"We're the same thing, you and I. We're both lies that eventually became the truth." Lara Notsil, Star Wars: X-Wing: Solo Command, Aaron Allston
"All that is not eternal is eternally out of date." C. S. Lewis, The Four Loves
"There's room in our line of work for hope, too." Stephanie Brown
Stephanie Brown Wiki, My Batman Universe Reviews, Stephanie Brown Discord
Today's Deceased issue does something I wasn't expecting.
Maybe it's common knowledge, but apparently Dan Mora did the character designs for some (many? all?) of the Future State Batman characters, and maybe many or all of the others, too. He posted a number of carousels on his Instagram:
Batman, Batgirls, Katana:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CGiZCElFFcB/
Harley Quinn:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CGaMKwYlBVG/
His big poster:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CGXjdPbFz4V/
A few commenters asked about Steph's eye - he said yeah, looks like she lost an eye.
My thought: Ok, a future that might not be. I can stand that. But, DC says some of this will happen, or at least these stories hint at some things that will happen soon. In other words - if that is 2030, we have to get from 2020 to 2030 and it doesn't happen at once. It happens a little at a time. In the case of the Batgirls - well, we see that has just happened. But what happens next?
How can I not worry, in every ongoing appearance, that Steph is going to lose an eye?
And - why?! Why her? It's not just that her arc was always insecure to success back to insecure, but her fate is also to be tortured or maimed?
Isn't it bad enough she's going to cut off her hair?
What other DC heroes have lost an eye, or a limb, or -- any body part? Is it only Batgirls that get killed, tortured, paralyzed, disfigured...?
Some weeks have been much worse than others. I have the variant Hawkman, and it does make a creaky sounded when I turn the pages. But I don't see explicit creases on the cover.
When I first really started to notice the problem, I kept track of some of this stuff, though not in a very well organized way. (And of course, I don't buy everything, so I don't have any info about most covers of most titles.) If you happen to own any of these and feel like taking a look, here's what I found:
On sale 8/25
Kentucky - every one is creased:
Action 1024a
Amethyst 5
Flash 760a
Justice League Dark 25b (the very worst and most obvious, maybe because of the dark coloring. It has 5 creases at the spine.)
Suicide Squad 8a
Suicide Squad 8b
Printed at Transcontinental in Montreal, Canada - all fine:
Batman: Three Jokers 1a
Detective 1026a
Legion of Super-Heroes 8a
Legion of Super-Heroes 8b
Red Hood Outlaw 48a
Teen Titans Annual 2
Wonder Woman 761b
On sale 9/8
Kentucky - all have at least 1 pinch at binding; and:
Hawkman 27a - 2 vertical grooves 1 inch from binding
DC Classics The Batman Adventures 4 - 2 vertical grooves 1 inch from binding; and, 2 pages are torn in top corner
Flash 761a - pinch and a little ding near binding
Batman and the Outsiders 16b
Justice League Odyssey 24b - 2 very bad vertical grooves
Printed at Transcontinental in Montreal, Canada - all fine:
Nightwing 74b
Superman 25a
Wonder Woman 762a
Dark Nights: Death Metal Trinity Crisis 1a
On sale 9/22
Kentucky:
Action 1025a - squiggly crease on left side above bar code running up the side causing noisy page turns.
Montreal, fine:
Batgirl 49a
Batgirl 49b
Justice League Dark 26b card stock
Guess I stopped keeping notes after that - those notes about 9/22 are very incomplete.
Interesting that JL Dark 25 was printed in Kentucky, but 26 was printed in Montreal. I think all the more sophisticated work (including card stock, embossed card stock, etc.) gets printed in Montreal, so any issue with a card stock variant is going to get switched to there. Basically, Kentucky gets only the most straightforward jobs, which are themselves a bit beyond their capability.
All of the ones I listed as bad are -- bad. But in some cases you have to inspect near the edge carefully. In other cases the creases are unmistakable. And I only noticed one week where in addition to the typical creases which are perpendicular to the spine, there were vertical creases on the covers.
I don't know of any way for a reader to communicate an issue or complaint to DC. There is no consumer-facing public relations - there's only a one-way Twitter PR blast.
Steph, Cass, Duke and Tim are in the backup story in today's Dark Nights: Death Metal: Robin King #1.
spoilers:end of spoilers
They aren't in their Batgirl suits here. It looks like good old Spoiler and Orphan.
Alright DCeased Hope at Worlds End #12 is out today, read spoilers at own risk.
spoilers:end of spoilers
I’m not going to bury the lead here, Stephanie dies this issue but apparently that’s not the end of her story. So what happens is that while they are protecting the people Black Manta gets turned and basically kills Stephanie with his laser vision. Damian is sad because as Cassie Sandsmark puts it he lost a sister. However, there is apparently hope because Damian’s mother Talia informs him that there is a one time use only Lazarus pit available and that since Stephanie was never infected with the anti-life equation it’s possible she can be brought back to life. Basically the issue ends with the hope that Talia is going off on a solo mission to bring back Steph.
So hard to say if Stephanie’s story will have a happy ending in the DCeased universe but at the very least Taylor is trying to give some hope about it. Let’s just hope that he doesn’t dash it.
"It's fun and it's cool, so that's all that matters. It's what comics are for, Duh."
Words to live by.
We shall see! Megan Fitzmartin tweeted that she was really excited that DC approved her use of Steph, but that she's very much a supporting character in Robin Eternal. I don't really fear that Steph's going to lose an eye in current continuity - that would seem pretty extreme, when losing body parts in the future (especially 10 years in the future) seems like a common way to show how Dark and Serious it is.
Thanks for the Mora links! I did not know he was the designer!
Very interesting - I'd have to check my comics to see what they've been like, but I don't recall hearing or feeling such damage.
I do wish DC had some kind of customer service department, but like their marketing, they're not very good at that.
I must admit, I had given up any hope of Steph showing up in Dark Nights: Death Metal, but this is kind of fun! Tony Patrick, most known for Batman and the Signal, does a Duke story, and Cass, Steph, and Tim look really nice in Daniel Sampere's art. I wonder if DC hasn't made an editioral note to all artists about the current costumes. A bit odd, since they clearly made such a note for the Drake suit, and then quickly made a new note for Tim's new Robin/Red Robin suit.
"We're the same thing, you and I. We're both lies that eventually became the truth." Lara Notsil, Star Wars: X-Wing: Solo Command, Aaron Allston
"All that is not eternal is eternally out of date." C. S. Lewis, The Four Loves
"There's room in our line of work for hope, too." Stephanie Brown
Stephanie Brown Wiki, My Batman Universe Reviews, Stephanie Brown Discord
I think Talia's plan is going to work, though she herself may not survive it. I think they're setting up Damian coming to terms with the fact that he does consider Steph to be family.
Yeah, maybe spoilers:end of spoilers
Steph is resurrected, but doesn't return to being Robin, which explains why she hasn't appeared in the other stuff set later on.
Appreciation Thread Indexes
Marvel | Spider-Man | X-Men | NEW!! DC Comics | Batman | Superman | Wonder Woman
Welcome to the Batgirl: Stephanie Brown reread, Week 30 - Finale! (Schedule starts here: https://community.cbr.com/showthread...=1#post4916669) Today, we're on Detective Comics #980, "Batmen Eternal Part 5", written by James Tynion IV, pencilled by Scot Eaton, inked by Wayne Faucher, colored by John Kalisz and Allen Passalaqua, cover by Alvaro Martinez.
Notes: Well, after 30 weeks - 7 months - we’re finally reaching the end - FOR NOW! As I said just a month ago, the motto of a Steph fan should always be, “It’s only the end if you want it to be.” But we’ve come to the end of Steph’s Batgirl comics - though Batman: The Joker War Zone and Future State: Batgirls seem to promise that this won’t be the endpoint for long! I’ve toyed with the idea of doing a Steph Robin reread, which I actually did a shortened version of back in March when the Robin 80th Anniversary story came out, but that won’t be for a few months, since this month is my Hawkman reread in anticipation of the finale, plus we still have two more issues of DCeased: Hope at World’s End which might add more content to Steph’s Robin appearances .
But, today we’re going to talk about the final issue in the current saga of Stephanie Brown as Batgirl: Detective Comics #980. James Tynion’s work with Steph has been controversial in the fandom. A lot accuse him of reducing Steph to just a love interest, and making her a hypocrite, etc. My response: Steph IS a love interest for most of her history, Tynion did NOT write her as ONLY a love interest, he did make her a hypocrite, but that’s okay, because Batman is also a hypocrite - all good characters have flaws, and I like that Tynion wrote Steph an arc with her flaw that doesn’t make her perfect, but makes her feel real.
But this issue, Tec 980, is really why I give Tynion a lot of credit as a Steph writer. The last time I saw Tynion at a con was Spring 2018, just before this issue was out, and I REALLY wish that this issue had been out. I would have it signed and possibly framed, it’s that important to me. He said then that it was his attempt to say everything that Stephanie Brown is to him - her history, her character, her values - and I think it’s an amazing tribute to her.
If you’ve been reading Tynion’s Batman run, finishing Joker War this month, then this issue will feel a bit familiar. Gotham is in chaotic ruins, vast numbers of enemies populate the streets, and the whole Batfamily needs to come together. What sets Tynion’s Detective Comics finale from his Joker War finale is the way he’s built all of the character arcs. Where Batman is pretty much just about Bruce Wayne, Detective Comics has to try to server Bruce, Kate, Tim, Steph, Cass, Clayface, and even Batwing and Azrael - and he does. Not always evenly, not always perfectly, but he does. The emotional journey all of these characters have been on together makes me see, even if just for this run, why team books are so popular. If you can really love the characters in a team, and they are well written and plotted, then the finales of those runs hit like a giant ton of emotional bricks.
And that’s what happened to me when I turned the page, and saw Steph and Cass as Batgirls again. I knew SOMETHING was coming - that cover was unmistakable in promise - and I had a guess that it’d be something involving Brother Eye’s connection to the future timeline - but I didn’t expect what I got a few page turns later: Steph as Robin. I get very, very emotional when I think about it, and when I reread it (as I have dozens of times in the past two years). This was a fantastic issue that pays off all the pain and suffering Steph went through by acknowleding, even if it’s in an alternate timeline, that she has history, she’s not just the outcast, rebellious, frustrated girl trying to find her own way to make the world a better place. She has been making it a better place for 25 years, and will keep doing so in fans’ hearts for years to come.
Art - Scot Eaton replaced Alvaro Martinez, who drew the cover and was solicited to draw the last two issues of this run. However, Martinez chose to go to Justice League Dark with Tynion, and they asked Eaton to do the fill-in art for this issue. I was very disappointed, as Eaton’s issues in Batman and Robin Eternal were some of the roughest and least appealing - and he didn’t get the best Steph scenes (drawn by Paul Pelletier in #2 and Christian Duce #23), so there wasn’t that connection to Steph that I like to see in key issues for characters. However, Eaton did a very serviceable job, and the comic synergy between writing and art provides an extremely effective emotional experience, as it should.
Finale: It’s been quite a journey, rereading all of Steph’s significant Batgirl appearances. I hoped, 30 weeks ago, that I’d come away from this experience with my love for Steph’s run as Batgirl reinvigorated - and I think I have. And little did I know that we’d have Steph with a new Batsymbol on her chest in the main comics, ready for big plans next year! Though this reread is complete, stay tuned, Steph fans - there’s always more to come with the best hero in Gotham!
Cover: This cover was leaked by Alvaro Martinez and Raul Fernandez (Martinez’s regular inker) on instagram livestreams, and Steph and Cass fans lost their minds with excitement. And it delivered way more than we thought, even if it didn’t make Steph and Cass Batgirls again immediately. The brilliant device of the shadows with ears on the wall, the rich detail of the costumes, brick, and even hand-drawn logo are complemented by Brad Anderson’s amazing colors, starting with the rich and warm yellows at the bottom fading to the cool purple blues at the top. This cover deserves to be one of the best Tec covers of the 2010s!
Discussion Questions: The end! What stuck out for you as part of this reread? Did you notice anything new, or come across some bonus comics you really enjoyed?
"We're the same thing, you and I. We're both lies that eventually became the truth." Lara Notsil, Star Wars: X-Wing: Solo Command, Aaron Allston
"All that is not eternal is eternally out of date." C. S. Lewis, The Four Loves
"There's room in our line of work for hope, too." Stephanie Brown
Stephanie Brown Wiki, My Batman Universe Reviews, Stephanie Brown Discord
I read Tom Taylor's post on Instagram yesterday but just getting around to mentioning it today.
He wrote
"#DCeased: Dead Planet 12 is out now.
Um... sorry."
Uh oh.
(Oh, and he meant Hope At World's End #12, not Dead Planet, of course - he posted an image of the cover of it.)
On Twitter he posted "no spoilers." But on Instagram, he put lines of dots before his hashtags, and I think if anything, he should have put the dots before "Um... sorry" because that's the closest thing to a spoiler. (There's nothing I can see that is spoilery in his hashtags, which are just #Batman #Robin #DCComics #WonderWoman #Flash #GreenCanary #GreenLantern #Superman #SuperSons.)
How long is it appropriate to use SPOIL tag here?
spoilers:end of spoilers
I'm hoping he is referring to what happened to J'onn which was quite sad.
There aren't many installments left. Is Talia simply going to fail off-screen, and then report back -"Sorry, guys, it didn't work."? Then he sort of kills her twice!
We'll have to see what he means, but I am prepared for the worst.
Of course, Talia laid the groundwork for it working, but not quite right - and I don't think Taylor would just stick that dialog in for no reason.
So what would that mean? Mental infirmity? Or physical? Maybe she comes back but with physical changes, and becomes the next Oracle.
spoilers:end of spoilers
I have no clue what will happen - I honestly thought Steph was just going to die. However, the resurrection hope seems like laying the groundwork for Steph maybe having to stay on earth as part of Talia's group, and coming back in Dead Planet near the end.
"We're the same thing, you and I. We're both lies that eventually became the truth." Lara Notsil, Star Wars: X-Wing: Solo Command, Aaron Allston
"All that is not eternal is eternally out of date." C. S. Lewis, The Four Loves
"There's room in our line of work for hope, too." Stephanie Brown
Stephanie Brown Wiki, My Batman Universe Reviews, Stephanie Brown Discord
Batgirl re-read: Detective #980.
Very cool shadows on the cover, which I may not have seen before.
I guess this just barely qualifies as part of a "Batgirl" re-read!
I'm not that familiar with this arc in Detective - should I pick it up in trades? Are there crossovers I need to be aware of?
I guess that thing that Steph says in Joker War Zone, something like she and Batman haven't always seen eye to eye, refers to the issues between Steph and Bruce in this arc? Doesn't she get really angry with him in this arc and storm off, but then she comes back in the end?
Tynion ended his run on Detective with the hint of bringing back the Batgirls, and then actually did so in the second arc of his current Batman run. It's a story he wants to see through.
Looking back over the re-read:
I found myself becoming kind of critical, mostly over specifics in the storylines. My positive feeling towards the series is from an overall enjoyment of Steph's gritty, determined, even exuberant behavior as Batgirl. As for stories, my favorites are at the start - the "origin story" - and then the way the series wraps up, with some specific issues sprinkled here and there, like Dracula or Klarion. And I loved the Damian/Steph "sibling" relationship. That Damian, and that relationship, was more like the one Tom Taylor is writing than anything in the present continuity.
The largest storyline is certainly the Reapers, and I don't think it worked out that well, though there are some good moments. I definitely don't care for Wendy as Oracle/Proxy, or for that matter anything about Wendy at all. Or how she (and Barbara) bobbed and weaved into and out of the book. That may have been less noticeable when spread over 24 months.
And honestly, if you compare Bryan Q. Miller's storytelling to the work that's been done with the current Batgirl series over the last year or so, it's -- much better!
So, I guess it's farewell for now to the re-read, and thank you to our host for taking us all this way!