Black Panther Appreciation 2020

[chief12d]

I cant follow that. They were an exploration team looking for the source of the meteor. I think twelve or so in the picture of the mission briefing. They weren't going to establish a colony so I dont think they could hold out from any organized attack. Especially if they were already starving.

I think Coates might have intended for it to be a proper colony as potential was established in Hickmans ending, but that not the story he told.

That's what the story said. I agree it doesn't make sense as I don't think 12 is enough to start a sizeable human colony, let alone a human-dominated space empire. But we're told they ended up establishing a stable presence in space, tried to be peaceful, got invaded a few times, then decided to be warmongers. Outside the starting population I can't say that it doesn't make sense.

[Paul Muad'Dib]

this video is for Marvel... your employees took something from me...
i want what's mine..

Coates & Coogler...

[Paul Muad'Dib]

These are very flimsy arguments, you can't copyright ideas. The influences on the movie were blatantly from the comics, Shakka wearing a headgear and Killmonger wearing an African mask prove nothing and parody/satire need to be explicit nothing in those pictures screams either, it reads like it's serious. And one pic is a normal sized Black Panther fighting a big Black Panther. If you had a case against Marvel this would be in court but it's not - this would laughed out of court. What's the point of defending it on a comic book forum? You have talent, it's sad to see it wasted like this. The fact that characters have dragon scales and things like that prove nothing. They're not even identical. Movies spend years in development with concepts and designs, everything didn't just materialise on screen when the movie came out in theatres. I'd say get a lawyer but I doubt one would touch this because it's silly, and any lawyer who did would be a waste of money.

i dont need to speak on it at all...

the ish speaks for it self

still undisputed

[Ezyo1000]

Ultimately Coates has really ruined Wakanda. Making them colonizers before the west, having them going into the future and being slave driver's and conquerors and has taken the mystery of Wakanda away and replaced with it with real world bullshit.

I don't care for it and hope we get another Hudlin to come in and erase this garbage

[dkrook]

Ultimately Coates has really ruined Wakanda. Making them colonizers before the west, having them going into the future and being slave driver's and conquerors and has taken the mystery of Wakanda away and replaced with it with real world bullshit.

I don't care for it and hope we get another Hudlin to come in and erase this garbage

Bro at this point man I will take any non woke writer that likes comics.

[Devaishwarya]

Ultimately Coates has really ruined Wakanda. Making them colonizers before the west, having them going into the future and being slave driver's and conquerors and has taken the mystery of Wakanda away and replaced with it with real world bullshit.

I don't care for it and hope we get another Hudlin to come in and erase this garbage

As far as I'm concerned...none of that "shyt and effery" ever happened. The entirety of that garbage run never happened. Coates never happened. I gave my BP first season run to a comic retailer to "dispose of as he sees fit". So for me, personally, it just doesn't exist.

Yes..."if it's on the page it's canon" but as with EVERYthing written in comics...Coates' BP can be re-written, retconned, or just simply ignored. It's not as though anything he's written has had any impact whatsoever on the rest of the MU...and no impact on what was written up to the point before Coates came on board. And the great thing about his "revisionist" writing is that the revision could be revised simply by saying Tetu (?) was just some old, disgruntled, mad twat who, for reasons, hated the current system and re-fabricated the history of Wakanda and the Gods...but none of it is true. Done. And Done.

This entire run can easily go the way of Doomtrash...that is, completely ignored and forgotten.

[chief12d]

As far as I'm concerned...none of that "shyt and effery" ever happened. The entirety of that garbage run never happened. Coates never happened. I gave my BP first season run to a comic retailer to "dispose of as he sees fit". So for me, personally, it just doesn't exist.

Yes..."if it's on the page it's canon" but as with EVERYthing written in comics...Coates' BP can be re-written, retconned, or just simply ignored. It's not as though anything he's written has had any impact whatsoever on the rest of the MU...and no impact on what was written up to the point before Coates came on board. And the great thing about his "revisionist" writing is that the revision could be revised simply by saying Tetu (?) was just some old, disgruntled, mad twat who, for reasons, hated the current system and re-fabricated the history of Wakanda and the Gods...but none of it is true. Done. And Done.

This entire run can easily go the way of Doomtrash...that is, completely ignored and forgotten.

This. Hence why it's insanely important that the next writer that Marvel brings on isn't one of Coates' acolytes and instead someone willing to go in a more conventional direction. Most of the stuff in this run can easily be retconned, retooled, and ignored, it just takes a writer with a vastly different vision and a non-"woke" approach to take those measures. But if we get a Nnedi Okorafor or Roxane Gay on the book most of these portrayals of Wakanda and T'Challa will be doubled down on and expanded.

[skyvolt2000]

This. Hence why it's insanely important that the next writer that Marvel brings on isn't one of Coates' acolytes and instead someone willing to go in a more conventional direction. Most of the stuff in this run can easily be retconned, retooled, and ignored, it just takes a writer with a vastly different vision and a non-"woke" approach to take those measures. But if we get a Nnedi Okorafor or Roxane Gay on the book most of these portrayals of Wakanda and T'Challa will be doubled down on and expanded.

Well with rumors of DC folks looking for work-Marvel might have their choice of writers since they blew it with Ram V and Redjack.

[Vanguard]

nope.

it makes no sense for a culture built on DEFENSE and SELF ISOLATION to magically mutate into one of expansion and conquest.

it scratches a weird cultural itch some black folks seem to have but it runs exactly counter to the established culture of Wakanda.

Colonizers are the bad guys. Becoming the colonizers makes us what?

Sorry. Hard pass on space wakanda.

I agree. Space Wakanda is not something that would interest me as a reader.

[dkrook]

Well with rumors of DC folks looking for work-Marvel might have their choice of writers since they blew it with Ram V and Redjack.

Lol, right however my issue is the only folk I trust coming to a BP book were the guns for hire like John Ridley, and Redjack. That's just me though, who would you like to see from DC on Black Panther book?

[chief12d]

Saladin Ahmed would be interesting. I haven't heard a lot about Miles Morales or his Ms. Marvel run, but his Black Bolt was great. It was a little deconstructive, BB was a little out of his element, but he wasn't a bumbling doofus. Aaron...no. Aaron on BP is not a good idea. His Thor run was a deconstruction that ran too long.

Why exactly do writers like Ayala hate Black Panther so much anyway? Is it because they're X-fans first and they feel that he took Storm from them? The character the X-books love to prop up but don't actually do anything with half the time.

At the risk of sounding like an anti-"SJW" I think part of it is some of these creators are too woke. Writers like Roxane Gay and Coates think that inaccurately depicting T'Challa is a correction for past white supremacy and misogyny that pervaded the times he was created and in the present day. They believe male heroes are fundamentally problematic and need to be deconstructed so as to wrestle with this legacy.

So they turn them into punching bags (both figurative and literal) for their own political views as funneled through morally superior, often times female characters. And as a far-left liberal myself, in isolation I don't have an issue with those views, I have an issue with the main protagonist being mischaracterized and largely ineffective every arc to push a certain view. Priest and Hudlin both incorporated scathing social commentary and pro-black beliefs without alienating the core audience or condemning T'Challa. Coates and his friends can't push a single theme or political position without shitting on him.

Because they view T'Challa as part of the problem, not the solution to the issues they (and I'm sure some of us) see in the world. He's a man and he's wealthy, he pals around with "problematic" white heroes like Iron Man, so in their minds T'Challa is irredeemable. The only reason they get books like BP is because Marvel doesn't care about the brand enough to realize they're bringing in folks that have name recognition, but no genuine desire to advance the IP. And because Marvel would never put a woman like Roxane Gay on Thor. They know **** like that won't survive under fan scrutiny. Besides, a good deal of these writers' supporters want them to call out black men, not white men.

[Ezyo1000]

This. Hence why it's insanely important that the next writer that Marvel brings on isn't one of Coates' acolytes and instead someone willing to go in a more conventional direction. Most of the stuff in this run can easily be retconned, retooled, and ignored, it just takes a writer with a vastly different vision and a non-"woke" approach to take those measures. But if we get a Nnedi Okorafor or Roxane Gay on the book most of these portrayals of Wakanda and T'Challa will be doubled down on and expanded.

I agree it is really easy to Retcon it. I have a whole story idea based around just that.. I think the biggest issue is that it's still going to be around. Yes DW is forgotten but we still see mention of it. Unless there was a story spun to specifically take Coates story and expand it aka retcon it on panel by taking the concepts and changing them for the story. It will still e around.

I just want someone who writes comics and like BP. Do t care about their race or gender or whatever. So long as they like him, want to elevate him and his world and tell the most badass BP stories

[Ezyo1000]

At the risk of sounding like an anti-"SJW" I think part of it is some of these creators are too woke. Writers like Roxane Gay and Coates think that inaccurately depicting T'Challa is a correction for past white supremacy and misogyny that pervaded the times he was created and in the present day. They believe male heroes are fundamentally problematic and need to be deconstructed so as to wrestle with this legacy.

So they turn them into punching bags (both figurative and literal) for their own political views as funneled through morally superior, often times female characters. And as a far-left liberal myself, in isolation I don't have an issue with those views, I have an issue with the main protagonist being mischaracterized and largely ineffective every arc to push a certain view. Priest and Hudlin both incorporated scathing social commentary and pro-black beliefs without alienating the core audience or condemning T'Challa. Coates and his friends can't push a single theme or political position without shitting on him.

Because they view T'Challa as part of the problem, not the solution to the issues they (and I'm sure some of us) see in the world. He's a man and he's wealthy, he pals around with "problematic" white heroes like Iron Man, so in their minds T'Challa is irredeemable. The only reason they get books like BP is because Marvel doesn't care about the brand enough to realize they're bringing in folks that have name recognition, but no genuine desire to advance the IP. And because Marvel would never put a woman like Roxane Gay on Thor. They know **** like that won't survive under fan scrutiny. Besides, a good deal of these writers' supporters want them to call out black men, not white men.

I agree with this. They see Black men as part of the problem and ignore the fact that black men and black women both have it bad. But on their mind it's a zero sum game. And to me they are part of the problem.

They think it has to be a paradigm shift to where how Blacks were treated by whites and now how they treat whites and that stupid. Instead of focusing on equal respect they want to be at the top. They kinda remind me of Erik. He had the right idea to some extent but the method in which they go about it is all wrong.

T'Challa represents what they want his whole mythos but they want to sabotage it and instead of focus on the excellence they torpedo it abd start placing all the racist isht they say they hate right into the mythos to tell a woe is me story.

Case in point the BP Solo movie. Before it dropped they were going on about how it better not show dysfunction and pitting black men vs women. Ans then after it dropped they were going on about how the sequel shoe literally do the things they said the first shouldn't do on an attempt to get Shuri on the throne or for Ayo and Aneka/ Okoye to break away from T'Challa and the throne with the DM telling Coates story...

[Devaishwarya]

Lol, right however my issue is the only folk I trust coming to a BP book were the guns for hire like John Ridley, and Redjack. That's just me though, who would you like to see from DC on Black Panther book?

Honestly...I have no idea as I don't read any DC these days...so I have no clue who's the next best thing to Snyder and Tynion IV (that said...Ram V is getting great reviews for his work on Catwoman)

What I don't want is another "J-oke" writer of any race and/or sex. I've had enough badly written Faux-ke shittery to last me several comic book lifetimes and multidimensions. Any writer coming onto BP needs to be vetted HARD!!!

The great irony is...writers of Black characters don't have to try so damned hard to get their messages across to a Black audience/readership...WE get it. We understand. We live the message. It's the other writers who direct the other non-minority franchises to up their storytelling game for their non-minority readership. (From the very little I've read, Slott, Aaron, Cates are not interested in peddling "wokeness"...and quite frankly, I can't blame them. They just want to tell "bad-ass" stories with their favourite characters doing "bad-ass" things. And that's what WE all really want to read. Save the preaching for the pulpit.)

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Chief and Ezyo GET it.

[Besouro]

Ultimately Coates has really ruined Wakanda. Making them colonizers before the west, having them going into the future and being slave driver's and conquerors and has taken the mystery of Wakanda away and replaced with it with real world bullshit.

I don't care for it and hope we get another Hudlin to come in and erase this garbage

Here, here... Yibombe!!