Stephanie Brown: Spoiler, Robin, Batgirl Appreciation 2020

[millernumber1]

Still, this tiny panel with her and Damian was an interaction I never thought I'd see again so consideri me pleased. Her hug with Babs was a bit weird though; I don't think they've ever even spoken to each other in current continuety.
Attachment 100624

In Tec 975, Babs talks about speaking with Steph, and they worked together in Batgirl and the Birds of Prey: Manslaughter arc. Plus, in the Burnside run, Babs protected and mentored Steph (46-52). I was really glad to see that.

[Tsukiakari1203]

Still, this tiny panel with her and Damian was an interaction I never thought I'd see again so consideri me pleased. Her hug with Babs was a bit weird though; I don't think they've ever even spoken to each other in current continuety.
Attachment 100624

i think they teamed up in a Batgirl issue. I haven't heard it was very good

[Tsukiakari1203]

Bummed out that Cass wasn't anywhere to be seen. I hate that it's nearly always one or the other when either of them show up w/ the rest of the family. One of them nearly always gets left out, and I wish we were past that by now.

I know fans consider the core Batfamily to be Bruce, Kate, Babs, Dick, Tim, Steph, Jay, Cass, Dami, and Alfred. I think Bette should count as well but that's just me

[Pohzee]

edit: not related to thread

[DropOfSaturn]

I had completely forgotten about the Burnside team-up. If I remember correctly, she also popped up in that series during the Endgame crossover. I had just completely pushed those appearences from my brain somehow; my bad

[millernumber1]

i think they teamed up in a Batgirl issue. I haven't heard it was very good

I really like Batgirl 46-52 - i thought Babs was a very good mentor, Steph was a great hero, and the art was quite nice.

[Tsukiakari1203]

I really like Batgirl 46-52 - i thought Babs was a very good mentor, Steph was a great hero, and the art was quite nice.

good to know!

[millernumber1]

Welcome to the Batgirl: Stephanie Brown reread, Week 25! (Schedule starts here: https://community.cbr.com/showthread...=1#post4916669) Today, we're on Batgirl #23, "Here Endeth the Lesson", written by Bryan Q. Miller, pencilled by Pere Perez, inked by Pere Perez, colored by Guy Major, cover by Dustin Nguyen.



Notes: The penultimate issue of this series is very, very dark - brutal action, many, many deaths, and the murder of Grey Ghost, the incompetent, pesky, but not very dark Batgirl obsessive. Detective Gage reveals, all at once, his dark backstory that’s been building for a year (since issue #13). Grey Ghost’s final message reveals more of the plot - the Reaper’s mastermind tricked them, and they are now on an extremely deadly rampage. Gage gives Steph a ride in a chopper, she sets up her plan, then demonstrates difficult maturity in pushing him to date Babs.

Steph’s plan: call in her friends, and friends of friends! The villains taunt her, but she wisely rejects the idea that winning solo is the best way. The fight is delightful, and it’s so painful knowing we never got to see more of these relationships develop. And we finally get the reveal - Steph’s nemesis, at the end of her Batgirl run, just as at the beginning of her Spoiler run, is her dad, Cluemaster.

Some fun letters to the editor, largely helping to hype up the confrontation between Steph and her father: https://stephaniebrown.fandom.com/wiki/Batgirl_Vol_3_23

Cover: Steph between super-armored members of the Scythe order, smiling as she prepares to fight - a delightful cover, though a bit less epic than the interiors.

Discussion Questions: The revelations and relationship with Gage are probably the most obviously rushed pieces of the long term plot - do they still work for you? Does the final reveal of Cluemaster surprise you?

[Tsukiakari1203]

Welcome to the Batgirl: Stephanie Brown reread, Week 25! (Schedule starts here: https://community.cbr.com/showthread...=1#post4916669) Today, we're on Batgirl #23, "Here Endeth the Lesson", written by Bryan Q. Miller, pencilled by Pere Perez, inked by Pere Perez, colored by Guy Major, cover by Dustin Nguyen.



Notes: The penultimate issue of this series is very, very dark - brutal action, many, many deaths, and the murder of Grey Ghost, the incompetent, pesky, but not very dark Batgirl obsessive. Detective Gage reveals, all at once, his dark backstory that’s been building for a year (since issue #13). Grey Ghost’s final message reveals more of the plot - the Reaper’s mastermind tricked them, and they are now on an extremely deadly rampage. Gage gives Steph a ride in a chopper, she sets up her plan, then demonstrates difficult maturity in pushing him to date Babs.

Steph’s plan: call in her friends, and friends of friends! The villains taunt her, but she wisely rejects the idea that winning solo is the best way. The fight is delightful, and it’s so painful knowing we never got to see more of these relationships develop. And we finally get the reveal - Steph’s nemesis, at the end of her Batgirl run, just as at the beginning of her Spoiler run, is her dad, Cluemaster.

Some fun letters to the editor, largely helping to hype up the confrontation between Steph and her father: https://stephaniebrown.fandom.com/wiki/Batgirl_Vol_3_23

Cover: Steph between super-armored members of the Scythe order, smiling as she prepares to fight - a delightful cover, though a bit less epic than the interiors.

Discussion Questions: The revelations and relationship with Gage are probably the most obviously rushed pieces of the long term plot - do they still work for you? Does the final reveal of Cluemaster surprise you?

THIS ISSUE IS SO GOOD! I love it so much!

[ohfellow]

That's quite a few Batfamily members, though!

And it's pretty cool to get two Steph appearances in one week! And in comics I was already pulling!

With the cancellation of Harley Quinn and Suicide Squad, Batgirl, and Batman and the Outsiders, something is up. They aren't just throwing out all the women. They have plans for them.

They have spent a year transitioning Harley Quinn more to hero than anti-hero. Over the course of the year she appeared on unexpected covers and in unexpected panels in groups where she didn't seem to belong, like in some group shots at the Hall of Justice etc. Harley is different in Suicide Squad - there she is drawn with a 6-pack and the finale will find her in a new, full costume. Whatever she'll be, it will be something new.

I bring this up because DC has recently tried, twice, to give us some form of Harley Quinn and the Birds of Prey in print. The Azzarello Lupacchino book was to be an ongoing before finally being stripped for parts and the entire first arc published as a very large one-shot. It was really poorly written, and I don't think those two creators were a good fit, though given the bad script I don't know that any art could have saved it. So, cancellation was the right move. DC had a stinker on its hands.

And then we have the Palmiotti Conner mini-series, and it's fine only for people who like that schtick you get from those two writers, which means you like juvenile references to body parts and frequent references to and hurling of bodily waste.

This is my fear. A HQ & the BoP team book with Babs running the ship and sending Steph, Cass and HQ on missions. Maybe Huntress and Black Canary join too. It would be diluted. We'd see Steph's face one a year (I guess it's just easier to ink a black blob, which saves the artists some time) and hear from her less.

It's not a team that I want, and if that writing team is involved, it will be hard to buy it. If Conner is on the art, even worse.

What we want is league of Batgirls, not Birds of Prey unless the birds are the 3 Batgirls!

And I'd mourn the loss of the HQ solo title, and mourn the loss of potential in the solo Batgirl book, which never quite got the writer it deserved. And mourn the loss of the Outsiders for that matter, a nice little book off to the side.

Sorry to ruin everyone's day!

[millernumber1]

THIS ISSUE IS SO GOOD! I love it so much!

It has a whole lot of fun - for some reason, because #22 and 24 stick out more in my head, it gets a bit lost in my memories, but it's very awesome seeing Steph's maturity and teamups.

With the cancellation of Harley Quinn and Suicide Squad, Batgirl, and Batman and the Outsiders, something is up. They aren't just throwing out all the women. They have plans for them.

They have spent a year transitioning Harley Quinn more to hero than anti-hero. Over the course of the year she appeared on unexpected covers and in unexpected panels in groups where she didn't seem to belong, like in some group shots at the Hall of Justice etc. Harley is different in Suicide Squad - there she is drawn with a 6-pack and the finale will find her in a new, full costume. Whatever she'll be, it will be something new.

I bring this up because DC has recently tried, twice, to give us some form of Harley Quinn and the Birds of Prey in print. The Azzarello Lupacchino book was to be an ongoing before finally being stripped for parts and the entire first arc published as a very large one-shot. It was really poorly written, and I don't think those two creators were a good fit, though given the bad script I don't know that any art could have saved it. So, cancellation was the right move. DC had a stinker on its hands.

And then we have the Palmiotti Conner mini-series, and it's fine only for people who like that schtick you get from those two writers, which means you like juvenile references to body parts and frequent references to and hurling of bodily waste.

This is my fear. A HQ & the BoP team book with Babs running the ship and sending Steph, Cass and HQ on missions. Maybe Huntress and Black Canary join too. It would be diluted. We'd see Steph's face one a year (I guess it's just easier to ink a black blob, which saves the artists some time) and hear from her less.

It's not a team that I want, and if that writing team is involved, it will be hard to buy it. If Conner is on the art, even worse.

What we want is league of Batgirls, not Birds of Prey unless the birds are the 3 Batgirls!

And I'd mourn the loss of the HQ solo title, and mourn the loss of potential in the solo Batgirl book, which never quite got the writer it deserved. And mourn the loss of the Outsiders for that matter, a nice little book off to the side.

Sorry to ruin everyone's day!

Very interesting thoughts! I, too, agree that DC has some kind of plan going on here, and I can definitely see a Harley/Batgirl/Batgirls team book happening. My own hope (as I've said ad infinitum here and everywhere) is that Harley gets her own book and Babs leads Steph and Cass in a League of Batgirls book. But what you say about Harley and the Birds of Prey makes sense. I really doubt they'll give Conner and Palmiotti an ongoing with that team - if they were going to do it, I think they would have done it instead of giving them a Black Label book. (Side note - I think Lupacchino would be perfect for a Birds of Prey book, and she is the reason I actually bought that one-shot, but it was indeed very poorly written, especially for Dinah).

Harley, Babs, Dinah, Helena, Steph, and Cass - that is a pretty stuffed book. I think it could work with a good writer - Tynion made his Tec work with six people on the team, but it was somewhat uneven in who got development.

I don't hate the idea, but I do think it's a possibility that could go wrong. I am curious to know if DC actually thinks that the Birds of Prey movie was a success - I don't think it was, especially not in selling comics, as almost all of the tie-in books are already out of print, less than a year after the movie came out.

[Tsukiakari1203]

With the cancellation of Harley Quinn and Suicide Squad, Batgirl, and Batman and the Outsiders, something is up. They aren't just throwing out all the women. They have plans for them.

They have spent a year transitioning Harley Quinn more to hero than anti-hero. Over the course of the year she appeared on unexpected covers and in unexpected panels in groups where she didn't seem to belong, like in some group shots at the Hall of Justice etc. Harley is different in Suicide Squad - there she is drawn with a 6-pack and the finale will find her in a new, full costume. Whatever she'll be, it will be something new.

I bring this up because DC has recently tried, twice, to give us some form of Harley Quinn and the Birds of Prey in print. The Azzarello Lupacchino book was to be an ongoing before finally being stripped for parts and the entire first arc published as a very large one-shot. It was really poorly written, and I don't think those two creators were a good fit, though given the bad script I don't know that any art could have saved it. So, cancellation was the right move. DC had a stinker on its hands.

And then we have the Palmiotti Conner mini-series, and it's fine only for people who like that schtick you get from those two writers, which means you like juvenile references to body parts and frequent references to and hurling of bodily waste.

This is my fear. A HQ & the BoP team book with Babs running the ship and sending Steph, Cass and HQ on missions. Maybe Huntress and Black Canary join too. It would be diluted. We'd see Steph's face one a year (I guess it's just easier to ink a black blob, which saves the artists some time) and hear from her less.

It's not a team that I want, and if that writing team is involved, it will be hard to buy it. If Conner is on the art, even worse.

What we want is league of Batgirls, not Birds of Prey unless the birds are the 3 Batgirls!

And I'd mourn the loss of the HQ solo title, and mourn the loss of potential in the solo Batgirl book, which never quite got the writer it deserved. And mourn the loss of the Outsiders for that matter, a nice little book off to the side.

Sorry to ruin everyone's day!

There are 4 Batgirls not 3! I'm sick of Bette erasure

[Tsukiakari1203]

It has a whole lot of fun - for some reason, because #22 and 24 stick out more in my head, it gets a bit lost in my memories, but it's very awesome seeing Steph's maturity and teamups.



Very interesting thoughts! I, too, agree that DC has some kind of plan going on here, and I can definitely see a Harley/Batgirl/Batgirls team book happening. My own hope (as I've said ad infinitum here and everywhere) is that Harley gets her own book and Babs leads Steph and Cass in a League of Batgirls book. But what you say about Harley and the Birds of Prey makes sense. I really doubt they'll give Conner and Palmiotti an ongoing with that team - if they were going to do it, I think they would have done it instead of giving them a Black Label book. (Side note - I think Lupacchino would be perfect for a Birds of Prey book, and she is the reason I actually bought that one-shot, but it was indeed very poorly written, especially for Dinah).

Harley, Babs, Dinah, Helena, Steph, and Cass - that is a pretty stuffed book. I think it could work with a good writer - Tynion made his Tec work with six people on the team, but it was somewhat uneven in who got development.

I don't hate the idea, but I do think it's a possibility that could go wrong. I am curious to know if DC actually thinks that the Birds of Prey movie was a success - I don't think it was, especially not in selling comics, as almost all of the tie-in books are already out of print, less than a year after the movie came out.

BoP leaves a bad taste in my mouth the more I think about it. Keep Harley away from the Birds

[Chickfighter]

BoP leaves a bad taste in my mouth the more I think about it. Keep Harley away from the Birds

I second the sick of heroine Harley sentiment.

I'm sick of Bette erasure.

I think Bette could be included.

[Tsukiakari1203]

I second the sick of heroine Harley sentiment.



I think Bette could be included.

I second both of these