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  1. #1531
    Caperucita Roja Zaresh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Restingvoice View Post
    [...]
    As for Jason, the concept of Outlaws didn't start as street level. It's most likely inspired by the Countdown team of Donna and Kyle, a dimensional-hopping story that Didio really likes. I can see him wanting that concept to carry over to his New 52 universe. This time with Roy and Kori. Their adventures were also more like Titans than UTRH, fighting Blackfire, metahumans, and immortals, then teaming up with Teen Titans.
    [...]
    Probably the only thing people actually like and feel savable from Countdown is the multiverse adventures of the Challengers (because it's what it was, a challengers' team, to be honest). It was pretty enjoyable and fun, had nice dynamics, until near the end of it.

    (I'm all in for more DickKori)

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    Last edited by Zaresh; 03-29-2020 at 02:43 PM.
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  2. #1532
    Astonishing Member Fergus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue22 View Post
    Why not? Alfred did XD
    Ouch! That was Brutal, funny and canon

  3. #1533
    Extraordinary Member dietrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Restingvoice View Post
    True, but I think DC is just stuck on the branding. If they see a status quo or dynamic they like they want to keep that image. We're talking about longtime fans working on longtime works that inspired them. They're as stubborn as any old fandom.

    As for Jason, the concept of Outlaws didn't start as street level. It's most likely inspired by the Countdown team of Donna and Kyle, a dimensional-hopping story that Didio really likes. I can see him wanting that concept to carry over to his New 52 universe. This time with Roy and Kori. Their adventures were also more like Titans than UTRH, fighting Blackfire, metahumans, and immortals, then teaming up with Teen Titans.

    Speaking of Titans, Didio wanted Jason to be Nightwing way back in Infinite Crisis, and a lot of his plans that he wrote back then, like separating Lois and Clark, happened in New 52. So I can see Countdown and Outlaws series as a fulfillment of his initial wish of making Jason Nightwing and work with his friends.

    In Rebirth, they're now street level because Johns' Rebirth concept is to bring back every character to their most recognizable elements. In the case of Jason, it's UTRH, which is street level, darker, no space adventure, and has Black Mask. I guess he likes the Outlaws concept but brings Artemis and Bizarro to replace Kori and Roy, who are more recognizable to wider audience in Titans.

    Bringing Kori and Dick back, creating a new concept of them being together in Bludhaven, is not impossible, but someone needs to want to do it first. Otherwise, DC's just gonna go with what's work.
    That was a typo.
    I meant his title isn't street hence the all win at the end.
    The restrictions that prevent a bat dating a super power character don't apply including the street level title which nightwing and Batman are so he's good to go.
    He's all win

  4. #1534
    Spectacular Member Light of Justice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue22 View Post
    Why not? Alfred did XD
    Now you make me wonder what will happen if Damian develops supernatural abilities. It's kinda hinted isn't it? His future as Batman in Batman666, his battle with Gotham Girl (sold his soul etc), and now he already learn the content of Book of Damned from cover to cover and all the sigils. If metas are unwelcome in Gotham, how about human who learn supernatural magic?

  5. #1535
    Extraordinary Member Jackalope89's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Light of Justice View Post
    Now you make me wonder what will happen if Damian develops supernatural abilities. It's kinda hinted isn't it? His future as Batman in Batman666, his battle with Gotham Girl (sold his soul etc), and now he already learn the content of Book of Damned from cover to cover and all the sigils. If metas are unwelcome in Gotham, how about human who learn supernatural magic?
    Zatanna frequents Gotham, and is often regarded as one of Bruce's oldest friends (barring the whole pre-Flashpoint Identity Crisis thing). So, magic users seem to be an exception of sorts.

  6. #1536
    Extraordinary Member dietrich's Avatar
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    Man @lightofjustice you just reminded of King's batman and one of the things I hated the most.

    That reference to Batman666.

    An Insecure Damian trading his soul to keep Gotham safe because he believes he isn't as good as Bruce or Dick. That works and respects the legacy of the two Batmen before him.

    Changing that to Bruce sends teen sidekick to infiltrate Gotham.
    His mission is
    get to Gotham where bats are banned, over run with villains and has a superpowered gate keeper who has powers similar to Superman's, [Gotham soloed the Jl] who isn't vulnerable to kryptonite
    Engage Thomas
    throw the fight and allow himself to be taken hostage
    Break free, unlock the door and let the rest of the bat crew in.

    Damian accomplishes his mission of course and like a boss.
    How did he get past the superman-like gate keeper ? Magic. He traded his soul for a magic something so he could accomplish the mission Batman sent him on.

    While a ridiculously mustachioed Bruce is learning how to throw batarangs, sun bathing, enjoying cocktails while waiting for some drugs Damian was selling his soul for Gotham and taking down a super.

    Why would a Batman writer write that? Why make that change.
    king did batman dirty and hard.

    King made it clear that 100% Damian Wayne defeated GG. This super who flicked The Atom away like a fly. Was never even a problem for 13 year old Robin. He gave him ownership while taking a dig [I interpreted it as a dig any way] at batman in this panel



    batman's plans for Superman is Krptonite.

    The other possibility [option B] is that it was Bruce's plan meaning Bruce ordered his son to trade his soul for this.

    That would make Bruce a monster and Bruce isn't a monster not even in a run as damaging as King's. King's Bruce is incompetent so it's definitely Option A

    He didn't have to link 666 to his story. I don't get why writer's have to keep touching that world. getting their sticky prints all over it. trying to link it to their rubbish stories and attempting to make changes no one asked for.

    That is my favourite batman and AA 2 is my single most anticipated thing right now. i doubt King's hinting, change, suggestions , whatever it was matters or leads to anything.

    I hope not because King's take sucks.

    i did however enjoy seeing Damian take her down. i also admit that was wank. It also makes damian very look like a stu.

    i also liked King making Damian a bullet timer. That is canon now and no one can challenge that
    Last edited by dietrich; 03-30-2020 at 02:21 AM.

  7. #1537
    Extraordinary Member dietrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Light of Justice View Post
    Now you make me wonder what will happen if Damian develops supernatural abilities. It's kinda hinted isn't it? His future as Batman in Batman666, his battle with Gotham Girl (sold his soul etc), and now he already learn the content of Book of Damned from cover to cover and all the sigils. If metas are unwelcome in Gotham, how about human who learn supernatural magic?
    If Damian gained the ability of the 666 dude then he doesn't need Gotham. the guy survived a nuclear bomb! He'd be of greater us else where but then again he's not got super strength and he's still a short 13 year old.

    he'd have to stay in Gotham since he's still a minor and batman would just have to suck it up. It's not like he kill him

  8. #1538
    Amazing Member Yennefer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    Man @lightofjustice you just reminded of King's batman and one of the things I hated the most.

    That reference to Batman666.

    An Insecure Damian trading his soul to keep Gotham safe because he believes he isn't as good as Bruce or Dick. That works and respects the legacy of the two Batmen before him.

    Changing that to Bruce sends teen sidekick to infiltrate Gotham.
    His mission is
    get to Gotham where bats are banned, over run with villains and has a superpowered gate keeper who has powers similar to Superman's, [Gotham soloed the Jl] who isn't vulnerable to kryptonite
    Engage Thomas
    throw the fight and allow himself to be taken hostage
    Break free, unlock the door and let the rest of the bat crew in.

    Damian accomplishes his mission of course and like a boss.
    How did he get past the superman-like gate keeper ? Magic. He traded his soul for a magic something so he could accomplish the mission Batman sent him on.

    While a ridiculously mustachioed Bruce is learning how to throw batarangs, sun bathing, enjoying cocktails while waiting for some drugs Damian was selling his soul for Gotham and taking down a super.

    Why would a Batman writer write that? Why make that change.
    king did batman dirty and hard.

    King made it clear that 100% Damian Wayne defeated GG. This super who flicked The Atom away like a fly. Was never even a problem for 13 year old Robin. He gave him ownership while taking a dig [I interpreted it as a dig any way] at batman in this panel



    batman's plans for Superman is Krptonite.

    The other possibility [option B] is that it was Bruce's plan meaning Bruce ordered his son to trade his soul for this.

    That would make Bruce a monster and Bruce isn't a monster not even in a run as damaging as King's. King's Bruce is incompetent so it's definitely Option A

    He didn't have to link 666 to his story. I don't get why writer's have to keep touching that world. getting their sticky prints all over it. trying to link it to their rubbish stories and attempting to make changes no one asked for.

    That is my favourite batman and AA 2 is my single most anticipated thing right now. i doubt King's hinting, change, suggestions , whatever it was matters or leads to anything.

    I hope not because King's take sucks.

    i did however enjoy seeing Damian take her down. i also admit that was wank. It also makes damian very look like a stu.

    i also liked King making Damian a bullet timer. That is canon now and no one can challenge that
    Please....
    King never actually wrote Batman 😂
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  9. #1539
    Spectacular Member Light of Justice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    Man @lightofjustice you just reminded of King's batman and one of the things I hated the most.

    That reference to Batman666.

    An Insecure Damian trading his soul to keep Gotham safe because he believes he isn't as good as Bruce or Dick. That works and respects the legacy of the two Batmen before him.

    Changing that to Bruce sends teen sidekick to infiltrate Gotham.
    His mission is
    get to Gotham where bats are banned, over run with villains and has a superpowered gate keeper who has powers similar to Superman's, [Gotham soloed the Jl] who isn't vulnerable to kryptonite
    Engage Thomas
    throw the fight and allow himself to be taken hostage
    Break free, unlock the door and let the rest of the bat crew in.

    Damian accomplishes his mission of course and like a boss.
    How did he get past the superman-like gate keeper ? Magic. He traded his soul for a magic something so he could accomplish the mission Batman sent him on.

    While a ridiculously mustachioed Bruce is learning how to throw batarangs, sun bathing, enjoying cocktails while waiting for some drugs Damian was selling his soul for Gotham and taking down a super.

    Why would a Batman writer write that? Why make that change.
    king did batman dirty and hard.
    Oh you have no idea how angry I am when I read the cursed sentence 'I send Damian in.' My annoyance when reading 'bat' 'cat' dialogue exploded on that moment, bonus the fact that he said it on a beach while holding Selina and looking at the sunset like what the heck? I know Damian is ninja kid, but when you practically send your 13 years old kid to enemy territory and order to let himself to be captured, should you, I don't know, make some worry face? Or pray that your enemy will not hurt your kid? or attach a mini camera on Damian's uniform so he can know what happened or something? I remember my first travel alone to other country and my father will call me and chat me like once an hour until I send him a photo that I arrived on my friend's home safely.

    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    King made it clear that 100% Damian Wayne defeated GG. This super who flicked The Atom away like a fly. Was never even a problem for 13 year old Robin. He gave him ownership while taking a dig [I interpreted it as a dig any way] at batman in this panel



    batman's plans for Superman is Krptonite.
    Oh yeah I forgot this interaction. It turns out that Damian has fascination to magic even before the whole Book of Damned stuff.

    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    The other possibility [option B] is that it was Bruce's plan meaning Bruce ordered his son to trade his soul for this.

    That would make Bruce a monster and Bruce isn't a monster not even in a run as damaging as King's. King's Bruce is incompetent so it's definitely Option A

    He didn't have to link 666 to his story. I don't get why writer's have to keep touching that world. getting their sticky prints all over it. trying to link it to their rubbish stories and attempting to make changes no one asked for.
    I also don't know, but I think DC is trying to brew some plot into Damian's dark future. Arrival of future Tim, 'baby Hitler' hint on Legion of Superheroes #3, also seems like Damian's moral support is gone from him one by one. Alfred, Dick, Jon, and Bruce likely OTW, because why does Damian try to kill KGBeast after his collision with Bruce? Isn't that collision supposed to educate Damian that building prisoner with virus protocol is wrong, brainwashing criminal is wrong, etc?
    We discussed before about Supersons comic watered down Damian, but what if Damian made himself to be 'less dark' when he was with Jon? And also the fact that Supersons is canceled even though it's obvious that they're very popular and their sales went well. But that's only my speculation.

    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    That is my favourite batman and AA 2 is my single most anticipated thing right now. i doubt King's hinting, change, suggestions , whatever it was matters or leads to anything.

    I hope not because King's take sucks.

    i did however enjoy seeing Damian take her down. i also admit that was wank. It also makes damian very look like a stu.

    i also liked King making Damian a bullet timer. That is canon now and no one can challenge that
    What is bullet timer? Or do you mean ticking bomb?

  10. #1540
    Spectacular Member Light of Justice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    If Damian gained the ability of the 666 dude then he doesn't need Gotham. the guy survived a nuclear bomb! He'd be of greater us else where but then again he's not got super strength and he's still a short 13 year old.
    Why did I imagine that if Damian seriously learns dark magic, the first thing he will try is magic to make him taller? XD

    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    he'd have to stay in Gotham since he's still a minor and batman would just have to suck it up. It's not like he kill him
    Doesn't Tim start to live outside the manor when he was only 17? (I don't care what Bendis say, there's no way Tim is only 16 years old. That means when Damian came to Gotham he was only 13 and that is impossible scenario).
    Last edited by Light of Justice; 03-30-2020 at 09:16 AM.

  11. #1541
    Astonishing Member sifighter's Avatar
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    Honestly that would be pretty cool if Damian’s distinction from the rest of the batfamily is that he used magic, I imagine that would be very useful in the future. Just stay away from Constantine is all. If batfamily, study with Zatanna.

    Though I suppose it would probably make more sense to learn from Raven since he at least knows her some what in the comics, unless Djinn sticks around.
    Last edited by sifighter; 03-30-2020 at 05:51 AM.
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  12. #1542
    Invincible Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Light of Justice View Post
    Doesn't Tim start to live outside the manor when he was only 17? (I don't care what Bendis say, there's no way Tim is only 16 years old. That means when Damian came to Gotham he was only 13 and that is impossible scenario).
    Yeah, if pre-Flashpoint stuff is back in continuity, there's no way he's 16. In fact the Robin special, in the Red Robin story, Tim tells Dick that he isn't yet 20. Wouldn't he say 18 if he was under that age? Seems like he's 19 - and it's been retconned that he was that age in Rebirth Detective Comics, where originally he was 16.
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  13. #1543
    Astonishing Member CPSparkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Light of Justice View Post
    Oh you have no idea how angry I am when I read the cursed sentence 'I send Damian in.' My annoyance when reading 'bat' 'cat' dialogue exploded on that moment, bonus the fact that he said it on a beach while holding Selina and looking at the sunset like what the heck? I know Damian is ninja kid, but when you practically send your 13 years old kid to enemy territory and order to let himself to be captured, should you, I don't know, make some worry face? Or pray that your enemy will not hurt your kid? or attach a mini camera on Damian's uniform so he can know what happened or something? I remember my first travel alone to other country and my father will call me and chat me like once an hour until I send him a photo that I arrived on my friend's home safely.


    Oh yeah I forgot this interaction. It turns out that Damian has fascination to magic even before the whole Book of Damned stuff.



    I also don't know, but I think DC is trying to brew some plot into Damian's dark future. Arrival of future Tim, 'baby Hitler' hint on Legion of Superheroes #3, also seems like Damian's moral support is gone from him one by one. Alfred, Dick, Jon, and Bruce likely OTW, because why does Damian try to kill KGBeast after his collision with Bruce? Isn't that collision supposed to educate Damian that building prisoner with virus protocol is wrong, brainwashing criminal is wrong, etc?
    We discussed before about Supersons comic watered down Damian, but what if Damian made himself to be 'less dark' when he was with Jon? And also the fact that Supersons is canceled even though it's obvious that they're very popular and their sales went well. But that's only my speculation.



    What is bullet timer? Or do you mean ticking bomb?
    bullet timers are characters that can dodge bullets either by being extremely fast like Neo from the Matrix or Flash.

    Casual bullets timers are not any where near the level of Flash of course

    Cass is a casual bullet timer because she was trained to read body language. Batman is a casual Bullet timer because of his ninja training.

    Damian with his training, reflexes'agility and size is a casual Bullet timer. We've seen him do it in other comics it's just that when they need him to be lose to someone bigger and slower they purposefully forget

  14. #1544
    Astonishing Member CPSparkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sifighter View Post
    Honestly that would be pretty cool if Damian’s distinction from the rest of the batfamily is that he used magic, I imagine that would be very useful in the future. Just stay away from Constantine is all. If batfamily, study with Zatanna.

    Though I suppose it would probably make more sense to learn from Raven since he at least knows her some what in the comics, unless Djinn sticks around.
    I like the idea of Damian using magic.
    He could be a magical Ninja.

    Why stay away from Constantine? I mean actually hoping that DCeased 2 and JLD2 will give us a decent amount of Damian interacting with Constantine.

    I want to know what would look like.
    Last edited by CPSparkles; 03-30-2020 at 09:47 AM.

  15. #1545
    Astonishing Member CPSparkles's Avatar
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    I didn't like King's nods to Batman 666 but I liked everything else. Damian taking down GG was great to read.

    He's dialogue was great all through the issue.
    Him getting his magic wand from the Witch boy was brilliant [it implies that Damian knows him or has connections to him. I want to know more]
    Damian following through on his bold outrageous claim about taking down supers show's that Damian as outrageous as his claims and boasts might sound is actually simply being direct and factual.

    That issue joined batboys brunch, Alfred telling the boys of the engagement. Elmer fudd, Prelude to the wedding [all of them],Dick and Damian's trip to the desert as my top issues from the run.

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