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  1. #511
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    When you lose someone on the job that hurts. Steph isn't Vulcan where she can just turn off her emotions and look at things completely dispassionately. We know there was nothing that could have been done because the guy was programmed to self-terminate. Even if she pulled him up he'd have been dead already. But she has no way of knowing that, and it wouldn't comfort her if she did. A man died on her watch. Any superhero worth their salt would feel at least partially responsible for not preventing it.

  2. #512
    I am a diamond, Ms. Pryde millernumber1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sunofdarkchild View Post
    When you lose someone on the job that hurts. Steph isn't Vulcan where she can just turn off her emotions and look at things completely dispassionately. We know there was nothing that could have been done because the guy was programmed to self-terminate. Even if she pulled him up he'd have been dead already. But she has no way of knowing that, and it wouldn't comfort her if she did. A man died on her watch. Any superhero worth their salt would feel at least partially responsible for not preventing it.
    Well said. And Steph is particularly not a Vulcan - she tends to be much more open and transparent (and aware of) her feelings, where a lot of the other Batfamily would completely suppress any sign of them.
    "We're the same thing, you and I. We're both lies that eventually became the truth." Lara Notsil, Star Wars: X-Wing: Solo Command, Aaron Allston
    "All that is not eternal is eternally out of date." C. S. Lewis, The Four Loves
    "There's room in our line of work for hope, too." Stephanie Brown
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  3. #513
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    I'm curious. So far Steph has appeared in YJ. Is this her first animated appearnce?

  4. #514
    I am a diamond, Ms. Pryde millernumber1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmiMizuno View Post
    I'm curious. So far Steph has appeared in YJ. Is this her first animated appearnce?
    There are hints of Steph as Tim's wife in Batman Beyond: Return of the Joker, I believe, but that's inference.
    "We're the same thing, you and I. We're both lies that eventually became the truth." Lara Notsil, Star Wars: X-Wing: Solo Command, Aaron Allston
    "All that is not eternal is eternally out of date." C. S. Lewis, The Four Loves
    "There's room in our line of work for hope, too." Stephanie Brown
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  5. #515
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    It's not stated in the movie, but it is in the DVD commentary that Tim's wife was a deliberate reference to Steph since she was Tim's girlfriend when ROTJ came out.

  6. #516
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    Quote Originally Posted by sunofdarkchild View Post
    When you lose someone on the job that hurts. Steph isn't Vulcan where she can just turn off her emotions and look at things completely dispassionately. We know there was nothing that could have been done because the guy was programmed to self-terminate. Even if she pulled him up he'd have been dead already. But she has no way of knowing that, and it wouldn't comfort her if she did. A man died on her watch. Any superhero worth their salt would feel at least partially responsible for not preventing it.
    Very good way of putting it!

    Regarding Artgerm's cover for The Web - well there is always a first. I didn't know he knew how to draw men!

    He has a few "disciples" whose work are also sold at this site at https://artgermcollectibles.com - Derrick Chew, Ejikure, and Kendrick Lim. They've carved out a distinctive niche.

  7. #517
    I am a diamond, Ms. Pryde millernumber1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ohfellow View Post
    Very good way of putting it!

    Regarding Artgerm's cover for The Web - well there is always a first. I didn't know he knew how to draw men!

    He has a few "disciples" whose work are also sold at this site at https://artgermcollectibles.com - Derrick Chew, Ejikure, and Kendrick Lim. They've carved out a distinctive niche.
    Artgerm actually did a lot of covers which don't feature beautiful heroines, but he is remembered for the latter. And given that one of those heroines is Steph, I don't mind too much! I also love Chew, whose beautiful Steph Robin cover was an instant buy for me! Kendrick Lim's Steph Black Lantern variant was also a buy, despite not really being interested in the book
    "We're the same thing, you and I. We're both lies that eventually became the truth." Lara Notsil, Star Wars: X-Wing: Solo Command, Aaron Allston
    "All that is not eternal is eternally out of date." C. S. Lewis, The Four Loves
    "There's room in our line of work for hope, too." Stephanie Brown
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  8. #518
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    Quote Originally Posted by millernumber1 View Post
    Artgerm actually did a lot of covers which don't feature beautiful heroines, but he is remembered for the latter. And given that one of those heroines is Steph, I don't mind too much! I also love Chew, whose beautiful Steph Robin cover was an instant buy for me! Kendrick Lim's Steph Black Lantern variant was also a buy, despite not really being interested in the book
    Speaking of recent "buys" there was also the DCeased #3 retailer variant from Unknown Comics, by Jay Anacleto, which is Barbara but drawn after Artgerm's cover of Batgirl #12. He's not of this Arterm school, though (as far as I know). Those have been selling on eBay for less than original price.

  9. #519
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    Welcome to the Batgirl: Stephanie Brown reread, Week 10! (Schedule starts here: https://community.cbr.com/showthread...=1#post4916669) Today, we're on Batgirl #10, "The Flood, part 2 of 4", written by Bryan Q. Miller, pencilled by Lee Garbett and Pere Perez, inked by Jonathan Glapion, Rodney Ramos, Pere Perez, colored by Guy Major, cover by Artgerm.



    Notes: The first appearance of Pere Perez as penciller! It feels like they roughly split the issue, Garbett handling the first half, Perez the second. I really like the inking for Garbett’s side - thick lines that smooth some of Garbett’s linework out, and Perez meshes well, though once you know what you’re looking for, the differences in eyes, faces, and hair is obvious.

    Forgot to mention Nell in the last issue - after her first appearance in issue #4, she’s clearly becoming the world’s #1 Batgirl fan.

    The build of this arc is really well done - going from triumph over Johnny C., to the death of the security guard, to the calm before the storm, to the “Flood” of zombies overwhelming Steph and Babs. And the dialogue is tv-polished, as usual, without some of the hiccups of the first couple of arcs. It’s nice to see things coming back, like “Hey, you,” and the double-panel reaction indicating silence, then a very dry, cutting retort (this time about the fern, last time about humming).

    Cover: Artgerm presents a pretty solid action shot of Steph struggling against the techno-zombies, though the coloring is much more monochromatic than his work tends to be.

    Discussion Questions: How do all the references to Miller’s Teen Titans run, the Birds of Prey’s last fight with Calculator, Batman and Robin’s extra-Gotham adventures, and the many heroes and villains appearing work for you?

    Bonus Comic: None this week
    "We're the same thing, you and I. We're both lies that eventually became the truth." Lara Notsil, Star Wars: X-Wing: Solo Command, Aaron Allston
    "All that is not eternal is eternally out of date." C. S. Lewis, The Four Loves
    "There's room in our line of work for hope, too." Stephanie Brown
    Stephanie Brown Wiki, My Batman Universe Reviews, Stephanie Brown Discord

  10. #520
    I am a diamond, Ms. Pryde millernumber1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ohfellow View Post
    Speaking of recent "buys" there was also the DCeased #3 retailer variant from Unknown Comics, by Jay Anacleto, which is Barbara but drawn after Artgerm's cover of Batgirl #12. He's not of this Arterm school, though (as far as I know). Those have been selling on eBay for less than original price.
    That one I have to admit really irritated me, since Steph doesn't have that many iconic covers, and stealing one for Babs felt really frustrating.
    "We're the same thing, you and I. We're both lies that eventually became the truth." Lara Notsil, Star Wars: X-Wing: Solo Command, Aaron Allston
    "All that is not eternal is eternally out of date." C. S. Lewis, The Four Loves
    "There's room in our line of work for hope, too." Stephanie Brown
    Stephanie Brown Wiki, My Batman Universe Reviews, Stephanie Brown Discord

  11. #521
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    This is the darkest issue of the series, not so much for what happens but for the dread that's palpable throughout, though the way Babs is captured at the end is really dark. The scene with Steph meeting Gage in her civilian persona is basically the moment of levity to break up the doom and gloom.

    I feel the issue suffers a bit from the fact that there are actually 2 more issues to the arc. It seems like it's the middle chapter where things go to heck to set up the climatic final confrontation, and it is, but it's only the halfway point. It feels like the next issue should be the final issue and this ending should be 2/3 of the way through the story, not 50%. Not sure what would be cut, and it's only an issue because the tone is so much darker and gloomier in this issue than even the rest of the arc. Or maybe if the next issue was as dark, but it's very hard to keep a tone like that with an issue so devoted to action but without serious injury to anyone.

  12. #522
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    Quote Originally Posted by sunofdarkchild View Post
    This is the darkest issue of the series, not so much for what happens but for the dread that's palpable throughout, though the way Babs is captured at the end is really dark. The scene with Steph meeting Gage in her civilian persona is basically the moment of levity to break up the doom and gloom.

    I feel the issue suffers a bit from the fact that there are actually 2 more issues to the arc. It seems like it's the middle chapter where things go to heck to set up the climatic final confrontation, and it is, but it's only the halfway point. It feels like the next issue should be the final issue and this ending should be 2/3 of the way through the story, not 50%. Not sure what would be cut, and it's only an issue because the tone is so much darker and gloomier in this issue than even the rest of the arc. Or maybe if the next issue was as dark, but it's very hard to keep a tone like that with an issue so devoted to action but without serious injury to anyone.
    It is quite dark, but I think still not so hopeless that I have difficulty believing that the good guys can win. I actually thought that the pacing for this arc was really good, though I haven't reread the next two issues yet. I kind of miss the four-part arc. It's a bit meatier and allows for more characterization than the 2 or 3 parts, but tends to be less decompressed than the 6 parter.
    "We're the same thing, you and I. We're both lies that eventually became the truth." Lara Notsil, Star Wars: X-Wing: Solo Command, Aaron Allston
    "All that is not eternal is eternally out of date." C. S. Lewis, The Four Loves
    "There's room in our line of work for hope, too." Stephanie Brown
    Stephanie Brown Wiki, My Batman Universe Reviews, Stephanie Brown Discord

  13. #523
    Invincible Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ohfellow View Post
    Do we know who Steph reminds Gordon of? Perhaps the original Batgirl, which makes me ask an obvious question - what exactly do people in Gotham think happened to the original Batgirl, who disappeared when Barbara was shot? (Not to mention who reappeared when Barbara regained mobility.) And where does Gordon think Cass disappeared to? I guess these are pointless questions to ask.

    Maybe he's going to say she reminds him of Barbara, but if so -- why? They aren't exactly alike!
    He probably eventually realised the truth about Cass - she just changed her costume and codename. As for Barbara's Batgirl, maybe the public thought she'd been killed? Bear in mind, it wasn't long afterwards that Robin (Jason Todd) got murdered.
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  14. #524
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    Quote Originally Posted by millernumber1 View Post
    That one I have to admit really irritated me, since Steph doesn't have that many iconic covers, and stealing one for Babs felt really frustrating.
    You do have a point. Also, he didn't credit "After Artgerm." If he had, it might make some people interested in seeking the original. (Some of the eBay auctions do mention it's an Artgerm homage in the auction title.)

    Anacleto also drew an Adam Hughes homage of "Supergirl and the Legion of Super-Heroes" #23b for DCeased #2, also for Unknown Comics, which he did credit as "After AH!" That's an even more obscure cover, an incentive variant from 2006 -- I'm thinking Anacleto chose his subject matter from covers he found among Artgerm's and Hughes's work. No way he actually knew of this source material. For all we know, he thought the Artgerm original was Barbara.

  15. #525
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    I wonder if we will ever get Steph in any live-action works. I mean we have Cassie now. This is why I would love to see a Robin movie.

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