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  1. #451
    Amazing Member Shen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ansa View Post
    Seriously, at this point Bruce could probably punch Damian to mush and DC would find a way to blame Damian for it and to continue calling Bruce a hero.
    I mean, Damian would forgive him. He forgave Talia for basically killing him. Then Dami would blame himself and keep getting sadder and angrier, and so the DC wheel of torturing him would revolve and repeat all over again.

  2. #452
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shen View Post
    I mean, Damian would forgive him. He forgave Talia for basically killing him. Then Dami would blame himself and keep getting sadder and angrier, and so the DC wheel of torturing him would revolve and repeat all over again.
    It's not about Damian forgiving him. I wish Bruce would start thinking about all the crap he put his family through and it would be nice if the others would start calling him out too. I want to see a better Batman.
    That's never going to happen though.

    And as I said in a previous post: I'm sick of depressing stories and I'm sick of everything getting destroyed instead of built.

    5G doesn't sound exciting, sometimes I ask myself why I'm still sticking around.
    Last edited by Ansa; 01-17-2020 at 01:07 PM.

  3. #453
    Invincible Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    This is true but he's also a minor who needs supervision.
    Damian has gone off the rails regardless of his best intentions or the fact that he's doing what we saw Bruce doing in his title.

    They are both at fault. Damian needs to regain Batman's trust and Bruce needs to regain his position as respected authority figure. Damian lost faith in the grown up heroes which led him to try harsher more permanent solutions. He doesn't have faith in Batman's methods and believes that Bruce is too pre-occupied to notice his activities.

    The fact that it took Bruce this long to find out pretty much says it all about how bad he failed in both his duties as parent and mentor.

    What happened to Batman having eyes on everyone? It was established in different titles that he has all sorts of eyes on Damian.
    Ric happened. Dick was probably those eyes.
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  4. #454
    Extraordinary Member Jackalope89's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shen View Post
    I mean, Damian would forgive him. He forgave Talia for basically killing him. Then Dami would blame himself and keep getting sadder and angrier, and so the DC wheel of torturing him would revolve and repeat all over again.
    They kept the victim blaming for Jason Todd, even after he came back to life. So sadly, there is precedent.

  5. #455
    Extraordinary Member dietrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    Ric happened. Dick was probably those eyes.
    Which is another failure on Bruce's part. Damian is Bruce;s responsibility not Dick's.

    The thing is that it's down to the writer of TT for deciding to go in this direction. They could have written Damian's crisis and Bruce's character better but they went in this direction on purpose. They wanted to write this story.

    The involvement of other writers e.g Priest and Tomasi lead me to believe that editorial approved it.

    It makes it hard to 100% feel pissed at Bruce since we have so many versions which contradict each other.

    After Metal and all the emphasis it placed on how much his kids mean to Bruce. So much that he's love, loss and regret at loving them so much resulted in 3 evil Batmen. Was the reason why the BatGod could trap him for so long and was the key to old Bruce who had given up finding the strength to break out of the Lotus machine thingy.

    I'm struggling to fully view Bruce as harshly as I should just based on TT.


    unpopular opinion I can see where those who blame the family for Batman being written as unlikable get that idea but it's on the creatives and those in charge. I'm more pissed at them.

    Trying to come at this as objectivly as poss to stop me being so annoyed.
    Last edited by dietrich; 01-17-2020 at 06:55 PM.

  6. #456
    Extraordinary Member dietrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackalope89 View Post
    They kept the victim blaming for Jason Todd, even after he came back to life. So sadly, there is precedent.
    If Batman wasn't teflon he'd be more of an anti hero rather than a hero.

  7. #457
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    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    Well in Justice League Batman does say that Jarro is the best Robin ever. So he would be getting replaced by the Best.
    Jarro is a cute meme that's starting to overstay its welcome.

  8. #458
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    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    If Batman wasn't teflon he'd be more of an anti hero rather than a hero.
    Batman is an anti hero at best, at worst he's a broken 'hero' who can't save anyone.

    The problem is that DC refuses to admit that Batman is an anti hero because that would involve taking responsibility for all the sketchy decisions they've made regarding his character and reconsider the possibility that making him the center of their universe( Doomsday Clock would have readers believe it's Superman, but readers know otherwise) was a terrible idea.

  9. #459
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    I know some people thing Djinn's going to die but I actually think it's going to be Roundhouse. It makes more sense from a story perspective so he can finally fully redeem himself and Djinn's character is still needed for the romantic subplot. Also, Djinn's story is about finding out who she is as a person and getting her own identity. I highly doubt Glass would kill her off before allowing the character to have that growth. But death allows Roundhouse to have some sort of redemption and die a hero. If you think about it his death was foreshadowed in the earliest issues of this run. I am not worried about Djinn I think from a plot standpoint it's clear Roundhouse is going to die. Also Glass seems to be taking inspiration from older Teen Titans runs and Terra the first Judas in Teen Titans history doesn't make it out alive.
    Last edited by shadow6743; 01-17-2020 at 06:16 PM.

  10. #460
    Extraordinary Member dietrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by king81992 View Post
    Batman is an anti hero at best, at worst he's a broken 'hero' who can't save anyone.

    The problem is that DC refuses to admit that Batman is an anti hero because that would involve taking responsibility for all the sketchy decisions they've made regarding his character and reconsider the possibility that making him the center of their universe( Doomsday Clock would have readers believe it's Superman, but readers know otherwise) was a terrible idea.
    See I know that and I've always known that but for whatever reason I always saw this arc leading to Damian sees/is made to see that he's going about this the wrong way, learn his lesson and grow from this. Perhaps he opens up some more sharing the emotions and feelings that we haven't really seen him express through out this run.

    That's how I saw it and suddenly I'm reminded that that's not how it usually goes.
    I was looking forward to this but now I'm just annoyed at the very likely outcome that this is going to be one sided and key factors ignored.

  11. #461
    Extraordinary Member dietrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shadow6743 View Post
    I know some people thing Djinn's going to die but I actually think it's going to be Roundhouse. It makes more sense from a story perspective so he can finally fully redeem himself and Djinn's character is still needed for the romantic subplot. Also, Djinn's story is about finding out who she is as a person and getting her own identity. I highly doubt Glass would kill her off before allowing the character to have that growth. But death allows Roundhouse to have some sort of redemption and die a hero. If you think about it his death was foreshadowed in the earliest issues of this run. I am not worried about Djinn I think from a plot standpoint it's clear Roundhouse is going to die. Also Glass seems to be taking inspiration from older Teen Titans runs and Terra the first Judas in Teen Titans history doesn't make it out alive.
    Isn't Glass leaving? I hope Djinn doesn't die as well

  12. #462
    Astonishing Member Restingvoice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    Which is another failure on Bruce's part. Damian is Bruce;s responsibility not Dick's.

    The thing is that it's down to the writer of TT for deciding to go in this direction. They could have written Damian's crisis and Bruce's character better but they went in this direction on purpose. They wanted to write this story.

    The involvement of other writers e.g Priest and Tomasi lead me to believe that editorial approved it.

    It makes it hard to 100% feel pissed at Bruce since we have so many versions which contradict each other.

    After Metal and all the emphasis it placed on how much his kids mean to Bruce. So much that he's love, loss and regret at loving them so much resulted in 3 evil Batmen. Was the reason why the BatGod could trap him for so long and was the key to old Bruce who had given up finding the strength to break out of the Lotus machine thingy.

    I'm honestly struggling to fully view Bruce as harshly as I should just based on TT.


    unpopular opinion I can see where those who blame the family for Batman being written as unlikable get that idea but it's on the creatives and those in charge. I'm more pissed at them.
    How many Good Bruce issues are there compared to Bad Bruce?
    Give extra points for the one with higher sales because they're the one that gets more exposure
    That's how I decide it.

  13. #463
    Extraordinary Member dietrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Restingvoice View Post
    How many Good Bruce issues are there compared to Bad Bruce?
    Give extra points for the one with higher sales because they're the one that gets more exposure
    That's how I decide it.
    Good Bruce

    Metal
    Dceased
    Green Arrow
    Taylor's Tec
    Superman
    Supersons
    Shadow/Batman
    Batman/TMNT


    Bad Bruce
    Rebirth Tec
    Nightwing
    King's Batman
    Titans
    RHATO
    TT
    HIC

    That's all I can think of. might be missing some. The rest are neutral or too subjective though I thought BB, Deathstroke and Outsiders are fine. [went for whole runs rather than issues]

    As I said I'm trying to look at thing's objectively to ease my annoyance. I'm not really expecting to change anyone's mind
    Last edited by dietrich; 01-17-2020 at 07:13 PM.

  14. #464
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    Yeah Glass is leaving but he created Roundhouse as this traitor character and I can't see anything else set up for him other than trying to give the character redemption for what he did to team through his death. I mean that makes sense to me especially since he is the reason Djinn is in this situation in the first place. Glass has set up things for Djinn that can go beyond Djinn War but Roundhouse not so much. Djinn war is his last arc from what I heard so I think he is going to kill Roundhouse at end of that arc.

  15. #465
    Astonishing Member Restingvoice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    Good Bruce

    Metal
    Dceased
    Green Arrow
    Taylor's Tec
    Superman
    Supersons
    Shadow/Batman
    Batman/TMNT


    Bad Bruce
    Rebirth Tec
    Nightwing
    King's Batman
    Titans
    RHATO
    TT
    HIC

    That's all I can think of. might be missing some. The rest are neutral or too subjective though I thought BB, Deathstroke and Outsiders are fine. [went for whole runs rather than issues]

    As I said I'm trying to look at thing's objectively to ease my annoyance. I'm not really expecting to change anyone's mind
    Remind me why Bruce is bad in HiC?

    Metal, King's Batman, HiC and JL are the biggest ones. How's the one in JL? Including No Justice, because while Metal is big, it's a limited series. King's Batman is both big and long.

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