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  1. #4216
    Incredible Member Vibranium Weave's Avatar
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    Look, I think the Wakanda Design Group should be responsible for much of the Wakandan gear. I love the Wakanda Design Group (shot out to Busiek for creating it).

    I also feel it would be a good idea for either T'Challa to have a close hand on his OWN PERSONAL GEAR or a Wakandan he can completely trust (like Shuri or Taku). To keep the tech/design safe and out of the wrong hands.

  2. #4217
    Formerly Assassin Spider Huntsman Spider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    It likely doesn't effect BP sales either. Because neither actually are Mary Sue's. People just use the term incorrectly to knock characters they don't happen to be fond of.
    Pretty much, yeah, especially nowadays when many of those characters are perceived by their detractors as benefiting from an "undeserved" promotion compared to characters who've been around (and more prominent) for much longer.
    The spider is always on the hunt.

  3. #4218
    Ultimate Member MindofShadow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vibranium Weave View Post

    I say it again: I find it funny that people do not want T'Challa to be similar to Tony Stark, but have no problem with him being a knock-off Cap America or Daredevil. Why ??????
    Why are you making up stuff to be outraged about? Nobody said this. Or any derivative of it.

    Was Priest Panther a knock off Cap/DD to you or something?

    I just want the next Black Panther run to be a GOOD Black Panther run with the REAL T'Challa.
    God, shit is so bad i'd settle for 'this is fine" lol

    Instead of being pissed at every single issue for the last 5 years.
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  4. #4219
    Incredible Member Vibranium Weave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MindofShadow View Post
    Why are you making up stuff to be outraged about? Nobody said this. Or any derivative of it.

    Was Priest Panther a knock off Cap/DD to you or something?
    All the talk about stripping away tech so he's not like Iron Man and all the talk about he should mainly/only rely on his skills. That is were those statements come from (this was said by several people in the board).

    Let T'Challa be the character Priest, Hudlin, and Lee/Kriby intended him to be ( which is what Rise of the Black Panther gave us).

    Quote Originally Posted by MindofShadow View Post
    God, shit is so bad i'd settle for 'this is fine" lol

    Instead of being pissed at every single issue for the last 5 years.

    Let's hope for the best lol. If BP gets another run, we should try not to settle for mediocre or sub-par. Black panther is considered by many (even mainstream comic fan boys) to be a top tier hero. Marvel just needs to treat him like one in the comics. It can happen, let's not lose sight of this. Let the comic portrayal be even more positive depiction than the MCU version ( or elicit the same pride & strength from the comics as we feel for the MCU movie).


    I too have been disappointed in BP depiction for the last 4 yrs, but hopefully better things are around the corner lol.

  5. #4220
    Mighty Member Ekie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chief12d View Post
    Yea a mixture of both is the right approach. T'Challa should be competent enough to hold his own in the lab with Reed but where he really should shine is in unorthodox situations where innovation and strategy is key.

    The best example being his fight against Iron Man. Between a vibranium suit, kinetic energy redirection, energy daggers, and Kimoyo T'Challa should be able to handle most threats with standard gear and if needed make stuff on the fly. The only thing is it requires a creative writer with an eye for the unconventional to make it work within the story.
    Exacy, Tchalla is not reed. He has no interest in sitting in a lab and tinkering which is why he has others to do that for him. But when pushed to do so he is more than capable of keeping up with and being an intellectual peer to Reed. Where Tchalla outshines Reed is in his cunning and ingenuity. This has been established by almost every single writer that has touched the character. The difference between being a super genius and being some trashy version of James Bond is the fact that Tchalla is a Super genius. What's next? Are we going to have fans clamoring to turn him into the next MacGyver too?
    He's one of the most brilliant minds on the Marvel Earth as stated by many Comics and characters. And if we (his true fans) don't ride for that then we sure as heck shouldn't expect the massive amount of un-fans that wants to take him down a peg or see him as having "too much" to respect that fact.
    Last edited by Ekie; 06-27-2020 at 06:18 PM.

  6. #4221
    Mighty Member Ekie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vibranium Weave View Post
    If the goal was to focus of BP's abilities as a fighter and a strategist, then he would be more akin to Captain America, or Daredevil for that matter.

    All heroes have to have some type of fighting and strategy skills, unless that are immensely powerful (i.e. Thor, Hulk, Superman, Silver Surfer, etc.)

    I find it funny that people do not want T'Challa to be similar to Tony Stark, but have no problem with him being a knock-off Cap America or Daredevil. Why ??????
    Question I'm trying to figure out as well. Some knockoff version of wolverine with resources

  7. #4222
    Mighty Member Ekie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezyo1000 View Post
    You DO know that in Panther quest, Redjack had T'Challa invent things and show off his super genius right? In the very first episode when they were dealing with the sea monster, T'Challa and Tony were shown figuring out how the conch shell worked to control the creature, all throughout the series, he was creating things, Shuri was just the one who was primarily shown tinkering because she had the time to do it. Bit the tech T'Challa used against Thor? The panther suit against Tony? Pretty much all of his gear except for the stealth gear (I believe Shuri created that upgrade for him) were his own creation. Shuri had a role but both T'Challa abd Shuri were polymaths.. so what's wrong with PQ version??
    I agree, I thought Panthers quest did it right. Shuri was still a standout character without having to water down black panther to make her look good. She was smart, fierce, capable, and funny.
    Last edited by Ekie; 06-27-2020 at 06:18 PM.

  8. #4223
    Extraordinary Member Mike_Murdock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    I think sometimes people look at Priests run with overly rosey glasses, because from a political standpoint politics in Wakanda was pretty darn messy. They were constantly on the verge of tribal warfare. Wakanda wasn't really near utopian until Hudlin.
    I would argue the messiness was one of the things that made it interesting. I think Hudlin's retcon was a fun, bold take, but it made Wakanda less nuanced overall.
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  9. #4224
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vibranium Weave View Post
    It's been awhile since I watched the show, so maybe I didn't remember all of his scientific/engineering abilities that were demonstrated. If he did do all of these things, that's good.

    But the video from YouTube I was referencing said the movie version not PQ cartoon show.

    Just give me a T'Challa using pretty much the same gear & skill from "Rise" and I am good for the next run. Evan did a good job in that book.
    I honestly feel that if in the first BP movie, they made it clear that T'Challa was a polymath and clear on the stuff he made (more then just the comment about his design for then habit, maybe if he mentioned that he was impressed with how well Shuri was doing in the Wakandan design group since she took over from him when he became BP) that This wouldn't even be an issue at all and people wouldn't be so worried. In personally not to bothered, I know he is a genius, but I would like to see more Priest/Hudlin Panther abd see the 10 steps ahead we know and love

  10. #4225
    Uncanny Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike_Murdock View Post
    I would argue the messiness was one of the things that made it interesting. I think Hudlin's retcon was a fun, bold take, but it made Wakanda less nuanced overall.
    Hudlin actually didn't spend a whole lot of time in Wakanda anyways, so I suppose it didn't need to be as nuanced. It was less a political thriller and more a fun action packed Saturday morning cartoon.

    That said, I wouldn't mind if they brought a bit more of the internal conflict we saw in Priests run back. It helps Wakanda itself feel more like a character rather than just a setting.

  11. #4226
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vibranium Weave View Post
    All the talk about stripping away tech so he's not like Iron Man and all the talk about he should mainly/only rely on his skills. That is were those statements come from (this was said by several people in the board).

    Let T'Challa be the character Priest, Hudlin, and Lee/Kriby intended him to be ( which is what Rise of the Black Panther gave us).




    Let's hope for the best lol. If BP gets another run, we should try not to settle for mediocre or sub-par. Black panther is considered by many (even mainstream comic fan boys) to be a top tier hero. Marvel just needs to treat him like one in the comics. It can happen, let's not lose sight of this. Let the comic portrayal be even more positive depiction than the MCU version ( or elicit the same pride & strength from the comics as we feel for the MCU movie).


    I too have been disappointed in BP depiction for the last 4 yrs, but hopefully better things are around the corner lol.
    I think the thing to remember, is Priest, Hudlin, Lee, and Kirby, all let people know that he was a genius, however, he mainly relied on his skill, prep and 2 steps ahead to beat his opponents. Hell his intro fro. The FF he beat them all with prep, that's what he is known for, prepping and thinking on the fly. He's not Tony or Cap. He is T'Challa, the man with the plan, who has contingencies for his contingencies. His greatest weapon is his mind, and he utilizes all aspects of it perfectly

  12. #4227
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ekie View Post
    Exacy, Tchalla is not reed. He has no interest in sitting in a lab and tinkering which is why he has others to do that for him. But when pushed to do so he is more than capable of keeping up with and being an intellectual peer to Reed. Where Tchalla outshines Reed is in his cunning and ingenuity. This has been established by almost every single writer that has touched the character. The difference between being a super genius and being some trashy version of James Bond is the fact that Tchalla is a Super genius. What's next? Are we going to have fans clamoring to turn him into the next MacGyver too?
    He's one of the most brilliant minds on the Marvel Earth as stated by many Comics and characters. And if we (his true fans) don't ride for that then we sure as heck shouldn't expect the massive amount of un-fans that wants to take him down a peg or see him as having "too much" to respect that fact.
    All I have seen here from all of us fans here, the thing we can all agree on is that T'Challa is a super genius and that should be highlighted the way it's been shown on Priest and Hudlins era.

  13. #4228
    Mighty Member dkrook's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vibranium Weave View Post
    All the talk about stripping away tech so he's not like Iron Man and all the talk about he should mainly/only rely on his skills. That is were those statements come from (this was said by several people in the board).

    Let T'Challa be the character Priest, Hudlin, and Lee/Kriby intended him to be ( which is what Rise of the Black Panther gave us).




    Let's hope for the best lol. If BP gets another run, we should try not to settle for mediocre or sub-par. Black panther is considered by many (even mainstream comic fan boys) to be a top tier hero. Marvel just needs to treat him like one in the comics. It can happen, let's not lose sight of this. Let the comic portrayal be even more positive depiction than the MCU version ( or elicit the same pride & strength from the comics as we feel for the MCU movie).


    I too have been disappointed in BP depiction for the last 4 yrs, but hopefully better things are around the corner lol.
    There's nothing wrong with anything that you stated. Some have kind of voiced things that seem close to wanting mute BP in a way that takes away from his skills. Funny thing is nobody really talks about Batman being uber everything taking away from how writers are able to use him. You know what happens. They write stories that actually challenge the man that's smarter than all the geniuses, and fights better than all the world's best, to the point where there are many different books of just him. So yeah let him be the one with skills beyond his peers and people that are paid good money do their job.

  14. #4229
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike_Murdock View Post
    I would argue the messiness was one of the things that made it interesting. I think Hudlin's retcon was a fun, bold take, but it made Wakanda less nuanced overall.
    Like with anything it comes down to implementation. There are some characterizations of Wakanda from the Priest run that would be considered objectively distasteful nowadays. In his attempt to provide “authenticity” for the Black Panther mythology he left some elements that are more or less ignored in other adaptations, most notably the status of the Dora Milaje. So it depends on what type of messiness we’re discussing. Tribal conflict is fine, we’ve been getting that even in the Hudlin run. Tensions between the nobility as well. Religious conflict too.

    So I think Wakanda has remained as nuanced as it was since the retcon. If anything it gave it more depth and history than previous iterations. It gave it a presence that adds weight to T’Challa’s station as king and gave him the feat of being a genius among geniuses, as opposed to the “one great man” trope he originally had.

  15. #4230
    Oblio Kurt Busiek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vibranium Weave View Post
    Look, I think the Wakanda Design Group should be responsible for much of the Wakandan gear. I love the Wakanda Design Group (shot out to Busiek for creating it).
    I don't think that was me -- I think I got it from the Marvel Handbook?

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