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  1. #406
    Astonishing Member Raye's Avatar
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    Thor was pretty good. I can't say I was super stoked with how it ended in regards to Galactus and the Black Winter, mainly because I find 'MOAR POWER!!!' resolutions to be kinda boring, (I prefer characters be creative with their abilities, rather than just throw a bunch of raw power at a problem) BUT I can see how going that route can play into the themes going on, and I think i can see why it was done that way. Especially if my other speculation about Thor needing a successor that better embodies modern ideals is true. First they need to show Thor's current go-to methods for a contrast, and maybe have those methods bite him in the ass later. It may be that, in hindsight, it will become apparent that his highly aggressive and violent methods caused more problems than would have been caused by a more.... diplomatic or creative resolution. (tho, I can't say what he did at the end was not creative at all, I didn't see what he did to Galactus coming. But it was very, very violent, and all about displays of power and dominance.) The stuff about the speculation above in the spoiler tags did happen, and though a shocking scene, what I said above about it does hold true, still.

    spoilers:
    but one thing the spoiler from before left out, and the part i find the most interesting about the whole issue, is the final page, where we see that Thor saw this, went home and put up Galactus' head as a trophy and all that, (which might have been a potentially disturbing callback to Cates' Thanos run) but kept what he saw a secret. Even when asked directly about it, he lied and said he saw nothing but blackness. Also, Surfer came to him, showing real concern not just about what transpired and the fate of the galaxy, but for Thor as a person, on an emotional level. He was very clearly trying to get Thor to open up, not just about events, but how he felt about them, And Thor just... would not share that part. He had gone through a huge ordeal, and was clearly traumatized by the things he had experienced and seen, but would not talk about it. But unlike with Loki, he had no excuse to attack Surfer because he got a bit too close to his sad feelings. That he outright lied about what he saw is... troubling. I'm someone who also struggles with that, with not wanting to share anything emotional, and even I can see that what happened there was hugely unhealthy. And this bottling of emotions, his refusal to openly display any emotion other than anger, (even though he does clearly feel sad, and overwhelmed, and he's clearly been traumatized by his experience with Galactus and the Black Winter, he's trying to hide that from others) this façade of stoicism, strength, and dominance that he's trying to project, trying to solve everything with violence, and the need to be the baddest ass in the room... above, i kind of danced around saying it outright, even though i did have it in my mind, I know putting this label on it will be controversial with some people, but this issue cemented in my mind that it is trying to deliberately address the fact that Thor is very much embodying certain aspects of toxic masculinity. He does have concern for others, as evidenced by him evacuating the planets (except the last one) and all, and I know he means well, so i am not saying he is a bad person, but the way he's handling these situations is... probably going to cause problems both for himself and others due to his desire to appear strong and dominant in a very stereotypically masculine way.
    end of spoilers

    Anyway, Loki wasn't in it, unfortunately, so we have to hope what Cates said about the timeline holds true and he is in in the next few issues, i guess.

    I saw a solicit for issue 9 of Thor: https://www.cbr.com/thor-9-reintrodu...ampaign=CBR-TW sadly, no mention of Loki yet again, which is frustrating. But it seems to be bringing back back Donald Blake, despite the fact that last we saw him, he was a decapitated head locked in a dream state, so it may be more of a flashback or something. And... dawned on me. Though Thor didn't exactly choose it, this was Odin's doing, it is still a pretty major difference between Thor and Loki, that Thor had this alternate identity. Though Loki has used illusions and whatnot to blend in in the past for one purpose or another, one thing he has never done is maintain a permanent secret identity. I wonder if this is yet another difference between them that might be played up, another way to illustrate how they approach the world differently.

    Also, I made a couple Loki desktop wallpapers the other day, just cus, and you can download them here, if you like:

    https://imgur.com/a/pjFtmKQ

    I used the Olivier Coipel variant cover for Agent of Asgard, and Del Mundo's cover for Dr Strange #381

  2. #407
    Spectacular Member Fanto.mx's Avatar
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    So I read over Thor #1-5, and here are some thoughts, with the "roles" idea in mind throughout, since I really do think that it underpins this whole story:

    First, though Thor and Loki find themselves in similar situations, Loki's kingdom also was basically wiped of the old guard. Thor's is basically still The Establishment -- but comes with expectations. Pretty important undercurrent of the concept of change throughout this. And of course, we have this caption comparing the two and explicitly telling us that Thor is being self-destructive:

    2020-08-19.jpg

    Definite symbolism to how Thor immediately sheds his Odin-Crown when he has the opportunity to smash someone with a hammer. (But a tiny bit of sense in listening to Galactus when he asks him to stop.)

    We still don't know who's narrating, but it's not Thor, and it's not Loki, and the color and font indicate that it's not Surfer, either, though he might make sense. It matches the Black Winter in color, but not font, and it does refer to the Winter in the third person. I'm guessing this will be important. The narration is VERY particularly done.

    Thor never put back on the Odin hat. He put back on his own, which then disappeared when he got heraldified.

    The Black Winter takes the form of your true death. The DC heroes see Darkseid. Galactus sees Heraldified Thor -- Thor sees himself when the Black Winter is around, but the vision it gives him doesn't include a second Thor. I think this is important. Yes, he sees Thanos with an Infinity-glam Mjolnir, Knull's gauntlet, and an army of his zombified friends, but the underlying theme in all 5 issues so far is that Thor's problem is Thor.

    There's a pretty clear Neverending Story thing going on with Yggdrasil withering as Thor is shirking his role as king. Literally his throne withers in his absence.

    I think it's really clearly purposeful that Thor off "saving" other peoples and neglecting his own is represented by his own world dying in his absence. And, of course, he's failing doubly. Both at being Hero Thor and King Thor. He's a King and a God...but not a GodKing. His success in this story is due to him being a god, even a god among gods -- but comes because he refuses to be king, basically, even as he abuses the power that comes with it.

    It's probably important to note that Odin came around to Bill and made him Stormbreaker because of Bill's own merits...and Thor turns on him and destroys Stormbreaker because he questions Thor's decisions.

    The third panel here is basically Thor's whole sense of self / his whole thesis right now:

    2020-08-19 (1).jpg

    He react pretty much that same way to Loki, to Bill, to Sif, to Volstagg, to Galactus, and to the Black Winter. Just unthinking defiance. Thor is either completely convinced that he's right or, more likely IMO, he's waaaaay overcompensating for his doubts regarding his choices. Since the future the Winter shows him is most likely due to his own choices (everything in this book has been so far) this is probably a very big problem.

    And then, of course, he keeps it entirely to himself, bottles it all up, and refuses even a shred of spreading the burden by lying to Surfer. And I don't think for a second that it's an accident that currently, due to Silver Surfer: Black, Surfer is essentially the god or herald of empathy right now. He is the pre-eminent empathetic being in the entire Marvel Universe, and Thor refuses his help and lies.

    And HOLY CRAP is it twisted to integrate Galactus's helmet into the throne. It's a hideous, unavoidable war trophy, that he plundered, hauled, and placed there despite having seen the vision that is seemingly troubling him. He is, as he says here...

    2020-08-19 (3).jpg

    ...NOT afraid of the end. His squalid attitude that we see in that closing is not because of trauma or that he's scared of what he saw. It's that he's scared of himself and what he might do to guide the universe down this path. Even if he wasn't overcompensating for doubt before, now he's absolutely frozen by it.

  3. #408
    Astonishing Member Raye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fanto.mx View Post
    So I read over Thor #1-5, and here are some thoughts, with the "roles" idea in mind throughout, since I really do think that it underpins this whole story:

    First, though Thor and Loki find themselves in similar situations, Loki's kingdom also was basically wiped of the old guard. Thor's is basically still The Establishment -- but comes with expectations. Pretty important undercurrent of the concept of change throughout this. And of course, we have this caption comparing the two and explicitly telling us that Thor is being self-destructive:

    2020-08-19.jpg
    Yeah, Thor does seem to be settling into the 'establishment' role, and i don't think he likes that, in a way, but also doesn't seem to be doing much to change that. Problem is, he seems to think the role means he has to act a certain way, and the only way he can be himself is in his old role. Loki, on the other hand seems to have made real changes in Jotunheim, and does not seem to be doing things the way Laufey did them, even if he is still living in the same castle. But though we haven't seen a ton, it has been mentioned that he's doing things differently, and like, he put his foot down when it came to Drrf, when Laufey would have been completely cool with the lil dude getting killed because he was weak. He's sent Gus to Strange Academy, even accompanying him on his first day of school (granted, that was also probably motivated by Zelma being there, but still) which besides encouraging magic among the giants is also a sort of diplomatic move with Earth, showing they can have a relationship that isn't just giants attacking Midgard, planting some seeds of future friendlier relations. so... I dunno, it just shows signs that things are different. I mean does it really seem like Loki is anything like Laufey? no.

    Thor on the other hand is acting a lot like Odin, as Sif even pointed out. At the end of Aaron's run, Thor talked about making changes in Asgard, but Cates dialed that back like, a lot. There have been some changes in Asgard, to be fair, but they're either kinda superficial, like redecorating, new throne etc. or stuff beyond his control, like various people like Sif, Loki, and Balder taking over roles once held by someone else. In general Thor seems torn between wanting to return to his old life, and becoming Odin 2.0 despite claiming he doesn't want to be like his father. He dealt with the other realms with another display of dominance, which depending on past experiences with Asgard instilled either hope or fear, but nothing substantial about those relationships seemed to change from his end. Even with Jotunheim, now ruled by his own brother, he does not seem to be taking the opportunity to forge a new, better relationship there, where Jotunheim is less likely to attack Asgard, maybe even coming to some mutually beneficial arrangement, instead treating Loki like some visiting ruler and making him bow before threatening him. I know Loki's not exactly been a great brother, but...

    And Loki is being self destructive too, to be fair. But Loki and Thor are being self destructive in different ways. What's a bit unusual is that, unlike in the past, Loki's self destructive tendencies don't involve hurting anyone except himself, not in a targeted way, anyway. He hasn't pinned blame for his woes on anyone, as he's frequently done in the past. His whole thing for years was assigning blame for things that go wrong for him, to Thor or someone else, and then taking it out on them, even if that person wasn't actually to blame. This time, he's moping and bored, doesn't really like being king of Jotunheim and would probably like to be free of that responsibility if he could, but he's not actually taking that out on anyone, like he did i the past. He's just... either drinking, or running off to Midgard for adventures, trying to join the Avengers and stuff. (ok, and ONE questionable deal with a cosmic entity which may have broken fate.... ) So far, it's pretty harmless, except maybe for himself (well, and Nightmare, but he had it coming). Thor tho.... billions died, entire worlds were literally wiped from existence, and Asgard suffered from his neglect. Sure, he was thinking all this would save the universe, but... I mean i guess Jotunheim has also suffered some neglect, due to Loki's boredom and running off to Midgard for some fun, but not like Asgard did. To be fair, that likely would have gotten worse if his solo had continued. But it didn't, so.... Also Thor's being a huge hypocrite, since he scolded Loki for not taking his duties seriously, and now, you know, this.

    We still don't know who's narrating, but it's not Thor, and it's not Loki, and the color and font indicate that it's not Surfer, either, though he might make sense. It matches the Black Winter in color, but not font, and it does refer to the Winter in the third person. I'm guessing this will be important. The narration is VERY particularly done.
    I know i have been finding it strange that the captions are white on black, when for a long time now the Thor books have used parchment style narration captions, when they are not the thoughts of a particular character. But yeah, not sure who it could be. The Black Winter has white on black word balloons, but with a different font, but that doesn't seem to fit. Knull and the symbiotes have white on black captions, but again, doesn't seem to fit. Hela sometimes has white on black word balloons, but other times they are just plain old black on white with the usual Asgardian font, and her captions are usually some form of green and black. So I dunno.

    The Black Winter takes the form of your true death. The DC heroes see Darkseid. Galactus sees Heraldified Thor -- Thor sees himself when the Black Winter is around, but the vision it gives him doesn't include a second Thor. I think this is important. Yes, he sees Thanos with an Infinity-glam Mjolnir, Knull's gauntlet, and an army of his zombified friends, but the underlying theme in all 5 issues so far is that Thor's problem is Thor.

    There's a pretty clear Neverending Story thing going on with Yggdrasil withering as Thor is shirking his role as king. Literally his throne withers in his absence.

    I think it's really clearly purposeful that Thor off "saving" other peoples and neglecting his own is represented by his own world dying in his absence. And, of course, he's failing doubly. Both at being Hero Thor and King Thor. He's a King and a God...but not a GodKing. His success in this story is due to him being a god, even a god among gods -- but comes because he refuses to be king, basically, even as he abuses the power that comes with it.
    Yeah, that's a good point. As the issues were coming out, it was easy to assume that it was the Black Winter causing the problems with Yggdrasil, it was the death of the universe as far as we knew, after all. But now we know it wasn't actually here to destroy the universe, so that means the problems with the tree were caused by Thor. Now that Thor is king, Asgard needs to be his first responsibility, and while running off to save the universe in effect does protect Asgard, in that it will mean it will still be around later, he's not dealing with the problem the way a king should, by delegating.

    He react pretty much that same way to Loki, to Bill, to Sif, to Volstagg, to Galactus, and to the Black Winter. Just unthinking defiance. Thor is either completely convinced that he's right or, more likely IMO, he's waaaaay overcompensating for his doubts regarding his choices. Since the future the Winter shows him is most likely due to his own choices (everything in this book has been so far) this is probably a very big problem.

    And then, of course, he keeps it entirely to himself, bottles it all up, and refuses even a shred of spreading the burden by lying to Surfer. And I don't think for a second that it's an accident that currently, due to Silver Surfer: Black, Surfer is essentially the god or herald of empathy right now. He is the pre-eminent empathetic being in the entire Marvel Universe, and Thor refuses his help and lies.
    I'm not really sure you could call it 'defiance' if he's the one with all the power in the confrontations wit Loki, Sif, and Bill, technically they are the ones defying him. And he doesn't like it, he expects compliance, and they are not giving it. But I get what you're saying. I also think he's over compensating for his doubts by doing what Odin would do, or expect of him, rather than what he would do. And he's bottling because he doesn't want anyone to know that he feels doesn't know what he's doing. He's got a case of impostor syndrome.

    And HOLY CRAP is it twisted to integrate Galactus's helmet into the throne. It's a hideous, unavoidable war trophy, that he plundered, hauled, and placed there despite having seen the vision that is seemingly troubling him. He is, as he says here...

    2020-08-19 (3).jpg

    ...NOT afraid of the end. His squalid attitude that we see in that closing is not because of trauma or that he's scared of what he saw. It's that he's scared of himself and what he might do to guide the universe down this path. Even if he wasn't overcompensating for doubt before, now he's absolutely frozen by it.
    I found the Galactus helmet used as decoration to be troubling. It's an implicit threat to anyone entering Asgard. and yeah, I think he realizes that bad future is probably his fault somehow, the fact that Thanos has Mjolnir is a major clue to that, it's a direct sign that he failed somehow by losing it to Thanos of all people. I think the fix is likely simple enough. Do his damn job, and pass the torch of his old role. But it's one of those easier said than done things, since he clearly does not want to pass his old role on.

  4. #409
    Astonishing Member Raye's Avatar
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    I sadly missed this in time to participate, otherwise I think i might have, but still fun to see the results:

    https://www.marvel.com/articles/cult...loki-headpiece

    though I find it kinda amusing but also a little disappointing that the challenge showed two pictures of his comics headpiece, (one with the V symbol on the front, the other with the Jotunheim symbol) and most people still went ahead and made the one he wore in Thor Ragnarok I mean that one was obviously inspired by the comics version but still.
    Last edited by Raye; 08-28-2020 at 09:14 AM.

  5. #410
    Spectacular Member Fanto.mx's Avatar
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    Comixology has a Loki sale going on: https://www.comixology.com/comics-sa...d=35246&lang=1

  6. #411
    Astonishing Member Raye's Avatar
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    I already have a lot of those but still, nice! Even included those Spider-Man issues, but thankfully not the disappointing followup. I notice that all the pre-Thor Donny Cates stuff is included, even Damnation which was not technically Loki, just a demon posing as him. Very odd that the recent solo is not included, though. Tho the Infinity stuff is also not there, nor is Cates' Thor, even tho issue 1 is on sale for the Fortnite sale anyway. So maybe just a bit too new. Also, weird that vote Loki is missing an issue, (tho the trade is there so why bother with the single issues anyway) and Young Avengers is also only issues 1, 3, and 4, and the first trade, weird. Also curious why that particular arc of Avengers/Defenders were included, Loki has been in plenty of other story arcs. I'm sure, I mean why that and not Siege or something? i'm over thinking things, but whatever, not like anything else is really happening with him right now.


    But Comixology/Marvel often does these sorts of sales for a particular character when something big is coming down the pipe for them, like the other sales Comixology has right now are one for all the characters in the new Fortnite season, and one for Baron Zemo, I presume because he's set to appear in Falcon and Winter Soldier (tho, oddly, no sale for Falcon and Winter soldier themselves but I presume one is coming once an air date is announced, Disney still insists it's coming before the end of the year, but a specific date isn't known) You wouldn't exactly think that by looking at the last couple months of solicits for Loki though, and his Disney+ show isn't until 'spring' 2021.... but we do know from things Cates has said that despite his absence in the solicits, Loki will be participating in the next few months issues at a mimumum, so hopefully this is reflective of something happening in the next couple issues.

  7. #412

  8. #413
    Astonishing Member Raye's Avatar
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    That's a pretty nice logo. I do think the official one looks fine in motion, it's just it doesn't work too well as a static image

    Anyway, Loki is KINDA in the new Avengers game



    ... but you don't actually fight him or even see him except when he's disguised, so.... but it id seem to be a bit of a cliffhanger so he may be back in some DLC.

  9. #414
    Astonishing Member Raye's Avatar
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    *pokes thread* where did everyone go? :-/

    so, sadly it appears the outline pieced together earlier was wrong, Loki was not in this issue. This was the only mention of him:



    Which I did enjoy cus I like the running gag that Thor is a luddite who hates phones and computers, or at least is completely disinterested in them, while Loki loves modern tech, but still. It's probably just that plans shifted a bit and he will just appear a bit later than Cates initially thought, so maybe next issue. Though I realize the in-story reason is that Tony drew on Mjolnir with a sharpie and Thor's getting him back for that, I hope Iron Man is being used here because of all the Avengers minus Thor, he's the one who has the best connection with Loki. It's not much of one, granted, but he was there when Loki asked to join and saw him do his thing vs Nightmare and all, which is more than the others have, so maybe he's taking a part here to kind of be on Loki's side?

    Also Thor asked Bill to be his 'second in command' to kinda step in if he goes off the rails or is otherwise unable to act. But I still hope this thing i said before applies, and the phone thing may be a slight nod towards that:

    Quote Originally Posted by Raye View Post
    Okay taking this out of spoilers cus we have kinda discussed this before. But on the subject of Thor's successor in his old role, I am still hoping for Loki, and I think it would make the most sense from a thematic point. I know Bill is there now, and his hammer is busted, so may seem like an obvious choice because he is lacking a hammer now, and lifted Thor's hammer previously, but I am hoping he is a red herring. Because first of all, as discussed previously, Bill is not really associated with Earth very much, he's more cosmic, so it doesn't make that much sense to make him the hero of Asgard/Earth, even if he was worthy of Thor's hammer before. But kinda more importantly, what does it really say, if Thor has to set new rules for worthiness, but ends up just making them essentially identical to what came before, so that Bill can fill the role? Those worthiness rules were set down a thousand years ago, maybe longer, shouldn't it be that a hero for today would not be defined by ideals set down in the middle ages? shouldn't things actually progress with the times? And I think some aspects of Loki, not the things that made him a villain in the past, but some things he was looked down on in the past because of, like his more fluid sense of gender an sexuality, the fact that he's more about wits than brawn, etc. could be more reflective of what is needed in a hero for today. (provided he remains on his best behaviour and does not fall back into bad old habits) so I am hoping Bill is here to in the end be unworthy of the new rules of worthiness, because he lives by the old ones. He's still a good guy just.... maybe not the kind of hero needed in today's world. Now, Bill may still get Mjolnir to replace Stormbreaker, (I would hope with a copy of the old enchantment to prevent it from falling into the wrong hands) just not the role. As previously noted, the hammer was not associated with the role until Thor, so it stands to reason that the new role holder will have their own distinct weapon just like Thor did, and Sigurd before him etc.
    Cus all that still holds true, while he has some ties to Asgard via his relationship to Thor and formerly Stormbreaker, Bill has no ties to Earth/Midgard, and that is kinda important if he is to take Thor's place. And the phone/ravens thing shows that even with Thor, though he has a connection with Midgard going back centuries, he's not quite in sync with it any more, he lags behind. What I said above, about worthiness rules set down in the middle ages, and in many ways Thor's still a man of those times. But Bill, I mean, he doesn't even have an outdated connection to Earth, aside from having visited it on occasion. So I stand by what I said there about both Bill not having enough connection to Earth, and that the new 'Thor' should better reflect today's world rather than hundreds of years in the past. And I still think Loki could fit that, as said above.

    But I do understand why Bill was Thor's first pick. I just don't think he'd necessarily be Mjolnir's top pick, or the role's. I think Thor has to do something to put new rules for 'worthy' on Mjolnir, or another weapon, and let the rules he put down, as well as just their actions, decide. I don't think this is a case where he can just appoint a successor of his choosing. But I did note that Thor specifically did not say Bill was his replacement, he said he was his 'second in command'. He still wants to be the main guy in his old role AS WELL AS be King of Asgard. I still think the main problem here is that he can't do both, but he is still trying to, even as he's making some steps towards making plans for a successor. If the rules for the gods with fate and roles weren't there, maybe he could, but I think the order of things wants things set up in a fairly specific way, and part of that means one role per god. King or hero/adventurer, not both.

  10. #415
    Spectacular Member Karabaja's Avatar
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    I'm here, just waiting for something to happen with Loki

    It's interesting how Sif casually mentions Loki in an (almost?) positive way, as if talking about a friend. Ugh, I hope we'll get some Loki/Asgardians interaction somewhere along the line.

  11. #416
    Protector of Mortals Prof. Aegis's Avatar
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    I'm disappointed with the lack of Loki lately. Even with Thor here, he gets mentioned once. However, this one mention as you show, Raye, Loki is more in-tune with Midgard and the people than Thor is. Again, to me this shows Loki's humanity and connections to others far more than Thor has, even with him being king and ruler, he is so distant from his people and understanding people in general. It is amazing that Loki is looked down on and Thor praised for who he is, yet Loki is far the better leader and more understanding of people.

    Bill being the second in command could be really good and it will be interesting to see what occurs and how he leads/rules if and when it comes to it.

    So, am I correct, that we will never see Valkyrie #11 with Loki? Since the series was canceled with issue #10. Which is disappointing as well, as I was looking forward to their interaction and the story. Ah well, here's hoping for the next few months of Thor bring some good Loki play.
    The Doors of Wisdom are never shut! - Benjamin Franklin

  12. #417
    Astonishing Member Raye's Avatar
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    I dunno if I would say she was talking like he was a friend, but at the very least it was neutral, tho considering what Loki did to her in JMS' run, that's still big. Though I guess now that she has Heimdall's sight, she can keep an eye on him, so she likely knows if he's up to anything bad, which probably helps

    And yeah, the lack of Loki even in solicits recently is disappointing, even tho pretty sure something is coming for him. I guess we should have had the Valkyrie issues about now, but yeah, haven't seen anything about them being re solicited. When we see the December solicits I well know for sure there, probably, but it does feel like they just axed the previously solicited issues.

    I also was disappointed that Loki was not shown at Wiccan and Hulkling's wedding in Empyre.honestly that was kind of the confirmation for me that Ewing may be actively avoiding the character now, him leaving Valkyrie literally the issue before Loki showed up was a big one but to not even stick Loki in the background in a non speaking cameo at his friend's wedding, after it was revealed Thor brought everyone there by the Bifrost, no less? Which is sad if true. Not sure if it would be because he doesn't like the current direction, (they did walk back his whole turning Loki into sorta-kinda Dr Who thing. Tho I am cool with this, and actually prefer it because I like all of Loki's baggage, I'd imagine it would be disappointing to set up a new status quo and the next guy go 'nah' and walk it back) or just does not even want to know what's happening with him. i have heard some writers do not like seeing what follows their time with a character, no matter if its good or bad, because it will inevitably not be what they would have done, even if it doesn't undo anything. Tho given his use of Dario Agger in Hulk, and him working with Aaron on Valkyrie, I'm betting he at least knows Aaron did kinda undo the God of Stories and the new personality and wiped memories.

    And yes, I mean Thor is a good guy, though events with Galactus were questionable morally, but he's more comfortable with the old ways, and if you look at what is going on in the world right now, I think a lot of people, but younger generations in particular, are pissed off with the old ways, they want change, and Thor kinda represents the establishment. Loki is just as old as Thor, but he has always embodied change, but even more so recently, and he's though he used to view Midgard with disdain, he's jumped into things wholeheartedly ever since JiM, with his use of tech and he consumes current pop culture, and even his sense of style and his sexuality and gender identity is very in line with younger attitudes, despite the fact that he's like a thousand or so years old. It's kinda like he's just been waiting all this time for the world to catch up in a lot of ways.

  13. #418
    Astonishing Member Raye's Avatar
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    just to add to what was said above, solicits are out: https://www.gamesradar.com/marvel-co...solicitations/ and yeah looks like Valkyrie is gone. I do hope the thread with Tyr is picked up again by someone though, because i thought that had potential.

    also, no Loki mentioned yet again. Though the Thor solicit possibly reveals that Donald Blake is the one doing the hunting in 'Prey' and that his time as a decapitated head in a dream world has not been forgotten, and is in fact likely the reason behind his murderous rampage. Judging by the cover, he seems to be specifically targeting Thors (don't kill Throg!) and I mention that here, because... could Nightmare have maybe been involved? I know in story it wasn't Nightmare, it was little dream-creatures, but... still, it's his sphere of influence. If so, that could be another conflict and/or tie with the Loki solo. Could Loki killing Nightmare have maybe led to Blake breaking free? the timing does seem to kinda line up. A bit of a gap, but not a huge one.

    and also a little add on to what I said above, about the world catching up with Loki in some ways... just wanted to add that this is actually for kinda bad reasons, I realized shortly after typing that. Both in the comics and the myths, Loki was, though often not outright queer, he didn't really explicitly come out in the comics until Young Avengers, he was queer coded, but arguably for bad reasons. Those were attributes that were there to be ridiculed, things that made him lesser in many people's eyes, even if some people saw themselves in there. Villains have FREQUENTLY been queer coded over the years, and while in some ways this makes them more interesting characters, and provides some degree of representation when it would have otherwise not been possible, it also has some unfortunate implications, if we come to associate those attributes with villainy. Disney has taken steps to de-gay some of their villains in the live action remakes, (most notably for our purposes here Scar, who, lets face it, is basically Loki in a lion body) presumably because of the unfortunate implications, but it makes the characters kinda.... boring. I think it's kinda cool that with Loki, because of the face turn, they've instead been able to ramp that aspect up, and just re-frame those qualities as good rather than bad.

  14. #419
    Astonishing Member Raye's Avatar
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    well, Loki gets to be kinda on the cover for Thor soon



    4th printing variant cover

    Tho obviously still hoping for something in the primary cover vein soonish, as well as storylines to go with it.

  15. #420
    Protector of Mortals Prof. Aegis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raye View Post
    well, Loki gets to be kinda on the cover for Thor soon



    4th printing variant cover

    Tho obviously still hoping for something in the primary cover vein soonish, as well as storylines to go with it.
    Ooooh I like that cover....even though its a reprint and taking a panel from the issue. Its a good one.

    Yeah, I keep looking for Loki in the new releases and cover appearances, and nothing. But hey, at least he's not being fully ignored. Only took till the 4th printing. Lol
    The Doors of Wisdom are never shut! - Benjamin Franklin

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