Lorna Dane: Polaris Appreciation 2020

[jmc247]

Genosha:

When you join a group branded by the world the T word to wage a war to take over an island of millions of mutants and about a million humans you don't do it peacefully. We see her depowered at war with a gun for weeks as an insurgent fighting the Magistrates and we see her pitch hitting for Magneto in the long periods he is injured leading the Genoshan Army. The war was a vicious civil war which turned openly genocidal as many historic race wars do.

Genoshan Genocide Fallout:

This is the era where we see Lorna use deadly force on panel for the first time. Lorna pulls the pins on the grenades of anti-mutant religious fanatics and reverses their bullets and frankly isn't about to play on Xavier's terms.

Polaris in space:

The X-Jammers with Lorna and Rachel were less blog standard x-team and more space warriors at war with the Shi’ar Empire.

[salarta]

I still feel this cover is one of the biggest unfortunate tease that never happened

I remember that as part of a banner at a comic con (I think it was SDCC but not certain) in the early 2010s. I remember fans raising all sorts of questions from it, like "Does this mean these characters are finally going to return to X-Men in a big way" and "Does Lorna's closeness to Apocalypse in the picture mean Marvel's going to do more with her time as Pestilence."

... And then Marvel said it was just whatever the artist wanted to draw and it didn't mean anything.

It's another of various examples of why I don't trust Marvel until I see actual pages. And sometimes even then, need to see the issue for full context first. A flip side "need to see issue first" case was how a preview for X-Factor #243 made it look horrible to me, but the actual issue turned out to be good.

[jmc247]

Given what Jordan White said about Frenzy would anywhere here be interested in seeing Lorna and her interact?

[Soulsword323]

I think aggressive may have been the wrong word because Polaris is definitely aggressive. I meant that I've never seen her as a killer or covert-ops type of character. X-Force takes care of the things that they don't want out and eliminates it. I never saw that for Polaris unless she was the "moral compass" of the team which I think has actually been a pretty good fit for Jean. But with recent developments in that book, maybe she's joining it...

Ah, okay. I get what you're saying.

And welcome to CBR! Always nice to see more Polaris fans.

[jmc247]

The X-factor publishing schedule will return to normal in November, I think—X-factor #5 isn’t an X of Swords tie-in issue, and is the fun finale to our first arc. �� #XFAQtor

https://twitter.com/mymonsterischic/...21964601556993

Leah Williams explains why no XF in October.

Welcome to the Polaris thread UncannyLZ.

I think I am understanding a bit more of what you are saying. I will only say I think its a matter of degrees. If Lorna is dating Exodus and involved in dealing with her Genosha fallout that could be interesting. I don't feel her as the voice of reason and the voice of the narrator is the right path for Lorna. But, different people have different prospectives and I respect that.

[UncannyLZ]

Given what Jordan White said about Frenzy would anywhere here be interested in seeing Lorna and her interact?

Frenzy is exactly someone I’d like to see Lorna interact with. An ex-acolyte find her place on Krakoa and has personality sounds like someone who Polaris should be friends with. Lorna needs more interactions with bigger names outside of her dad. If I had a choice, I’d pick Frenzy and Betsy as her close female friends. Betsy has her body swapped and finally has it back and is taking control of that. I think Lorna could relate since the Malice situation is similar. I’ve never saw her as someone who would besties with Jean. Friendly, of course, but not super close. It feels forced since they both dated brothers/were the 1st two women but outside of that don’t have much in common

I thought the Exodus relationship would be interesting if they showed the relationship grow and not just throw them together for the aesthetic. It would interesting to see Exodus and Polaris date and get to know each other. Not only is it new, but we’d get deeper into Polaris personality and actually see more of Exodus. He’s the only council member we know barely anything about! The stories could be interesting because is he dating her because he likes her or because of who her dad is and his allegiance to him? Does she like him or is this a case of daddy issues while dating? We could see the build something. That in my opinion is better than Havok or any other trip down nostalgia street. I also think who better to understand being a powerful manipulator of magnetism than an Omega Level telekinetic

[jmc247]

I’ve never saw her as someone who would besties with Jean. Friendly, of course, but not super close. It feels forced since they both dated brothers/were the 1st two women but outside of that don’t have much in common

Lorna runs into a problem that she is friends with everyone, but at the same time she has no relationships as they all are a half inch deep because they aren't based on anything deep.

Lorna and Jean's friendship has been dead a long time and you are right. I would like to see them resurrected as friends one day. But, they screwed up the old dynamics by centering it on them being the Summers brothers girlfriends and that is not interesting. Until they are ready to overhaul the very foundation of their relationship and build it on something else like being the inheritors of the legacies of the founders of the X-Men their friendship is gone, but not entirely forgotten.



Not that I mention it Lorna and Emma share a few things in common in terms of surviving the downfall of Genosha. Why is it Magneto has interesting relationships with virtually all the X-Men and Lorna with none of them? That answer is obvious as she is an outsider amongst the teams and Marvel has been unwilling since Austen to make her relationships with characters based in part on philosophical agreement or divergence as exists between Emma and other characters and Magneto and other characters.

Frenzy is exactly someone I’d like to see Lorna interact with. An ex-acolyte find her place on Krakoa and has personality sounds like someone who Polaris should be friends with. Lorna needs more interactions with bigger names outside of her dad. If I had a choice, I’d pick Frenzy and Betsy as her close female friends. Betsy has her body swapped and finally has it back and is taking control of that. I think Lorna could relate since the Malice situation is similar.

Lorna led Frenzy into battle on Genosha by the way. Though I don't think Frenzy knew it at the time.

But, yes Lorna could have a really interesting relationship with her based on their previous experiences and worldview. The same for Betsy though its harder for me to see what the relationship with the later might be about. Vague possession analogies that alot of characters have probably won't do it any more then it worked with Monet or a number of other characters. It needs to be build on something deep seated they could debate.

I thought the Exodus relationship would be interesting if they showed the relationship grow and not just throw them together for the aesthetic. It would interesting to see Exodus and Polaris date and get to know each other. Not only is it new, but we’d get deeper into Polaris personality and actually see more of Exodus. He’s the only council member we know barely anything about! The stories could be interesting because is he dating her because he likes her or because of who her dad is and his allegiance to him? Does she like him or is this a case of daddy issues while dating? We could see the build something. That in my opinion is better than Havok or any other trip down nostalgia street. I also think who better to understand being a powerful manipulator of magnetism than an Omega Level telekinetic

Lorna was ironically in the first comic Exodus ever appeared in Fatal Attractions. But, they never spoke as in once. That is crazy for two characters so connected to certain core topics important to them. Both Exodus and Lorna could use a character to bounce off their feelings and thoughts.

[AbnormallyNormal]

Given what Jordan White said about Frenzy would anywhere here be interested in seeing Lorna and her interact?

Yes. I am one of those who wanted Lorna on an Acolytes type squad like the other person was saying, although my vision of it would be a bit darker and more dynamic (as in the nature of the squad and its mission changes over the course of the story and ties in deeply to the overall Krakoa events, like they're revealed to serve Moira directly eventually and might have conflict with many other characters etc)

But for sure both Frenzy and Exodus are characters Lorna REALLY should be interacting with among others

[houndsofluv]

I don't agree that Polaris isn't aggressive like X-Force. I still think Lorna is a perfect fit for a team like X-Force, given both her personality and personal history. I hope to see her on an iteration one day.

hell yeah. she was singled out as a powerhouse in the 1st issue of X-Men and its gonna be interesting to see how that carries forward

Given what Jordan White said about Frenzy would anywhere here be interested in seeing Lorna and her interact?

yes pleaseee 100%

[rhaenylis]

"She deserves better" This may well be the only X-Men # 1 review that says Lorna deserves better than Alex Summers out of all the ones I've read (aside from the reviews on this forum)

[salarta]

"She deserves better" This may well be the only X-Men # 1 review that says Lorna deserves better than Alex Summers out of all the ones I've read (aside from the reviews on this forum)

"She deserves better" is practically Lorna's tagline because it's always true, and has become more pronounced since 2015. It's incredibly rare for Marvel to do right by her.


I'm indifferent about Lorna interacting with Frenzy. It's not among the interactions I most want to see and that I think are sorely needed, but I don't have anything against it either.

I want to clarify my views on Exodus. I don't mind Lorna interacting with him. I don't mind Lorna interacting with 99.999999% of characters, as long as it's done right. By right, I mean with respect to who Lorna is, especially her history and the status it should afford. Unfortunately, I'm skeptical of how likely it is that Marvel will treat Lorna well around him. If they were to be in a romantic relationship, I think it is highly likely that Marvel would treat Lorna poorly in the relationship.

Marvel has placed Exodus in a heightened position within their current books. He's on the Quiet Council. He's considered an Omega mutant. Lorna does not have either of these things or anything equivalent. This is despite the fact multiple past comics have basically said that if Magneto is considered Omega under the criteria set forth by Hickman, then Lorna must be too. Pair multiple cases of Marvel excluding and ignoring her where they objectively should not, and there's a very clear bias against Lorna at Marvel. In other words, what we have here is an inherent perception imbalance between the two. Marvel considers Exodus worthy of respect, and Lorna not. This kind of imbalance is a hotbed for misuse.

In my mind, I do not see Marvel in its current state writing a relationship between them as something that brings out the best in characters and leads to Lorna getting more of the respect she deserves. I see Marvel writing Lorna more along the lines of a princess whose only value lies in being used to bring the man she marries closer to her father the king. More "piece of property exchanged in a transaction" than actual character. That would not be a good dynamic for her, and it's exactly the kind of dynamic I see coming out of this Marvel.

Remember, this is the same Marvel that thought this cover, where Havok and Magneto fight over an unconscious Lorna like she's a trophy to be won and owned, was fine. This cover is not from decades ago when Marvel didn't know how to treat women. This cover is from 2018. People involved in the book that had this cover still work there.



If this were the Marvel of 2015, I would be much more open to the idea of a relationship with Exodus. I would have more trust in Marvel treating Lorna well. But we're dealing with the Marvel of today. I do not trust that this Marvel would treat Lorna right with him as a pairing. Maybe it would start off with a good appearance, but I believe that sooner or later it would deteriorate and leave Lorna in a ditch while Exodus does everything Lorna should be doing. Only once Lorna has received the respect she needs and deserves would that pairing be not so risky.

I'm sure some people think I'm overthinking this. My experience tells me not to discount things that seem implausible at first glance. And honestly, I think what we see when we turn on the news nowadays should be proof of just how plausible things that at first seem implausible can be.

But, again, interacting generally I can see being fine, if done well. It's the idea of a relationship that I see going very badly. I see only negatives for Lorna in that arrangement until a new Marvel comes along with far more respect for her.

[Dipter]

Salarta, are you planning on checking out X-Factor #1 this Wednesday?

[salarta]

Not currently. I haven't seen or heard anything about X-Factor that would lead me to expect good things for Lorna. All I've heard so far is a mix of things that sound nice but have no substance, and things (or rather, one very specific thing) I definitely do not want.

There is a single positive to it I can cite in that Leah Williams is a female writer. I used to say often that I felt Lorna would be better off with a female writer, under the idea that female writers are less likely to fall into male-centric ideas of how to treat her and female characters as a whole. This idea was supported, in my opinion, by Lorna being treated generally well by Marjorie Liu on Astonishing X-Men as well as the great depiction of her in Secret Wars: House of M (which had two female editors, Katie Kubert and Christina Harrington). But that really only increases chances, it doesn't guarantee them, and there are other factors in the mix (e.g. corporate culture, who their boss is, etc).

[Dipter]

Not currently. I haven't seen or heard anything about X-Factor that would lead me to expect good things for Lorna. All I've heard so far is a mix of things that sound nice but have no substance, and things (or rather, one very specific thing) I definitely do not want.

It's smart to be cautious about it, given the long history of Marvel neglecting Lorna. Would you mind elaborating on what that one thing you don't want is?

[salarta]

It's smart to be cautious about it, given the long history of Marvel neglecting Lorna. Would you mind elaborating on what that one thing you don't want is?

When the press release for X-Factor came out, Leah said one of the two friends she talked to about Lorna helped her see the Polaris x Havok relationship "in a new light." The friend is a fan of Polaris x Havok. That isn't confirmation of plans with them, but it comes on the heels of how Marvel's treated her for the past 3 years - misusing her to promote Havok on Blue, and forcing reminders of the relationship in various ways (e.g. how a Prisoner X memory image showed them kissing, but of course did not include an image of the Genoshan genocide). It's also the only thing about Lorna's history mentioned in everything I've seen for X-Factor. I consider that a massive red flag.

I'm not exactly eager to support a book on the fringes on the franchise where Lorna is only a team member instead of leading the team, isn't doing anything meaningful outside the book, and the only thing acknowledged about her is what man she's been the girlfriend of. Even if X-Factor were to turn out to be a masterpiece that treats Lorna perfectly, I'd still consider my take before release to have been justified based on what I've seen.