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  1. #121
    ♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦ Godlike13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    What do you think will happen? One of the others takes over the mantle (like when Babs was Oracle)? Babs retires and joins the police (like in Batman Beyond)? The Futures End status quo?
    I could see either of the first 2.
    Last edited by Godlike13; 01-27-2020 at 06:09 PM.

  2. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godlike13 View Post
    A lot of the difficulty people had with anything they did with Babs as Batgirl could often boiled down to not my Batgirl.
    Exactly.

    And here, always.

  3. #123
    I am a diamond, Ms. Pryde millernumber1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Maybe, although with 5G looming it probably won't be going on for much longer anyways.
    I think 5G is much more likely to be like Convergence - a temporary event - than a status quo shift for any serious amount of time (longer than about 2 months). I also think it's super clear that DC is not interested in spending any money marketing or developing any of the Batgirls, but is content with a low-selling status quo of Babs as Batgirl. Which is not what Babs deserves.
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  4. #124
    Astonishing Member kjn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by millernumber1 View Post
    I also think it's super clear that DC is not interested in spending any money marketing or developing any of the Batgirls, but is content with a low-selling status quo of Babs as Batgirl. Which is not what Babs deserves.
    I think that sadly is true for nearly every part of DC (outside Ink and Zoom) for nearly every character but Batman (and Joker).
    «Speaking generally, it is because of the desire of the tragic poets for the marvellous that so varied and inconsistent an account of Medea has been given out» (Diodorus Siculus, The Library of History [4.56.1])

  5. #125
    Astonishing Member kjn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aahz View Post
    Not really Batgirl is (at least ins Babs incarnation) more compatible to Nightwing as to Robin. Started as an adult and operated mostly independently of Batman.
    All analogies break down when you look at them to closely, and I was more concerned about how they moved between narrative roles than how exactly each specific narrative role played out.

    Babs went from an identity that was dependant on another character (as Batgirl) to a fully independent one (as Oracle). That was why making her Batgirl again was a regression. In-story, Batgirl is more independent than Robin, but out-of-story, she is defined by Batman, just as Robin.

    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    If we're talking how her characterization was handled with Burnside, I would agree, but in general I don't think using the -girl moniker has to be a negative.

    Supergirl going by Supergirl didn't infantile her character on her TV show.
    True. But not every characterisation of Babsgirl is infantilised. But the risk is always there, just as it is for Supergirl. I also believe that the risk is more acute for Babsgirl than it is for Supergirl, because DC decided to add in Batwoman, when Babsgirl is by far the more senior character.
    «Speaking generally, it is because of the desire of the tragic poets for the marvellous that so varied and inconsistent an account of Medea has been given out» (Diodorus Siculus, The Library of History [4.56.1])

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by kjn View Post
    I think that sadly is true for nearly every part of DC (outside Ink and Zoom) for nearly every character but Batman (and Joker).
    Well, Cassandra Cain is about to make her big-screen movie debut — ahead of Barbara Gordon, no less.

    It's crazy that the '60s Batgirl is still the definitive live-action version. With how many superhero films there's been, Babs Batgirl should've already had a live-action movie or TV show all of her own. There's been two Harley Quinn films (one of which literally titled after Babs' comic book), and on TV there's Supergirl, Batwoman... at some point it's gotta be Babs turn, right?

    Maybe the film version of Cassandra Cain could crossover and be a supporting character in the eventual Batgirl film.

    I do think it's more fun if Cass and Steph are supporting characters for Barbara, considering how when she was Oracle she was a supporting character in each of their books. It makes it more fun if Batgirl is about teamwork moreso than the "solo vigilante" mindset of Bruce (even though he's never actually been solo etc).

    Batgirl can still be Bat"girl" and a leader, she just needs people to lead. Why not the people who have followed in her footsteps before, characters who are already beloved with a history with the character doing the Bat thing?

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by gregpersons View Post
    Well, Cassandra Cain is about to make her big-screen movie debut — ahead of Barbara Gordon, no less.
    There was Barbara Wilson in "Batman and Robin" and there was also a short lived Birds of Prey Series with her as Oracle. And I read somewhere that she will be in the next season of Titans.

    And the Cassandra Cain in Birds of Prey seems to be Cassandra Cain in name only. I doubt that this incarnation of the characer will become Batgirl.

  8. #128
    Ultimate Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    She won't. It's almost certain that Batgirl will be Babs.

    There was a Birds of Prey TV series with Barbara as Oracle. The actress reprised the role as a voiceover in Crisis on Infinite Earths last month.
    Last edited by Digifiend; Yesterday at 08:04 AM.
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  9. #129
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by millernumber1 View Post
    I think 5G is much more likely to be like Convergence - a temporary event - than a status quo shift for any serious amount of time (longer than about 2 months).
    DC seems to be acting otherwise, though.
    I also think it's super clear that DC is not interested in spending any money marketing or developing any of the Batgirls, but is content with a low-selling status quo of Babs as Batgirl. Which is not what Babs deserves.
    Agreed. Or the property in general.
    Quote Originally Posted by kjn View Post
    True. But not every characterisation of Babsgirl is infantilised. But the risk is always there, just as it is for Supergirl. I also believe that the risk is more acute for Babsgirl than it is for Supergirl, because DC decided to add in Batwoman, when Babsgirl is by far the more senior character.
    True, and I think that should be more the de-facto characterization then not. Even a teen Barbara Gordon Batgirl acts above her age in my opinion.

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