Black Panther Appreciation 2020

[Cville]

That sounds right.

I think Vita wrote the Ironheart issues too right where Shuri cameod?

Nah, Eve Ewing did all 12 issues.

[XPac]

Yeah we did, and we also got a lot of bullshit from it while they were married and still to this day, a decade after the marriage ended, we still are suffering from the same bullshit.

The marriage was not worth the trouble that Storm has caused to T'Challa and the mythos, and now writers and fans assume she deserves something from the franchise even though she ain't apart of it. Notice how in recent years all her major power ups or focus arcs revolve around Wakanda? What has she brought to T'Challa and his mythos to return the goodwill? Shit talking abd shade throwing... What has she actually contributed to the mythos?

Well, that's the thing ... marrying them makes her apart of the mythos. You can disagree with that, but marvel obviously doesn't. So she deserves whatever marvel decides she deserves. Future writers of course may feel differently and that's entirely their prerogative.

[XPac]

Yup. Don't blame Hudlin for the X-offices and Marvel's lack of vision regarding what could have been the ultimate power couple in the MU.

The thing is, they could have been a power couple without being married.

Don't get me wrong ... I get wanting to see them together. I still do. But its logistically harder to maintain the relationship because 2 sides need to agree to it. And marrying them makes any shift in direction a lot messier. If they are just dating, its potentially a lot cleaner to break things off anytime one or both sides decide they want something different.

Hudlin took a gamble, and IMO it was a gamble worth taking. But in hindsight the end results really weren't that shocking.

[MindofShadow]

Hudlin didn't make a mistake. He did nothing wrong. The only place blame lies is with others who couldn't handle it.

Hudlin: I am going to marry the two biggest black characters to elevate them both.

X-Office: HOW DARE YOU! We have big plans for Storm!!!!

Hudlin: ... that doesn't affect your plans for storm at all. Just use Storm then?

X-Office: *throws tantrum* eventually gets what they want

Fans: Ok what were those Storm plans

X-Office: ........

[chief12d]

you have to have a writer that likes him for that to happen.

Coates, Gay, Vita, and the rest of the crew don't give a shit about him. He is the popular prop to bring in eyeballs while they focus on the characters they like or the ideas they like.

There have been things from all writers of BP that I haven't liked. Whether it is Don's monologues of doom. Kirby's zaniness, Priest's pretty terrible ending, Hudlin bringing in Storm, Mayberry and his doom fetish, Aaron and his wolverine fetish, Hickman and his F4 fetish, Liss premise that made no sense, Narcisse tried t odo too much, etc.

But they all still seemed to like Black Panther... they just had different ideas with what to do with the character. Or in Priest case, he was just a professional veteran comic writer.

The last 5 years, it has FELT like a lot o fhte peeps writing the main and spin off books actually likes the dude. At all.

Which is weird because, comic wise... he is a pretty noble dude. He is a king that constantly goes above nad beyond to save the world, not jus this nation (he could easily isolate and develop a super power). He is constantly trying to drag Wakanda out of its isolation/xenophobic ways. His moral compass is pure as hell. He isn't a murder. He isn't a vigilante. He doesn't bang a different chick every week (dudes had... 2? love interests ever?). He has no "dark past" he is trying to correct. He is the opposite of a walking black male stereotype.

So why don't they like him mane lol? Or at least tolerate him enough to leave him alone? Some deep seated psychological shit going on or something.

A fear/mistrust of competent straight black men. Projecting the attitudes and stereotypes of the worst among black men onto those that rise above that noise. Very common on black twitter so it was only a matter of time before some of them slipped into the comic industry. I don't even think this is a black male issue as I think they'd find a way to make plain ol' Superman and Krypton look like sexist, aloof asses if they got the chance lol.

T'Challa is the antithesis of every male stereotype yet the writers who seem to be taking him on nowadays clearly see him as a means to deconstruct Western society and cultural values. Now Priest and Hudlin did this too, but the story wasn't preoccupied with the commentary and allegory nor did it cast aspersions on the main hero or require him to be feckless. There's no end to the T'Challa deconstruction because they believe society is irredeemable and can never be fixed.

[Overhazard]

A fear/mistrust of competent straight black men. Projecting the attitudes and stereotypes of the worst among black men onto those that rise above that noise. Very common on black twitter so it was only a matter of time before some of them slipped into the comic industry. I don't even think this is a black male issue as I think they'd find a way to make plain ol' Superman and Krypton look like sexist, aloof asses if they got the chance lol.

T'Challa is the antithesis of every male stereotype yet the writers who seem to be taking him on nowadays clearly see him as a means to deconstruct Western society and cultural values. Now Priest and Hudlin did this too, but the story wasn't preoccupied with the commentary and allegory nor did it cast aspersions on the main hero or require him to be feckless. There's no end to the T'Challa deconstruction because they believe society is irredeemable and can never be fixed.

Coates is too cynical to write Superman, but if he did, he would probably try to make him an insecure mess around the women in his life, even though he's always respected and been attracted to strong women. Being scolded like a child, or since he's superman, have him be beaten up all the time like Aaron did with Thor.

I do think there is some projection and a lack of research involved when it comes to Black Panther. I guess if the writers think that they can browbeat and humble T'challa enough, he'll become the person they want him to be. That's what twitter thinks it's doing, holding people accountable when it really hits people with a deluge of shame. Shame isn't a motivator, it makes people do one of two things. Dig their heels in and fight back, or withdraw altogether.

[Frontier]

Coates is too cynical to write Superman, but if he did, he would probably try to make him an insecure mess around the women in his life, even though he's always respected and been attracted to strong women. Being scolded like a child, or since he's superman, have him be beaten up all the time like Aaron did with Thor.

I didn't really notice this as a trend with Coates until I saw how he wrote Captain America around the Daughters of Liberty.

[Ezyo1000]

Hudlin didn't make a mistake. He did nothing wrong. The only place blame lies is with others who couldn't handle it.

I mean, I don't Blame him for it because he was trying to do something cool and while he was writing them he did write them well. Same with McDuffie. BUT, what we have gotten the for the following decade after he was done writing BP, it's not worth it. So when I say mistake, its more of a hindsight is 2020. Like if he knew how others would treat the mythos going forward he probably would of just made a LI that the franchise has full control over without issue. Or at least of he chose say, Monica rambeau instead, no one would of frakked with it. X office is just petty AF and pairing Monica up probably would of opened her up to more popularity

[Ezyo1000]

Well, that's the thing ... marrying them makes her apart of the mythos. You can disagree with that, but marvel obviously doesn't. So she deserves whatever marvel decides she deserves. Future writers of course may feel differently and that's entirely their prerogative.

Tell me, what has Storm actually contributed to the mythos? What has she brought to it that makes T'Challa and Wakanda better? Because frankly all she has done is taken from it to bolster her own stories and throw shade. So what has she done to enhance T'Challas character arcs or boost his power?

[Anthony Shaw]

She'd steal from anyone if it were necessary. Sometimes that's part of the job. If its potentially some sort of world saving thing, you do what you gotta do and apologize for it later.

Let me know when x-writers do a story where Storm steals from her ivory sisters.

[XPac]

Tell me, what has Storm actually contributed to the mythos? What has she brought to it that makes T'Challa and Wakanda better? Because frankly all she has done is taken from it to bolster her own stories and throw shade. So what has she done to enhance T'Challas character arcs or boost his power?

Like I said, I enjoyed their time together. I think the power couple vibe was fun. And it gave a love interest which allowed us to get a more humanized BP than we have had since McGreggor paired him with Monica. Its occasionally nice to see him not as a super hero or a king but as a human being. And I don't think any character has managed to do that better then Storm, and I say that including Monica.

With her, he made for a more well rounded character. As fun as it is to get Superman, it's nice to see a bit more Clark Kent too. And Storm was the vehicle used to see that side of him.

[Anthony Shaw]

Which is weird because, comic wise... he is a pretty noble dude. He is a king that constantly goes above nad beyond to save the world, not jus this nation (he could easily isolate and develop a super power). He is constantly trying to drag Wakanda out of its isolation/xenophobic ways. His moral compass is pure as hell. He isn't a murder. He isn't a vigilante. He doesn't bang a different chick every week (dudes had... 2? love interests ever?). He has no "dark past" he is trying to correct. He is the opposite of a walking black male stereotype.

So why don't they like him mane lol? Or at least tolerate him enough to leave him alone? Some deep seated psychological shit going on or something.

I just can't wrap my head around the need to tear the character down.

[XPac]

Let me know when x-writers do a story where Storm steals from her ivory sisters.

I don't think that's a story we'll ever get, because I'm not sure they have anything worth stealing in a world saving capacity. But if they did, she won look d so it.

Heroes do what they gotta do. If the rules were reversed and Tchalla needed to steal something from Krakoa I'm sure he'd do it. Its sometimes a part of the job.

[XPac]

I just can't wrap my head around the need to tear the character down.

Same reason they deconstruct many of his peers. Thor, Cap, Iron Man ... if you look at their last couple years, they have had it pretty rough too. How many of them have lost mantles or their powers or even their lives?

Part of it is that I think writers today want to put their characters through the ringer. It's not enough to have them fight and ultimately beat the same villains they've beaten a dozen times before. I think the level of conflict has had the bar raised in recent years.

The other issue I think being a concerted effort to push diversity in the form of legacy characters. But for Sam and Jane and Miles and Shuri and Iron Heart to get their opening, the originals often have to take a temporary hit to give them a bit of spotlight.

[chief12d]

Let me know when x-writers do a story where Storm steals from her ivory sisters.

What I tend to find funny about this situation is that this is spun as a "YAAS QUEEN" moment because it's Storm deciding to put herself and her people before a man and his kingdom. Yet this story is almost certainly set up for said man and his kingdom to play an even bigger role in Storm's life in a future storyline lol.

Whether they reconcile and end up back together is anyone's guess (I doubt it) but it's ironic that of the two major Storm-centric stories with the X-Men one of them relates to her ex and the upcoming story will likely do the same. For a woman who doesn't need T'Challa Storm is sure milking her relevance off of him and his mythos. This is a classic case of fans not knowing what they want other than baseless gratification. I get it, but it's funny the way these stories are perceived.