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  1. #976
    Ultimate Member dietrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CPSparkles View Post
    Damian is a kid who's trying to overcome the handicapped of his birth and past. He isn't trying to be a good person he IS a good person.
    He decided to help make sure the world is a better place where innocents don't suffer the second he was exposed to normal society outside of the cult that had been his whole world to then.

    That is a very very normal story. The world is full of stories of people who grew up in cults or closed off environments and their issues when integrating to normal society and how their behaviour differs from those of the 'normal' society as you and I define it.

    Even just people that have been kidnapped and spend a long time in captivity away from the society and world as we know it at times completely change their world view, morality and behaviour due to the environment they are held in.
    This doesn't mean they are Bad people similarly Damian isn't isn't a bad person. No one who willingly gave their lives twice for others. Who patrols and endangers their life everyday for others is already a good person.

    Damian faces consequences everyday for being a jerk. No one like him that is is the consecequence of jerky before behaviour [don't think they they execute people for being jerks]
    Most people who are jerks and bad at social relations never get past that. Not everyone adapts especially when some of that is a result of past trauma. I don't ask people who have a complex borne out of a yearning to be loved and accepted to just get over it much like I wouldn't ask a person who suffers from Anxiety due to an incident when they were kids to hurry up and change.

    Damian's friendship with Jon wasn't forced though their parents did set them up and Damian did send Maya to spy on Jon. A classic Bruce move which if I learnt anything from Superman [both Rebirth and Bendis] Clark never misses a chance to let Jon in on the strangness and batshit ways of Bruce Wayne.

    Lois goes as far as to call him crazy and Clark alludes to the same but he still trusts him with his life so their friendship makes sense.
    Saying that Jon always ends up doing what Damian wants is a blatant and easy to verify lie.

    Damian didn't have a childhood and his time with Jon gave him a taste of that. It won't give him a childhood but he got to have sleepovers, Play games and form a garage band.

    He got a tatse of what childhood is like for the average kid.

    Wanting to be treated as older doesn't mean he should which is what Superson did right. Damian with all his skills and enhancements is still a kid and kids often don't know whats best. So kudos to Bruce for encouraging the friendship, sending him to school and allowing him to have a hobby as regular as playing in a band.

    Bruce every now and then does make the right decision. Damian is a minor and as such doesn't always know what's best for him. It's why Bruce gets Ollie to watch over him when he's off world [without Damian's knowledgde] and why so many times it's a chore to get him to go do stuff like have a wash. He's a kid.

    Damian is a friends with Jon because Jon earned his respect and because he wants a friend. This has been the case since before the new 52 when he went seeking Colin's friendship, it's why he agreed to go to the movies with Duke, why he took drama lessons from Carrie, why he hangs out at a shelter etc

    Canon established for a longtime now that Damian has always been craving a friend and acceptance from others. He attempts to mask it but it's always been part of his narrative.

    Dick and Damian's dynamic isn't at all like Damian and Jon. That's like saying that Dick and Wally are like Dick and Bruce.
    This. So much this.

    Re the Supersons side of the comment.

    I might have big issues with Supersons but I still enjoyed it and recognise that it had lots of pro's.
    I just felt that it was watered down Damian + wasn't too jazzed about some fans now seeing Damian solely as part of a twin pack. They are the Supersons but they are also Damian Wayne and Jon Kent. Characters that exist on their own

  2. #977
    Ultimate Member dietrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dazai_Osamu View Post
    That's what makes Damian interesting, he's a jerk who is trying to become a good person or at least a less bad one. There are jerk characters and you like them because they are authentic in their jerkish way and they are horrible and once in a blue moon they faced consequences and it's right, but after that they are still jerks.

    Supersons is a great disservice for Damian, the most forced 'friendship' ever literally their fathers pushed that friendship, Jon was this generic cute and dull kid who always ended up doing what Damian wanted and Damian was a childish watered down him, he didn't have a childhood and a friend won't give him that, and he also wants respect and be treated as older than he is and SS created the opposite effect and an issue I find disconcerting is: why would a teen Damian like want to be friend with kid Jon? DC wanted a kind of ying yang, they had that effect with Dick, until they ruined him.
    I will refer you to the above post by CPSparkles. They said it all much better than I could have. Particularly their response to the your 1st paragraph.

    Fyi Jerk doesn't mean bad person just like nice doesn't mean good or decent person.

    I do however agree that Supersons did Damian a disservice in how they watered down his character, ignored past relationships and used him as a scapegoat for bad thing's Jon might do moving forward. That was shady as hell.
    Last edited by dietrich; 02-24-2020 at 09:51 AM.

  3. #978
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    [QUOTE=dietrich;4853178]
    Quote Originally Posted by RLV_1996 View Post

    To be honest the only passing of mantle that I think was done poorly was Jason's to Tim. Robin Damian is the thing that got me into comics so this might sound odd but I think that Robin should have ended when Jason died or at least Bruce should have taken a significant amount of time off to mourn his son [Jason], cherish the son he still had [Dick] before endangering another person's son [Tim]

    It was insensitive as hell.
    I kinda think so as well, that Bruce should have at least re-evaluated this “Robin” thing after Jason.

    But what I was referring to by poor passing of mantle is that almost every Robin took issue with them being replaced. In current canon, I think even Dick took issue with being replaced by Jason, Jason in turn took issue with Tim and Tim with Damian. And perhaps it could have been avoided in cases of Dick - Jason and Tim - Damian transition, but can’t really say for sure.

  4. #979
    Astonishing Member Blue22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    Considering Raven's skill set I hope he keeps his sass in check

    I like their relationship in that Universe. It doesn't have to be romantic just think it's cool that he found someone who gets him and can see him. Can see the real Damian
    I liked it as a good friendship but nothing more than that. I thought it was just the BBRae shipper in me talking at first but the more I thought about it, the more I just don't think Damian and Raven are compatible in that way. They have a bit in common and I'm sure they can relate to each other fairly well. But that's about it.

  5. #980
    Uncanny Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RLV_1996 View Post
    I kinda think so as well, that Bruce should have at least re-evaluated this “Robin” thing after Jason.

    But what I was referring to by poor passing of mantle is that almost every Robin took issue with them being replaced. In current canon, I think even Dick took issue with being replaced by Jason, Jason in turn took issue with Tim and Tim with Damian. And perhaps it could have been avoided in cases of Dick - Jason and Tim - Damian transition, but can’t really say for sure.
    How can Jason have taken issue with Tim? He was dead!
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  6. #981
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    How can Jason have taken issue with Tim? He was dead!
    I obviously meant after he came back to life, their relationship was not friendly at first.
    Last edited by RLV_1996; 02-24-2020 at 01:50 PM.

  7. #982
    Astonishing Member Fergus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    How can Jason have taken issue with Tim? He was dead!
    Jason took to dressing up as Robin
    tried to blow up Tim and tried to kill him several times
    kept calling him replacement

    Seems to me like Jason had a big issue with Tim replacing him.

  8. #983
    Ultimate Member dietrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fergus View Post
    Batman Tales was a treat. The kids loved it.
    Hope we get more titles like these.




    also this is a thing



    I guess the Japanese fans really liked Batman ninja
    How is this even a thing?
    Why is this even a thing?
    I'm also very interested. It sounds crazy as ****.

    batman Tales was okay but a tad too sickly sweet for me. Lil' Gotham was far superior imo.

    Also noticed that the only Damian pet featured was the one that was created by this particular writer. The trend continues.
    Last edited by dietrich; 02-24-2020 at 05:28 PM.

  9. #984
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    I'm curious. What relationships would you want writers to show? I mean show we have Dick which most like. I mean how does Damian even feel about this whole Rick storyline?

  10. #985
    Astonishing Member Fergus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmiMizuno View Post
    I'm curious. What relationships would you want writers to show? I mean show we have Dick which most like. I mean how does Damian even feel about this whole Rick storyline?
    I think it's shocking that we have pretty much no interactions between Damian and his aunt Kate or Barbara Gordon.
    Barbara and Damian have what seems to be a good relationship. I want to see more.

  11. #986
    Ultimate Member sifighter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmiMizuno View Post
    I'm curious. What relationships would you want writers to show? I mean show we have Dick which most like. I mean how does Damian even feel about this whole Rick storyline?
    Honestly I want more exploration outside of the teen titans with him and Wallace West/Kid Flash. Wallace has probably at this point been the hero nearest his age outside of Jon that he regularly works with, being on the teen titans together the longest out of anyone in the Rebirth/No Justice era of the book. Obviously their working relationship is different then his with Jon but I imagine there has to be some kind of acquaintanceship there for the two of them to continually work together. I mean think about it at this point I think Damian's been working with Wallace longer then he has with Jon.
    Last edited by sifighter; 02-24-2020 at 07:54 PM.
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  12. #987
    Ultimate Member dietrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sifighter View Post
    Honestly I want more exploration outside of the teen titans with him and Wallace West/Kid Flash. Wallace has probably at this point been the hero nearest his age outside of Jon that he regularly works with, being on the teen titans together the longest out of anyone in the Rebirth/No Justice era of the book. Obviously their working relationship is different then his with Jon but I imagine there has to be some kind of acquaintanceship there for the two of them to continually work together. I mean think about it at this point I think Damian's been working with Wallace longer then he has with Jon.
    Agree. I'd like more interactions between him and Wallace and other characters outside of the TT and the Bats.

    I like his relationship with Wallace and their history. The little bits we've got of them so far outside of the TT's book [In deathstoke] was nice.

    Maya is another character that I'd like to see more of their relationship.

  13. #988
    Ultimate Member dietrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmiMizuno View Post
    I'm curious. What relationships would you want writers to show? I mean show we have Dick which most like. I mean how does Damian even feel about this whole Rick storyline?
    The 2nd Nightwing Annual covers Damian's reaction to the Ric arc

  14. #989
    Astonishing Member Blue22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmiMizuno View Post
    I'm curious. What relationships would you want writers to show?
    Bring Maya back into the fold, you cowards! She was there for him before Jon and the Titans!

    Aside from that, I'm really only holding out hope for Colin.

    I don't particularly like Wallace so I don't care if they never interact again once this TT run is over. I like his relationship with Djinn but that's looking more and more like it's gonna come to a tragic end. Seeing him work with Emiko some more might be cool. I still wanna see him working alongside Jason and Cass. Always thought they'd make an interesting temporary trio.

  15. #990
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    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    How is this even a thing?
    Why is this even a thing?
    I'm also very interested. It sounds crazy as ****.

    batman Tales was okay but a tad too sickly sweet for me. Lil' Gotham was far superior imo.

    Also noticed that the only Damian pet featured was the one that was created by this particular writer. The trend continues.
    Titus and Alfred were in the book. It's missing the dragon, Batcow, Goliath, and oddly enough, several of the Lil Gotham pets.

    Ninja is entertaining, but most Damian fans hate it as Damian a) has the traditional haircut of the heir to the head of the Japanese household, and b) he's a happy, cheerful little bean of a kid. Which makes sense to me: he's spent a year hanging out with Dick and not having anyone try to kill or brainwash him. Of course he's happy. Plus he has a monkey, the monkey has a mate, and a whole troop that has adopted Damian and taught him to play the flute.

    It's utterly bizarre and very Japanese which makes it utterly delightful for the most part. Could have done without the cheesecake but it's an anime made for males. There will be cheesecake.

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