Damian Wayne: Robin Appreciation 2020

[Fergus]

The fallout from Teen Titans Annual pretty much takes care of one of the obstacles between Luke and the Cowl.
It also gives a viable reason to Bruce stepping back from Batman duties. King's Batman pretty much sets it up. Thomas asked Bruce to be a father to his son. Not to mention that having lost 1 father and in light of everything Thomas put him through to ensure Bruce doesn't make his mistakes [Bruce sending Damian into Gotham was tactical in light of Thomas' goal not reckless]. Bruce right now looking inwards. Taking a look at his relationship with his sons and asking himself some serious questions about what kind of father he's been? What type of life would his sons have in the future.

Bruce is rebuilding Gotham. If he had any type of heart or brain he'd also realise that other more important things need rebuilding as well.

All the emotional pummelling, angst, shootings, beating's and the Knightmares the Bats have dealt with can be turned into a positive Rebirth of the Batfamily if DC has Bruce take steps to heal and rebuild whats fractured in his relationshipwith ALL his sons.

[Digifiend]

I know some people thing Djinn's going to die but I actually think it's going to be Roundhouse. It makes more sense from a story perspective so he can finally fully redeem himself and Djinn's character is still needed for the romantic subplot.

You do realise that the current team is almost certainly done after April's issues? All plots are getting wrapped up. Either May is the final issue (April's solicits don't say Final Issue, so there's at least one more) or we're getting a new roster. Robin and whoever dies will need to be replaced.

[king81992]

Remind me why Bruce is bad in HiC?

Metal, King's Batman, HiC and JL are the biggest ones. How's the one in JL? Including No Justice, because while Metal is big, it's a limited series. King's Batman is both big and long.

All the members of the Trinity were bad in Heroes In Crisis. They set up a psychiatric facility with no professional supervision.

[Digifiend]

And the consequences? A bunch of dead heroes, including Roy Harper.

[sifighter]

Personally in the past few months I’ve been thinking maybe it would be better if Damian was put on the JSA instead of the teen titans. Clearly DC has shown that when it comes to the teen titans Damian has some issues with people of his own age, and honestly I think it would be a much better benefit to put Damian with a group of elder statesmen of the dc universe who have been around a long time and have dealt with teenagers with attitudes and have helped progress them as better heroes. Plus it would put Damian in a much different team dynamic, one where he’s not the leader or the tactician because everyone leading the team is older and more experienced and it would be decades before Damian could even think of being in the chairman position. That way he can just learn to work on a team with people, not as some destined leader because his father is Batman but as teammates and friends.

[Zaresh]

Personally in the past few months I’ve been thinking maybe it would be better if Damian was put on the JSA instead of the teen titans. Clearly DC has shown that when it comes to the teen titans Damian has some issues with people of his own age, and honestly I think it would be a much better benefit to put Damian with a group of elder statesmen of the dc universe who have been around a long time and have dealt with teenagers with attitudes and have helped progress them as better heroes. Plus it would put Damian in a much different team dynamic, one where he’s not the leader or the tactician because everyone leading the team is older and more experienced and it would be decades before Damian could even think of being in the chairman position. That way he can just learn to work on a team with people, not as some destined leader because his father is Batman but as teammates and friends.

I would read that.

[dietrich]

Personally in the past few months IÂ’ve been thinking maybe it would be better if Damian was put on the JSA instead of the teen titans. Clearly DC has shown that when it comes to the teen titans Damian has some issues with people of his own age, and honestly I think it would be a much better benefit to put Damian with a group of elder statesmen of the dc universe who have been around a long time and have dealt with teenagers with attitudes and have helped progress them as better heroes. Plus it would put Damian in a much different team dynamic, one where heÂ’s not the leader or the tactician because everyone leading the team is older and more experienced and it would be decades before Damian could even think of being in the chairman position. That way he can just learn to work on a team with people, not as some destined leader because his father is Batman but as teammates and friends.

Damian has no problems working with age mates, making friends. Supersons played up the parodies of their dads for comedy.

His past and stories show this over and over
Streets of Gotham
Gotham Academy
Robin Son of Batman
batman and Robin Annual [short interactions with characters his own age]

Are some examples that show that this isn't the case and never was.

He has poor social skills and is emotionally stunned kinda but he's never had issues dealing with characters his age under various writers.

Damian on the Jsa would be like in No Justice, Metal, Leviathan, Batman, GA, Deathstroke. That is when he's need to prove himself kicks in some adults aren't sensitive enough to see through to the insecurities that drive it. Others aren't patient enough or lack the skills to effectively get past this.

Lol His complexies aren't anything to do with Batman or his father. It's a conditioned behaviour from his LOA upbringing. Everything is earned including your right to life [TT showed that every step up the ladder you have to do so by defeating and drinking the blood of the one whose place you take], You have to prove your worth there's such thing as conditional love, information or any advantage is fought and paid for in blood like it took him years of fighting his mum every Birthday to learn who his dad was.
Damian has had it drilled into him that he has to be better, perfect, never fail or disappoint else he would be replaced by the numerous clones of him. His mum did just that with Heretic and killed him. This was after disowning him and putting a bounty on his head and hijacking his body to kill Grayson.

If his problem was simply his father's shadow then Damian wouldn't be as messed up or have have the issues/insecurities he has.

Sometimes attitudes are a mask for severe emotional abuse. Sometimes they are symptoms of or coping/conditioned behaviour due to lord know what in past experiences.

Well adjusted confident people with healthy balanced hormone levels rarely have cop an attitude.

[Ansa]

The fallout from Teen Titans Annual pretty much takes care of one of the obstacles between Luke and the Cowl.
It also gives a viable reason to Bruce stepping back from Batman duties. King's Batman pretty much sets it up. Thomas asked Bruce to be a father to his son. Not to mention that having lost 1 father and in light of everything Thomas put him through to ensure Bruce doesn't make his mistakes [Bruce sending Damian into Gotham was tactical in light of Thomas' goal not reckless]. Bruce right now looking inwards. Taking a look at his relationship with his sons and asking himself some serious questions about what kind of father he's been? What type of life would his sons have in the future.

Bruce is rebuilding Gotham. If he had any type of heart or brain he'd also realise that other more important things need rebuilding as well.

All the emotional pummelling, angst, shootings, beating's and the Knightmares the Bats have dealt with can be turned into a positive Rebirth of the Batfamily if DC has Bruce take steps to heal and rebuild whats fractured in his relationshipwith ALL his sons.

That's what I would like to happen, but I'm too much of a pessimist to believe in it.

It would be nice if Bruce would realise that with Alfred gone and Dick still not being back to normal it's 100% his responsibility to keep the family together (it should have been his responsibility to begin with, but you all know how dc is) and to raise his son. That while what Damian did was wrong, it was only possible because Bruce failed him as a mentor and father. That beating the crap out of him or firing him is not gonna teach him to solve his problems with less extreme methods.

But after all that shock value crap in King's Batman run, Bruce's non reaction to Damian leaving him after No Justice, how brutally Bruce beat Jason in RHatO without listening to his side of the story first and how badly Glass set up the confrontation between Jason and Damian in Teen Titans...I'm too aftraid we'll get a mash up of the last TT annual and RHatO instead of something like the beginning of Tomasi's Batman and Robin where Bruce was willing to forgive, listen and work on himself too.

[Ansa]

All the members of the Trinity were bad in Heroes In Crisis. They set up a psychiatric facility with no professional supervision.

And after they reopened it with apparently no changes to the facility Bruce sent every single one of his children to the murder place.
This is why you need editors. To prevent your heroes from looking like villains on accident.

[Ansa]

Of course Damian having a confrontation with Bruce and deciding for himself that he has had enough of Bruce as a father/mentor and doesn't want to be his Robin anymore would be an interesting direction for both of them. Damian having a chance to distance himself from that whole blood/legacy/heir stuff and Bruce getting a reason to overthink his priorities.

But again...DC loves shock value, loves the "Damian will turn evil" angle and loves coming up with reasons for why Bruce hitting his children is a-ok.
DC always takes Bruce's side, no matter how shitty the writer makes him act and I don't expect this to be any different, if this issue should really mark the end of Damian as Robin.

[Korath]

Honestly it seems that there is really something big coming for Damian. Too many hints in too many books for April to be just one more month were he's acting unsupervised.

[Fergus]

The upcoming JSA is gonna be written by Synder right? If so then worst place for Damian.

Synder's Damian is extra with the snarky comments and sass mouth. He sassed most of the cast in all issues of Metal he featured on WW, Hawkgirl,etc same on No Justice from Fate to Brainaic to Jo'nn. He trolled Joker so bad he lost his cool, confessed to his inability to make anyone laugh without drugs [aside from Bats] in DOTF and they indulge him.

His damian is rude not insecure or trying to prove his worth. He's funny though. He's not going to learn though

[Ansa]

Batman is an anti hero at best, at worst he's a broken 'hero' who can't save anyone.

The problem is that DC refuses to admit that Batman is an anti hero because that would involve taking responsibility for all the sketchy decisions they've made regarding his character and reconsider the possibility that making him the center of their universe( Doomsday Clock would have readers believe it's Superman, but readers know otherwise) was a terrible idea.

That's why I'm struggling with Bruce so much. It would be okay if DC would own it and admit that all the **** he does makes him an anti-hero. Instead they let writers get away with Bruce's bad actions, say it's okay because "He's Batman and while his methods are sketchy everyone knows it's going to be fine in the end, because he's Batman" and continue calling him a hero.

Like...Sometimes it feels like his actions are supposed to be good simply because he's Batman and not because they are actually good.

Either write him as an ass and own it or write him as a better hero and person.

[Fergus]

Damian was going to give up Robin for the duration of 5G that was a given but he'll be back in the role. This does it in a way that isn't in anyway to do with Luke [DC want's as many fans on board and open minded] it's also a resolution to his experimenting on TT's arc

If DC has Bruce only rebuilding Gotham after everything then he's a lost case. It couldn't be more clear what his fightt with Thomas, Alfred's loss, Dick, Jason Tim and Damian's current states and fallouts with him are alluding to.

Tim clearly isn't thinking clearly, Jason is not quite but almost mentoring baddies while his dodgy dad is hoovering, Damian has a prison [Jason did too] is mind wiping baddies and Slade of all people is looking to be his dad. Dick was shot and Bruce thought he was faking his memory loss then tried to force his memory back by showing him traumatic video's and leaping out of the dark at him. Any wonder he rejected it all favouring happy memories of his mum as Richard. I don't even think Bruce and Damian respected his needs enough to call him Richard in that annual

Alfred isn't around to guilt the family into ignoring all. Bruce needs to check in on his sons. King promised changes well a healthier Batfamily and a Batdad who's putting a little effort in and embracing the joy of family

[Ansa]

Alfred isn't around to guilt the family into ignoring all. Bruce needs to check in on his sons. King promised changes well a healthier Batfamily and a Batdad who's putting a little effort in and embracing the joy of family

Er...you do remember that King is also the guy who wrote Bruce as viewing his kids as his "loyal soldiers", only used them as cannon fodder and made it pretty clear his Bruce only needed Selina to be happy. Damian wasn't even in the second annual. I wouldn't be suprised if King only meant Bruce is going to be a better father for Helena in Batman and Catwoman.
And from what I heard it's not even clear anymore if that book is still going to be canon.
Fact is, important changes will happen in the main book, in Tynions run. King said so. That doesn't fit with the other promises he made for his book. Combined with the delays, I don't think anything that King says is important for main continuity Batman anymore.