to do that.

    And sure you can have BP use tech instead of magic. BUt my point is if BP were in the position MK would be in, I suspect (correct me if I'm wrong) you won't want his opponent beating him until they decide to surrender. And that's how MK should be writtem IMO. For the very first issue in particular, don't have BP or MK look like they can't beat a single Avenger IF the idea is they're supposed to be a threat the whole team.
    Of TChalla has to take down the Avengers, Redjacks, the last avenger is exactly how it would go, no plot device, no magical power boost designed to allow him to win, it would be how it went down on the show. TChalla isn't moon knight. If he was the antagonist he would prepped and systematically taken everyone down through exposing their weaknesses, not going into straight up fist fights. In the last avenger he fought Thor, he was losing that fight ( obviously, but he still got good hits in but it was clear he couldn't just straight fist fight him) then goads him into throwing the hammer this removing him from the fight. That's how TChalla would engage.

    Again your comparing the two as if MK and BP are the same. It's not apples to apples, it's apples to oranges

  8. #3743
    Uncanny Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezyo1000 View Post
    Of TChalla has to take down the Avengers, Redjacks, the last avenger is exactly how it would go, no plot device, no magical power boost designed to allow him to win, it would be how it went down on the show. TChalla isn't moon knight. If he was the antagonist he would prepped and systematically taken everyone down through exposing their weaknesses, not going into straight up fist fights. In the last avenger he fought Thor, he was losing that fight ( obviously, but he still got good hits in but it was clear he couldn't just straight fist fight him) then goads him into throwing the hammer this removing him from the fight. That's how TChalla would engage.

    Again your comparing the two as if MK and BP are the same. It's not apples to apples, it's apples to oranges
    YOu're missing the point. It's not about the means... it's about making BP or MK look good in the process. The way you want BP potrayed is the way ANY good antagonist should be handled, because that's what better serves the story.

    I think the issue is you look at things purely through a BP standoing. If BP is facing the Avengers it matters more how he looks than how the Avengers look, but if BP is on the Avengers side it matters more how BP looks than the antagonist they are facing. And I get that... you're a fan. But the point being ANY antagonist whether they are BP or MK should be built up enough to look like a threat to the Avengers if they're being positioned to face the whole team. And that is compromised when a single Avenger, whether it's BP or Cap fighting BP, is shown being capable of beating them on their own. Especially for the first issue, build up the threat FIRST. The Avengers can take the L and get the win back later in the story, so it doesn't hurt them in the long run.

  9. #3744
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    YOu're missing the point. It's not about the means... it's about making BP or MK look good in the process. The way you want BP potrayed is the way ANY good antagonist should be handled, because that's what better serves the story.

    I think the issue is you look at things purely through a BP standoing. If BP is facing the Avengers it matters more how he looks than how the Avengers look, but if BP is on the Avengers side it matters more how BP looks than the antagonist they are facing. And I get that... you're a fan. But the point being ANY antagonist whether they are BP or MK should be built up enough to look like a threat to the Avengers if they're being positioned to face the whole team. And that is compromised when a single Avenger, whether it's BP or Cap fighting BP, is shown being capable of beating them on their own. Especially for the first issue, build up the threat FIRST. The Avengers can take the L and get the win back later in the story, so it doesn't hurt them in the long run.
    Of course this is the BP appreciation thread so yeah I'm looking at this from BPs standpoint. Just like I expect the IF fans, Thor fans, strange fans and MK fans to focus on how they look. And unlike some, most of the bp fans here don't just accept any and all reasoning a writer gives for why something goes down a certain way, especially when it goes again continuity or characteristics. And the real issue is simple: If the plot drives the story that's the true problem, if the story says "Mk must beat these characters" so the plot unfolds in a way that make's the characters lose due to unconvincing, stupidity, or ass pulls, it's a problem, especially when your factor in that the "villain" being used is street level at best and could never lose a true threat to the avengers so massive works is required to make it believable.

    And again, the difference between if T'Challa was the antagonist vs MK, is that T'Challa can believably beat the avengers using continuity. Characteristics, and his resources at his disposal. All of which are tied into his mythos and history and do not require a special plot device to achieve it. If BP was the baddy and he fought cap, the fight would be pretty even h2h wise then T'Challa would win due to prep and catching Cap in his machinations. Against Danny well, we have all read priests BP vs IF and there were several moments In the fight where T'Challa could of ended it had he chose to.

    What in getting at is again, MK and BP aren't on the same level at all, they aren't even in the same league.

  10. #3745
    Uncanny Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezyo1000 View Post
    Of course this is the BP appreciation thread so yeah I'm looking at this from BPs standpoint. Just like I expect the IF fans, Thor fans, strange fans and MK fans to focus on how they look. And unlike some, most of the bp fans here don't just accept any and all reasoning a writer gives for why something goes down a certain way, especially when it goes again continuity or characteristics. And the real issue is simple: If the plot drives the story that's the true problem, if the story says "Mk must beat these characters" so the plot unfolds in a way that make's the characters lose due to unconvincing, stupidity, or ass pulls, it's a problem, especially when your factor in that the "villain" being used is street level at best and could never lose a true threat to the avengers so massive works is required to make it believable.

    And again, the difference between if T'Challa was the antagonist vs MK, is that T'Challa can believably beat the avengers using continuity. Characteristics, and his resources at his disposal. All of which are tied into his mythos and history and do not require a special plot device to achieve it. If BP was the baddy and he fought cap, the fight would be pretty even h2h wise then T'Challa would win due to prep and catching Cap in his machinations. Against Danny well, we have all read priests BP vs IF and there were several moments In the fight where T'Challa could of ended it had he chose to.

    What in getting at is again, MK and BP aren't on the same level at all, they aren't even in the same league.
    MK can believably beat them too if he's upgraded by his god to be that powerful.

    MK needs to be not just at BP's level... he needs to be at Avengers level because that's what he's fighting. You've argued many times that Killmonger should be upgraded (something I agree with for the record). If he were used in this story instead of MK I'd be arguing the exact same thing for the exact same reason. Killmonger is street level too, but that doesn't mean a story can't elevate the character to make him as much of a threat as he needs to be. That sort of thing happens in comics all the time, and there's no reason in theory a writer can't use MK or Killmonger as more than just street level provided they give you a reasonable enough plot device to elevate them. In both their cases they are avatars of gods, so it's really not that hard.

  11. #3746
    Amazing Member Paul Muad'Dib's Avatar
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    Wakanda is a fictional nation located along the Nile river. the 4000 mile Nile. the US is only 3000 miles.... Bast? Kushite influence in Wakanda...

    Mummies? Really, n!@@a? Mummification is a medical procedure & a form of honoring the dead. You don't have to like the Egyptian ties to Wakanda but you don't have to dishonor Egypt's sacred legacy. Whenever you see an Egyptian mummy, (creature/ monster/ zombie) know that it's disrespectful. Why accept bastardized versions of your own culture? Do "Mummies" promote Egyptian ingenuity or does it propagandize negative stereotypes?

    Let's keep the content A-1. I will roast thee with strict sarcasm


    O.G. Oscar Grant Tribute (Storm fan-art)

  12. #3747
    Amazing Member Paul Muad'Dib's Avatar
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    Milestone fan-art

    Trayvon Benjamin Martin tribute

    excerpts from the sketchbook 2016

  13. #3748
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    CBR just published an article about T'Challa in the lastest Avengers issue we have been writing about.


    https://www.cbr.com/avengers-black-p...knight-attack/

  14. #3749
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    Quote Originally Posted by taozen View Post
    CBR just published an article about T'Challa in the lastest Avengers issue we have been writing about.


    https://www.cbr.com/avengers-black-p...knight-attack/
    Pretty interesting read. Thanks.
    The spider is always on the hunt.

  15. #3750
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
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    Courtesy of Ture from the HEF. This is powerful:


    Quote Originally Posted by Ture
    It's a lazy afternoon
    Just a kind of a day made for lovin' you
    Soon the evening breezes will start to blow
    Baby, grab your hat now 'cause here we go

    I love the things you do
    And the way that I feel when I'm close to you
    I have dreamed so long, is it really so?
    Baby, grab your hat now 'cause here we go


    He loved this song the first time he heard Monica singing it. She knew she was doing a cover of a cherished classic and worked hard to ensure her iteration would be both signature and respectful of the original. Though originally sung as a duet Monica recorded it solo and debuted it at number one where its been for the past several weeks.

    He enjoyed listening to Soul and R&B music and made a point to do so every visit he made to the States. The Kimoyo bead on his wrist beamed the music right to his ears. While walking the streets he turned off the difussers and white noise buffers so to be alert as he traversed the city to his destination... the Wakandan embassy.

    Crossing a main thoroughfare he noticed a small crowd confronting several police officers. Though it was out of his way he walked over to see what the commotion was all about. His eyes widened at the site of a handcuffed man lying face down in the street with a police officer's knee on his neck slowly strangling him. The man gasped "I can't breathe!"

    A half dozen questions raced through his mind. What kind of hatred provoked this? What kind of evil coward is this constable? Why aren't the other officers stopping this? Why don't the onlookers rush these police? Why do these events happen so often in this country? What should he do? Without thinking he pushes through the crowd and kicks the kneeling officer in the chest.

    He hears Monica say "Baby don't stop, don't you dare, no" as he choke slams an onrushing policeman. The crowd cheers and he ducks under the swing of police baton and punches the officer in the throat. The fourth policeman he downs with a flying knee to the chin rendering the officer unconscious. By now news crews have come on the scene and social media is abuzz.

    The kneeling officer gets his gun out and starts to point it at him but people from the crowd stand between the two. News crews filming. More police arrive as do the paramedics. A tense standoff is averted when the police commissioner orders his man to lower his firearm. The police commissioner then says you are under arrest for assaulting a police officer.

    Someone in the crowd yells he assaulted more than one. He kicked four cops' asses. Another person in the crowd states that if you arrest him you got to arrest all of us. He sees their bravery and recognizes their solidarity but it is the man whom he saved that brings a tear to his eye. Standing the man mouths the words thank you. He tells the crowd he will go with the police alone.

    Downtown police headquarters is a media frenzy. He is placed in an interrogation cell for questioning. They threaten him with lengthy jail sentences and violence. He remains silent and their hostility grows. A few minutes more pass and in walks Everett K. Ross. Don't say anything. I'm your lawyer. Ross then says my client and I need the room to debrief. Please leave.

    Well you certainly got yourself in one hell of a situation mister. The charges range from interfering with the police while performing their duty to assaulting a police officer. Hell, I think we'll need to call in Matt Murdock just to get this reduced to twenty five years with no parole says Ross. That will not be necessary so speaks a voice from a dark corner.

    T'Challa the Black Panther materializes from the shadows. Wait a minute, is this young man Wakandan? asks Ross. No, he's from Kansas T'Challa replies sarcastically. My king I was on my way to the embassy to meet you when circumstances diverted me says he. I am aware of what transpired and you acted appropriately T'Challa affirms.

    We will take our leave Agent Ross. No... your highness. Please, you can't just leave. We have to explain what happened. I am not in the habit of explaining myself nor the actions of my people, especially to those accustomed to turning a blind eye and allowing such atrocities to occur in the first place T'Challa states matter of factually.



    Your highness, you could help put a stop to this if you let this young man testify says Ross. Mr Ross, do you know the name of the man who was being brutally assaulted? he asks. Yes. His name is George Floyd. Out of respect for this man and for the bravery of the people and honor of this Wakandan we will go to your courts agent Ross. Shall I call Matt Murdock? Ross asks. What for? T'Challa questions. I will defend this young Wakandan personally.

    Please explain to your government that he and I are leaving under the laws of diplomatic immunity and shall return in three weeks for the trial. Also inform them that he whose name is George Floyd is under my protection along with every bystander present at this attempted execution. T'Challa the Black Panther gestures and the one called he walks to his king and they disappear into the darkness.

    Three weeks later at the trial

    Would you please state your name for the record asks King T'Challa. My name is N'Kano. Did you assault the police officers in question? Yes I did. Why did you do this? They were attempting to kill a man whose name is George Floyd. Objection. There was no evidence that the man whose name is George Floyd life was in jeopardy.

    Sustained. Very well I will present evidence via a recording made by a Kimoyo bead that shows the life signs of the man whose name is George Floyd were in fact in peril states King T'Challa. Here we see compression of the neck that is causing an increasingly hypoxic state in the brain. Concurrent with this we see traumatic asphyxia occurring due to said compression of the thoracic cavity. Had N'Kano not intervened the result would have been unconsciousness followed by death. To further clarify our findings I bring doctors Reed Richards and Henry Pym to corroborate both the tech and physical diagnosis respectively.

    In closing I ask this of the jury. If N'Kano had not intervened on the murderous police officers performing their duties the man whose name is George Floyd would have been killed and for no more reason than hatred and indifference. Assaulting a police officer is against the law in this country but should it be if the police are wrong in both purpose of arrest or detainment and in the execution of duty. Black lives are the matter and don't require your permission to exist. We shall forever remember the man whose name is George Floyd.
    [/size]

    Last edited by Ezyo1000; 06-02-2020 at 04:31 PM.

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