Starman/Stargirl Appreciation 2020

[MRP]

Hmm I'm not sure if that's true. 10 years is 10 years.
I GET where you're coming from in theory- but in the actual narrative it just doesn't really work.

I think Pat being in some kind of stasis would have been more inspired. The JSA is something from Courtney's history class, and bam now she's part of it.

It's a mater of perspective. for example,4 years is 4 years, but to a 40 year old, that's only 1/10th of their life. To a 16 years, 4 years is a quarter of their life. It takes on much more significance to ta 16 year old than it does to a 40 year old because it makes up a larger chunk of their life.

I encountered this phenomenon all the time when I taught history at the secondary and university level. Perception of time, in terms of the significance of a chunk of time relative to the length of time one has lived, tends to change the longer we live.

-M

[Flash Gordon]

It's a mater of perspective. for example,4 years is 4 years, but to a 40 year old, that's only 1/10th of their life. To a 16 years, 4 years is a quarter of their life. It takes on much more significance to ta 16 year old than it does to a 40 year old because it makes up a larger chunk of their life.

I encountered this phenomenon all the time when I taught history at the secondary and university level. Perception of time, in terms of the significance of a chunk of time relative to the length of time one has lived, tends to change the longer we live.

-M

That's fine to see it in a meta textual way, but within the actual narrative of the show it's wonky.

[Güicho]

The Stargirl Aftershow podcast confirmed that was Alan Scott at the beginning with the green energy.

We saw Jay's helmet, ....

So they were likely both there.


Well it's just some plot necessary convenience, they need the JSA to be "gone" at this point. There may still be a deus ex reveal where several of them survived in some form (or realm).

.

Not so, he went on to explain that we only see Jay's helmet and that is important that we never see Jay himself , or lightning, etc.

I mean that they were likely both there, before Dugan shows up (not while he was there). They probably vanished "are gone" to fight another day, (yet to be reveled), but didn't die there. (hence my deus ex comment).
Lantern's fire is left behind as evidence.
But Flash's lightning wouldn't linger or still be there.

[Jekyll]

I mean that they were likely both there, before Dugan shows up (not while he was there). They probably vanished "are gone" to fight another day, (yet to be reveled), but didn't die there. (hence my deus ex comment).
Lantern's fire is left behind as evidence.
But Flash's lightning wouldn't linger or still be there.

Ah gotcha!

[Mutant God]

I’m surprised Wildcat died. Pat could have easily put him in the back of the star rocket racer, before heading inside to try and rescue the others.

And doesn't he have like multiple lives?

[John Venus]

And doesn't he have like multiple lives?

That was just meant to explain his longevity. He was never supposed to be anything more than a peak human boxer.

[achilles]

That was just meant to explain his longevity. He was never supposed to be anything more than a peak human boxer.

No, he wasn't. But when that little bit, (nine lives I believe), it also allowed him to simply come back after being killed. So it's a bit more than just to explain his longevity. Still, nothing yet says he stays dead, and if he does, well, it was simply his ninth life.

I'm more concerned with how that silly team could kill Alan Scott and Jay Garrick. Doesn't seem likely. Especially if Dr. Fate was there. But whatever, it isn't about them anyway. Hopefully, one day, Alan Scott will make a live action appearance that doesn't result in him dying or otherwise vanishing within two seconds. And hopefully one day, Power Girl will make an appearance in stuff involving the team she's most famous for.

[bearman]

I did think that Sylvester was a real prick, though.

[mace11]

I'm more concerned with how that silly team could kill Alan Scott and Jay Garrick. Doesn't seem likely. Especially if Dr. Fate was there. But whatever, it isn't about them anyway. Hopefully, one day, Alan Scott will make a live action appearance that doesn't result in him dying or otherwise vanishing within two seconds.

I'm not sure they will be allowed to use Alan Scott. I know he's different, but with a Green Lantern show coming out, they may not want to 'confuse the audience'.

Stargirl Will Involve Green Lantern - and a Different Flash

Stargirl creator Geoff Johns confirmed the presence of two key Justice Society members -- Green Lantern and Flash -- in the series.
With the Justice Society of America confirmed to play a major role in DC Universe's upcoming original series Stargirl, creator Geoff Johns has hinted that the presence of two of the Golden Age team's co-founders will be felt: Alan Scott and Jay Garrick.

The Golden Age Green Lantern and Flash have both been confirmed as part of the original JSA in the series, and while their legacies will loom over the new generation of superheroes, they may play even more prominent roles in the future.

https://www.cbr.com/stargirl-feature...lantern-flash/
https://community.cbr.com/showthread...TV-Show/page10

[Robanker]

I'll be honest, we only confirmed Starman's death. Pat left the scene to save Sylvester, so it's possible a lot of the JSA survived in some fashion. I wouldn't be surprised if Ted shows up and when Pat says he saw him die, Ted replies "I didn't hear the bell, did you?"

That ol' sonuvagun is too stubborn to die so easily. But who knows? It's a different Earth.

[achilles]

Stargirl Will Involve Green Lantern - and a Different Flash

https://www.cbr.com/stargirl-feature...lantern-flash/
https://community.cbr.com/showthread...TV-Show/page10

"Their presence will be felt" sounds an awful lot like they're dead, Jim. Pining for the fjords. Ex-superheroes. But still an inspiration or whatever Could they be back, considering that one vague comment by Johns? Sure, but I wouldn't bet on them remaining. As I understand it, the premise of the show is that Courtney refounds the JSA with a new generation of heroes, (and presumably beats the Injustice Society with the new JSA at some point before heading onto the next arc). She's....a relatively low powered hero. Certainly more powerful than Batman, but very far from the JSA heavyweights. Putting it another way, those characters, (and Dr. Fate, Power Girl, and above all the Spectre for SO many reasons), just won't work in THIS show starring THIS character. They'd take away from Stargirl, both for their power and their experience. This show is about a newbie legacy hero showing other newbie legacy heroes how to do it the JSA way. Hopefully without all that losing and dying stuff. While Jay and Alan can serve as inspiration for the newbies, and maybe, just maybe show up once to give some inspirational words, having them hang around would not be good for Courtney or the show. Well, maybe in the third or fourth season.

PG...would be even worse, because functionally, she WAS Stargirl in context of the JSA long before Stargirl was even created; the big new recruit, outspoken and not respecting authority figures. You really don't want her there, either to take the focus away from Stargirl, or to serve as the shock death. Don't think that will happen, though, she's not Johns' favorite character.

I'm more wondering about the Hawks; I don't recall if they were at the battle or not. I'm guessing I saw some pink flashes, so I'm thinking the Thunderbolt and Johnny were there. And Johnny probably was killed, thus stopping the Thunderbolt. Dr. Fate? He's a big question mark for me, and probably the hardest JSAer to stop, along with Alan, PG, and Jay. Excluding the Spectre of course. Was he at the fight?

[achilles]

I'll be honest, we only confirmed Starman's death. Pat left the scene to save Sylvester, so it's possible a lot of the JSA survived in some fashion. I wouldn't be surprised if Ted shows up and when Pat says he saw him die, Ted replies "I didn't hear the bell, did you?"

That ol' sonuvagun is too stubborn to die so easily. But who knows? It's a different Earth.

I make it as 50/50 as to whether Starman makes a miraculous comeback, at least long enough to resolve Stargirl's daddy issues. I wouldn't look for too many of the OG JSA to have survived; the whole point of that scene was to set up Courtney and Pat as the nucleus of a new JSA, which would seem to include the successors to the originals in the comics. I would point out that those successors didn't mostly last in those comics, so hopefully whatever the comics did wrong with those characters won't be repeated here.

Courtney will turn out to be up for the task when the entire JSA including her father weren't because...she's got that gymnastics thing going, and she's spunky or something.

Anyhow, that's my read. Though I'm probably wrong. Just so long as the rest of the show lives up to the pilot.

[Frontier]

Wildcat was still breathing before Stripesy left, unless those were his last breaths. And, Johns knows his comics, Wildcat has nine lives. I can't help but also think Yolanda died in the comics...

I feel like they could've been more conclusive with those deaths then they were, even if I agree for now the main focus is on the teen new JSA.

[achilles]

Wildcat was still breathing before Stripesy left, unless those were his last breaths. And, Johns knows his comics, Wildcat has nine lives. I can't help but also think Yolanda died in the comics...

I feel like they could've been more conclusive with those deaths then they were, even if I agree for now the main focus is on the teen new JSA.

Also, Dr. Midnite was dragged away...but where? He might have survived that. Hourman...I don't even know what happened to him, though obviously there's going to be a new Hourman. The Hawks? Were they even there, or Dr. Fate? I would say at the very least, they were taken off the table...for now. Whether they might return at some point is open I suppose. But it won't truly be before the baby JSA gets it's licks on the Injustice Society.

[sifighter]

"Their presence will be felt" sounds an awful lot like they're dead, Jim. Pining for the fjords. Ex-superheroes. But still an inspiration or whatever Could they be back, considering that one vague comment by Johns? Sure, but I wouldn't bet on them remaining. As I understand it, the premise of the show is that Courtney refounds the JSA with a new generation of heroes, (and presumably beats the Injustice Society with the new JSA at some point before heading onto the next arc). She's....a relatively low powered hero. Certainly more powerful than Batman, but very far from the JSA heavyweights. Putting it another way, those characters, (and Dr. Fate, Power Girl, and above all the Spectre for SO many reasons), just won't work in THIS show starring THIS character. They'd take away from Stargirl, both for their power and their experience. This show is about a newbie legacy hero showing other newbie legacy heroes how to do it the JSA way. Hopefully without all that losing and dying stuff. While Jay and Alan can serve as inspiration for the newbies, and maybe, just maybe show up once to give some inspirational words, having them hang around would not be good for Courtney or the show. Well, maybe in the third or fourth season.

PG...would be even worse, because functionally, she WAS Stargirl in context of the JSA long before Stargirl was even created; the big new recruit, outspoken and not respecting authority figures. You really don't want her there, either to take the focus away from Stargirl, or to serve as the shock death. Don't think that will happen, though, she's not Johns' favorite character.

I'm more wondering about the Hawks; I don't recall if they were at the battle or not. I'm guessing I saw some pink flashes, so I'm thinking the Thunderbolt and Johnny were there. And Johnny probably was killed, thus stopping the Thunderbolt. Dr. Fate? He's a big question mark for me, and probably the hardest JSAer to stop, along with Alan, PG, and Jay. Excluding the Spectre of course. Was he at the fight?

I’m not even sure Powergirl or Spectre even exist, though Dr. Fate does exist since he was in the photo in episode one. Hawks were in the photo but I don’t remember the battle.

If you were to ask me I probably wouldn’t expect to see Alan or Jay anytime soon, I would expect more characters like Jade, Obsidian, and Jesse Quick/Liberty Belle. I think it’s like Johns said, we will see the impact of the characters but probably not actually seeing them anytime soon. I would also think that we would likely see Jakeem Thunder if Johnny Thunder existed and if there would be a new Dr. Fate I’d argue it would more likely be Khalid and not Kent. I’m not saying they will appear I’m just assuming Geoff Johns would want for the new JSA to have those kind of characters.