Barbara Gordon: Batgirl, Oracle Appreciation 2020

[Artemisfanboy]

Harley Quinn has already filled that role.

Harley Quinn doesn't fill any of Babs old roles in Birds of Prey at all in any form. Unless you mean reasonably well known character with more casual audiences not as familiar with the other members. Which doesn't seem to have worked out given the generally poor reception of the Harley taken over Birds push. Harley taking them over hasn't been beneficial at all.

She is the main character.

Which is kind of the problem. I'd much rather have Birds of Prey focus on Black Canary and Huntress as protagonists(and I'd like Zinda Blake to be brought back.) than be treated as Harley's sidekicks.

[Godlike13]

I don’t know what to tell you guys, Harley Quinn has become the lead of BoP. She also plays important supporting roles in like every event now too. What’s more they even play her as a trauma victim. You can close your eyes and cover your ears to it, but it’s what’s happening non the less.

[AmiMizuno]

Which is dumb. They are doing the same with the comics. It's the same with Batman but we know there are so many other characters they can easily do with but no. Batman Batman. If they fcocus on making a good movie or comic than it wouldn't have to be riding on Batman all the time. They wanted to do Gotham CIty Siren but Margot Robbie was no let's do these characters. No just no.

[Artemisfanboy]

I don’t know what to tell you guys, Harley Quinn has become the lead of BoP. She also plays important supporting roles in like every event now too. What’s more they even play her as a trauma victim. You can close your eyes and cover your ears to it, but it’s what’s happening non the less.

She doesn't have to be the lead of the Birds of Prey and there is no reason for them to continue to push her as one. Harley has plenty of venues which she stars in that work. She doesn't need to own Birds of Prey too. This is regardless how you feel about Babs place with the Birds of Prey, and whether she should be involved in with them as Oracle, Batgirl, both, or not at all.

Can you explain why you think Birds of Prey should be exclusively Harley's from now on, rather Barbara's, as either Oracle or Batgirl, a Black Canary/Huntress team up book, or any other potential options? Why do you think it is good direction? How does it benefit Canary, Huntress, any other potential member, or the team as a whole? Other than you don't want Babs associated with the team for whatever reason? Because that's what I suspect the motivation is. Likewise given the poor reception of the recent Harley taken over Birds, I'm not seeing much of a future for it.

[Godlike13]

It’s not about what I think, and far from what I want, it’s about what’s happening. DC invested millions of dollars into Harley as the face of BoP. I hate it personally, but it is what it is. Oracle was replaced by Harley, and BoP has now become her team in and out of comics. Can’t depend on the idea the BoP is still there for Oracle, as they have already filled that role with BoP and presented it to a far larger audience even. And it’s reception being poor doesn’t bode well for BoPs future in general.

[Frontier]

If DC felt they got mileage out of Harley with the BoP, which at this point I'm not convinced is the case, maybe but I don't see that happening now.

Seems like the forced synergy bug has kind of worn itself out.

She is the main character.

She's the kind of guest star who makes it all about her .

[Tsukiakari1203]

i miss Zinda!

[Artemisfanboy]

It’s not about what I think, and far from what I want, it’s about what’s happening. DC invested millions of dollars into Harley as the face of BoP. I hate it personally, but it is what it is. Oracle was replaced by Harley, and BoP has now become her team in and out of comics. Can’t depend on the idea the BoP is still there for Oracle, as they have already filled that role with BoP and presented it to a far larger audience even. And it’s reception being poor doesn’t bode well for BoPs future in general.

It may be what happened, past tense, but it hasn't worked. The money they invested did not pay out like they expected it to. There is no reason for it to be Harley's team going forward, especially when she hasn't even been well integrated as a member. They can easily drop her from the team or reduce her presence while having Barbara take back leadership, in either of her identities. There wasn't a large profitable audience reception to the movie either, so why continue synergy with a failed product? Why not try something different? You're assuming that the only options are Harley's Birds of Prey, or no Birds of Prey at all. It doesn't have to be that way.

I still don't see how anybody can say Harley fills Oracle's role in any meaning. Harley and Oracle and the ways they functioned with the team are night and day.

[Godlike13]

The poor reception isn’t going to fall on Harley but the BoP brand in general. We already saw it when their first reaction to the movies performance was to rename the movie. While it might not have to be this way, it’s likely that they give up on BoP as a product in general, and at the very least shelve it for a time, rather then simply just give up on continuing synergy. Generally if something doesn’t work they are not just gonna try again, but with characters they have even less faith in.

Face and leader of BoP, a character overcoming trauma, I hate it but like it or not these are roles they have now filled with Harley.

[Frontier]

The poor reception isn’t going to fall on Harley but the BoP brand in general. We already saw it when their first reaction to the movies performance was to rename the movie. While it might not have to be this way, it’s likely that they give up on BoP as a product in general, and at the very least shelve it for a time, rather then simply just give up on continuing synergy. Generally if something doesn’t work they are not just gonna try again, but with characters they have even less faith in.

Face and leader of BoP, a character overcoming trauma, I hate it but like it or not these are roles they have now filled with Harley.

Even if they bench the property, I think it's more likely Harley moves on to greener pastures then they bring it back and try it together with Harley again.

[Agent Z]

by Alex Garner

[kjn]

Why is this thread becoming the Harley Quinn complaints thread, rather than the Barbara Gordon appreciation thread?

Also, saying that Harley Quinn "replaced" Oracle is nonsensical at best. Oracle was last in the Birds of Prey team in 2011. That's near ten years ago.

[Godlike13]

It hasn't. Were talking about the current state of BoP, which is relevant to Babs, and that the biggest thing that ever happened with BoP just happened with out Oracle. And comics then followed suit. You can try to brush it off as nonsense if you want but that says all there needs to be said. Not only did they fill the role, they repackage the entire team around who they filled the role with.

[Konja7]

Why is this thread becoming the Harley Quinn complaints thread, rather than the Barbara Gordon appreciation thread?

Also, saying that Harley Quinn "replaced" Oracle is nonsensical at best. Oracle was last in the Birds of Prey team in 2011. That's near ten years ago.

Well, the thread is usually the Batgirl complaints thread (I also complain about Batgirl), so they just change that for a while.

The complaints of Harley Quinn in Birds of Prey are still on topic, since Barbara (as Oracle or Batgirl) was pretty related to Birds of Prey in the past until Harley Quinn start to be part of the group.


To be fair, this wasn't Harley Quinn's fault. DC wouldn't use Barbara for a Birds of Prey film, because they want to have the option to introduce her as Batgirl in a Batman related film.

[Rac7d*]

Why is this thread becoming the Harley Quinn complaints thread, rather than the Barbara Gordon appreciation thread?

Also, saying that Harley Quinn "replaced" Oracle is nonsensical at best. Oracle was last in the Birds of Prey team in 2011. That's near ten years ago.

I think you mean 2017 when batgirl and the birds of prey got cancelled