Rachel (Grey) Summers: Phoenix II Appreciation 2020

[loke13]

Tbh I think this is one of Rachel's better outfits def a lot better than her Prestige wear and that godforsaken turky coat.

[Havok83]

Rachel gets to interact with spoilers:

Cable today and they use their TP together

end of spoilers

[Askani5]

Rachel gets to interact with spoilers:

Cable today and they use their TP together

end of spoilers

Glad to see her get some screen time. I was hoping they would incorporate the Phoenix sword somehow and reforge it into a psimitar.

[Askani's Flame]

Rachel gets to interact with spoilers:

Cable today and they use their TP together

end of spoilers

That's great. I enjoy how Rachel is continuing to help tutor Nate in his psi powers as she has from the get go! Nice continuity bonus.

Glad to see her get some screen time. I was hoping they would incorporate the Phoenix sword somehow and reforge it into a psimitar.

The Phoenix Sword is not one of them, as hopeful as we were from that event art back in the day. Which makes sense now that the Phoenix is a trademark Avengers property now.

What I am disappointed in is that it's been almost two years since Rachel and Jean have had any dialogue together, or Jean acknowledging most people in the room and Rachel is left off by the writer. To think that X-Men Red #9 was the last time they have interacted on panel together, which again has almost been two years. it might have been nice to have Rachel join Jean, Scott, and Nate on their family adventure, but while she's "included" in that she has a room on the moon, she's being excluded at the same time by actively choosing to not let her have any moments with Jean. You would have thought that the writers and editors would understand by this point these moments are important to readers and the fans. Le sigh

[Askani5]

That's great. I enjoy how Rachel is continuing to help tutor Nate in his psi powers as she has from the get go! Nice continuity bonus.



The Phoenix Sword is not one of them, as hopeful as we were from that event art back in the day. Which makes sense now that the Phoenix is a trademark Avengers property now.

What I am disappointed in is that it's been almost two years since Rachel and Jean have had any dialogue together, or Jean acknowledging most people in the room and Rachel is left off by the writer. To think that X-Men Red #9 was the last time they have interacted on panel together, which again has almost been two years. it might have been nice to have Rachel join Jean, Scott, and Nate on their family adventure, but while she's "included" in that she has a room on the moon, she's being excluded at the same time by actively choosing to not let her have any moments with Jean. You would have thought that the writers and editors would understand by this point these moments are important to readers and the fans. Le sigh

It seem like Rachel is closer to Scott than Jean. Who would have thought Emma would be more maternal than Jean. She treats her clone daughters better than Jean treats her time-displaced daughter. At least they are going on family trips now on panel and it’s good to see Rachel be reunited with her parents and brother.

[Glio]

I think it's a consistent part of their characterization that Scott and Rachel are closer than Rachel and Jean, just like Nate Grey was closer to Jean than Scott.

[Askani's Flame]

I think it's a consistent part of their characterization that Scott and Rachel are closer than Rachel and Jean, just like Nate Grey was closer to Jean than Scott.

I agree there is a level of consistency in that regard (i.e. Scott and Rachel). Exposure is a big part of it as Rachel was teammates with Scott before her lineage was made light. And they further cemented some level of familial feelings when Jean was dead, again. Nate Grey was around and relevant when Scott wasn't and so Jean became closer to him. But the flip side that Nate Grey then became closer to Scott during the Utopia/Schism era so he was welcomed into the family by Scott. Scott and Jean raised Cable so he is their child through and through. Jean has not been exposed to Rachel as much, for all that they have in common, and that is the fault of the writers.

Now that Rachel and Jean are alive in the same space, one would expect more interaction. Doesn't have to be mother-daughter as we know they don't work for them, but make them feel more like family than strangers still. It's kinda silly that X-Man got a better welcome and treatment than Rachel by this family, but we're not the writers I guess.

[Glio]

I agree there is a level of consistency in that regard (i.e. Scott and Rachel). Exposure is a big part of it as Rachel was teammates with Scott before her lineage was made light. And they further cemented some level of familial feelings when Jean was dead, again. Nate Grey was around and relevant when Scott wasn't and so Jean became closer to him. But the flip side that Nate Grey then became closer to Scott during the Utopia/Schism era so he was welcomed into the family by Scott. Scott and Jean raised Cable so he is their child through and through. Jean has not been exposed to Rachel as much, for all that they have in common, and that is the fault of the writers.

Now that Rachel and Jean are alive in the same space, one would expect more interaction. Doesn't have to be mother-daughter as we know they don't work for them, but make them feel more like family than strangers still. It's kinda silly that X-Man got a better welcome and treatment than Rachel by this family, but we're not the writers I guess.

I think the fact that Rachel went with Wolverine and Nate went with Scott in Schism was deliberately to reverse the common roles.

Thinking of Rachel and Scott sharing moments, I have remembered Deadly Genesis when they discovered Vulcan and I have realized that Jean Grey does not know Vulcan at all. It must be awkward, lol.

[loke13]

I agree there is a level of consistency in that regard (i.e. Scott and Rachel). Exposure is a big part of it as Rachel was teammates with Scott before her lineage was made light. And they further cemented some level of familial feelings when Jean was dead, again. Nate Grey was around and relevant when Scott wasn't and so Jean became closer to him. But the flip side that Nate Grey then became closer to Scott during the Utopia/Schism era so he was welcomed into the family by Scott. Scott and Jean raised Cable so he is their child through and through. Jean has not been exposed to Rachel as much, for all that they have in common, and that is the fault of the writers.

Now that Rachel and Jean are alive in the same space, one would expect more interaction. Doesn't have to be mother-daughter as we know they don't work for them, but make them feel more like family than strangers still. It's kinda silly that X-Man got a better welcome and treatment than Rachel by this family, but we're not the writers I guess.

Agreed they LITERALLY all live in the same house it would be nice if we got some interaction between Rachel and Jean even if it was only a couple of lines of dialogue. Maybe Jane can guest starred in X-Factor issue somewhere down the line or Rachel and X-Force

[Glio]

One problem the two have is that you have to deliberately match the two because they have pretty much the same powerset. In that sense, if you want to move the plot forward while the two collaborate, it has to be for a very specific reason. That is why when they coincide it is usually in circumstances where their powers are irrelevant, such as the X-Men Gold wedding or the Summers House dinner.

It would be dope if in a plot their different personalities complement each other to use telepathy in different ways.

[loke13]

One problem the two have is that you have to deliberately match the two because they have pretty much the same powerset. In that sense, if you want to move the plot forward while the two collaborate, it has to be for a very specific reason. That is why when they coincide it is usually in circumstances where their powers are irrelevant, such as the X-Men Gold wedding or the Summers House dinner.

It would be dope if in a plot their different personalities complement each other to use telepathy in different ways.

I mean I think X Factor does a pretty good job of having Rachel standout power-wise. Just place a greater emphasis on Rachel's ability to chronoskim and tk. Jean is classified as an Omega level TP so just place more emphasis on that.

[Havok83]

One problem the two have is that you have to deliberately match the two because they have pretty much the same powerset. In that sense, if you want to move the plot forward while the two collaborate, it has to be for a very specific reason. That is why when they coincide it is usually in circumstances where their powers are irrelevant, such as the X-Men Gold wedding or the Summers House dinner.

It would be dope if in a plot their different personalities complement each other to use telepathy in different ways.

Thats BS and a weak excuse bc we see characters with the same powersets interact all the time. X-men v4 had 3 women with telepathy/telekinesis. Multiple teams of X-Force have had brutes with blade. Heck the current X-force has Jean and Quentin, whom would have the same issue posed by she and Rachel. I dont think anyone here was even asking for Rachel and Jean to be on the same team but at the very least interact on panel. That hasnt been done since X-men Red despite being in the same spaces. The writers will literally have Jean address everyone in the room but Rachel. It can be frustrating and make no sense

[Glio]

Thats BS and a weak excuse bc we see characters with the same powersets interact all the time. X-men v4 had 3 women with telepathy/telekinesis. Multiple teams of X-Force have had brutes with blade. Heck the current X-force has Jean and Quentin, whom would have the same issue posed by she and Rachel. I dont think anyone here was even asking for Rachel and Jean to be on the same team but at the very least interact on panel. That hasnt been done since X-men Red despite being in the same spaces. The writers will literally have Jean address everyone in the room but Rachel. It can be frustrating and make no sense

The thing is, in superhero comics visuals matter in fights and various blade brutes seem to be easier to write or draw in a fight than various telepaths.

Quentin differs visually from Jean because he uses his telepathic guns, just as Emma and Jean differ because Emma uses her diamond form and Jean her telekinesis. And Betsy for example uses her psi-knife and her sword. Every telepath that is not Xavier has her unique element that complements her telepathy to accompany her in fights.

Instead, there has never been much of an effort to visually differentiate Rachel from Jean in fights. Rachel usually has fiery effects when using her powers but little else.

[loke13]

The thing is, in superhero comics visuals matter in fights and various blade brutes seem to be easier to write or draw in a fight than various telepaths.

Quentin differs visually from Jean because he uses his telepathic guns, just as Emma and Jean differ because Emma uses her diamond form and Jean her telekinesis. And Betsy for example uses her psi-knife and her sword. Every telepath that is not Xavier has her unique element that complements her telepathy to accompany her in fights.

Instead, there has never been much of an effort to visually differentiate Rachel from Jean in fights. Rachel usually has fiery effects when using her powers but little else.

Then the problem is the artist and not really the characters power set. Having Rachel manifest a fiery telepathic sword or spear would be enough to differentiate her from her mother's Powerpuff girl pink signature according to your logic.

[Havok83]

Again, no one said they need to be on the same team. Actual interaction is the main issue

Then the problem is the artist and not really the characters power set. Having Rachel manifest a fiery telepathic sword or spear would be enough to differentiate her from her mother's Powerpuff girl pink signature according to your logic.

and in such cases you could emphasize one's abilities over the other, like having Jean be the main TP and Rachel be the main TK. Xmen Red leaned more on Jean's telepathy as she was more non-combative there and didnt really us her TK in fight. There it was more defensive, manifesting as shields and transport. Rachel was blasting and ready to wreck havoc, as well as amplifying her punches with TK. They appeared together in one issue of the main series and in that issue the writer did a good job of writing them differently with the same powerset