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  1. #496
    Astonishing Member Lucyinthesky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferro View Post
    you should have the source since theres no water mark:

    https://twitter.com/optyck/status/1295477136564850690
    Thank you, I will add the credit now

    and second, it shows how insignificant they are to his life and that it takes an halucination to shove them into this discussion, even if they were related or mutants their relantionship is still only bitterness and abuse
    I like what they could be with the proper character work and this is in character for Magneto, the heart wants what the heart wants and thinking, that kind of bond is hard to erase imo.


    Quote Originally Posted by teapertyofthedead
    I like it, Lucy, it’s a good find! There’s definitely a sense of Max’s grief over missing Wanda and Pietro, and I can easily believe he would try to keep such pain private, even from Charles or Lorna. Some pain hurts too much to speak of. He probably looks at their pictures every now and again, still kept safe in a box he keeps secret.

    Agreed Storm, during the Age of X-man, had to force him to talk about them,he really is no fan of sharing painful memories even if that would actually help him get over them



    Last edited by Lucyinthesky; 08-17-2020 at 07:48 PM.
    "To the X-men then, who donīt die the old fashioned way and no matter how hard we try, none of us die forever" Uncanny X-Men #270, Jean and Ororo

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  2. #497
    Incredible Member teapartyofthedead's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Thank you, I will add the credit now



    I like what they could be with the proper character work and this is in character for Magneto, the heart wants what the heart wants and thinking, that kind of bond is hard to erase imo.





    Agreed Storm, during the Age of X-man, had to force him to talk about them,he really is no fan of sharing painful memories even if that would actually help him get over them

    The lack of coordination and at times outright rivalry between the writers of the Avengers and the X-Men have largely colored how they are depicted as a family, rather than how they might actually behave. Children’s Crusade was the closest to showing the potential in their family interactions, and treating Wanda, Pietro, and Magneto with sympathy and compassion. If Lorna and Luna had been included, and no Doom, it would have been perfect.

    His love for the twins was stronger than Nathan’s illusions. For all his many mistakes, it’s clear he does love them. In an era that treats all these characters with the love and respect they deserve, I think they could begin to heal as a family.
    Last edited by teapartyofthedead; 08-17-2020 at 07:56 PM.

  3. #498
    Astonishing Member Lucyinthesky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by teapartyofthedead View Post
    His love for the twins was stronger than Nathan’s illusions. For all his many mistakes, it’s clear he does love them. In an era that treats all these characters with the love and respect they deserve, I think they could begin to heal as a family.
    Exactly and this wasnt the first time his memory of them broke Nateīs illusions, Ororo used his and her memories to help both of them remember their world, so yes I can definitely see him thinking about them on Krakoa, I would love for all of them to begin to heal and to be treated with respect but that may not be what Hickman has in mind, but who knows he has surprised me before, just not with the X-men, I wish the character work he did for the Fantastic Four and the New Avengers got reflected on his X-men title, I loved to see Magneto happy and relaxed, working with Namor on his solo issue, would not mind to see more of that. But then he goes and makes that story of Wanda briging back the dead on Genosha and fail in a very badly, that will just be painful if they meet this way and Wanda really doesnīt need more of that kind of baggage with the X-men so unless she comes back during Empyre and does something to reverse her spell and bring back completely the ppl in Genosha, I donīt see the story ending very well for her.
    Last edited by Lucyinthesky; 08-17-2020 at 08:10 PM.
    "To the X-men then, who donīt die the old fashioned way and no matter how hard we try, none of us die forever" Uncanny X-Men #270, Jean and Ororo

    Magneto: The master of magnetism Appreciation 2022
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  4. #499

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    As highly as I speak of Secret Wars: House of M for its treatment of Lorna, I do have to say I was disappointed in its depictions of Pietro and at times Magneto. And I wish there was more dynamic with Wanda and the rest of the family than we saw.

    If Marvel could just treat them all well and use all of them, that would be nice. It shouldn't be as hard as it apparently is for Marvel to do.

    Maybe Marvel needs another office entirely that serves as a middle ground place. No putting it into the hands of the Avengers office or the X-office or the cosmic office or wherever. Make it a new office that doesn't have a personal stake in trying to make what they're personally in charge of look better at the expense of the other office. The desire of people in these positions to undermine narrative potential for the sake of self-interest seems to be a regular root problem with this company.

    Anyway, cross-post time.

    Quote Originally Posted by salarta View Post
    I can also be reached on BlueSky and Tumblr. Avatar by kahlart.

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  5. #500
    Incredible Member teapartyofthedead's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by salarta View Post
    As highly as I speak of Secret Wars: House of M for its treatment of Lorna, I do have to say I was disappointed in its depictions of Pietro and at times Magneto. And I wish there was more dynamic with Wanda and the rest of the family than we saw.

    If Marvel could just treat them all well and use all of them, that would be nice. It shouldn't be as hard as it apparently is for Marvel to do.

    Maybe Marvel needs another office entirely that serves as a middle ground place. No putting it into the hands of the Avengers office or the X-office or the cosmic office or wherever. Make it a new office that doesn't have a personal stake in trying to make what they're personally in charge of look better at the expense of the other office. The desire of people in these positions to undermine narrative potential for the sake of self-interest seems to be a regular root problem with this company.

    Anyway, cross-post time.
    Uncanny Avengers is proof alone of how a book that is supposed to be fair to both franchises but under the complete control of one of them does not turn out well. However, they shouldn’t need to create a separate office to balance out attempts at character favoritism or assassination to further fandom or professional rivalries. The editors should be able to weed that out in the writers and themselves. It is absolutely ridiculous that they should need an oversight office to enforce them all to communicate and cooperate without running roughshod over one or the other franchise. But it’s worth a try, if only because it’s better than continuing this sort of toxic environment. Also, sensitivity readers would do wonders for catching things like not leaning into ableist or misogynistic tropes.

    That art of proud Mama Wanda and her beautiful boys makes my heart sing. Thank you for sharing, Salarta.

  6. #501
    Astonishing Member Lucyinthesky's Avatar
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    Hickman wrote Susan Storm very well with the FF so I donīt think itīs a misogynistic matter, I donīt know what to call it because heīs going out of his way to introduce back in the X-world a character that isnīt even part of the X-men and repeat a story thatīs already been done, he would not have been able to do that without the Avengers office cooperation so thereīs a plan for her I am just not sure If that plan involves ending the HoM storyline, so far everything looks worse than it was.

    Uncanny Avengers was an interesting idea, marvel choosing an X-writer who had a goog run with X-force seemed like a good choice, the problem was that he choosed to use most of the arcs to antagonize the characters and the fans with them, not a good choice if you are telling a story about unity.
    Last edited by Lucyinthesky; 08-17-2020 at 10:07 PM.
    "To the X-men then, who donīt die the old fashioned way and no matter how hard we try, none of us die forever" Uncanny X-Men #270, Jean and Ororo

    Magneto: The master of magnetism Appreciation 2022
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  7. #502

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    Quote Originally Posted by teapartyofthedead View Post
    Uncanny Avengers is proof alone of how a book that is supposed to be fair to both franchises but under the complete control of one of them does not turn out well. However, they shouldn’t need to create a separate office to balance out attempts at character favoritism or assassination to further fandom or professional rivalries. The editors should be able to weed that out in the writers and themselves. It is absolutely ridiculous that they should need an oversight office to enforce them all to communicate and cooperate without running roughshod over one or the other franchise. But it’s worth a try, if only because it’s better than continuing this sort of toxic environment. Also, sensitivity readers would do wonders for catching things like not leaning into ableist or misogynistic tropes.

    That art of proud Mama Wanda and her beautiful boys makes my heart sing. Thank you for sharing, Salarta.
    I agree on basically all of this. It shouldn't require a separate oversight or middle ground office, everyone should be professional enough that it's not needed, but sadly what should be and what is are often very far apart.

    And a definite agree about sensitivity readers. One case where this would've helped vastly immediately comes to mind, Rosenberg writing Wolfsbane as a trans allegory. I wish I could say the same about Secret Empire but I honestly think they knew the problems with that and went ahead anyway thinking "outrage boosts sales."

    Welcome on the Wanda art.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Hickman wrote Susan Storm very well with the FF so I donīt think itīs a misogynistic matter, I donīt know what to call it because heīs going out of his way to introduce back in the X-world a character that isnīt even part of the X-men and repeat a story thatīs already been done, he would not have been able to do that without the Avengers office cooperation so thereīs a plan for her I am just not sure If that plan involves ending the HoM storyline, so far everything looks worse than it was.

    Uncanny Avengers was an interesting idea, marvel choosing an X-writer who had a goog run with X-force seemed like a good choice, the problem was that he choosed to use most of the arcs to antagonize the characters and the fans with them, not a good choice if you are telling a story about unity.
    I'm not entirely sure that Hickman required cooperation from the Avengers office to use Wanda. Marvel made a huge deal a year ago about how HoX/PoX/DoX was all supposed to be this huge important return for the X-Men franchise, and that kind of talk sometimes comes with an abundance of resources and newfound authority. I can see a scenario where Hickman says "I wanna write Wanda," and either the Avengers office says yes to not rock the boat with the higher-ups, or the Avengers office says no but the higher-ups overrule them.

    Not saying that's what happened. Maybe there's even something out there I don't know of that said it was cooperative with the Avengers book. I'm just saying I could see it work out that way.

    As for Uncanny Avengers, I question how much of that behavior was writer and how much was editorial. Or if it was equal parts. Comments from both basically fed the issue.
    I can also be reached on BlueSky and Tumblr. Avatar by kahlart.

    Ghosts of Genosha minicomic focused on Polaris, written by me and drawn by Fin_NoMore.

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  8. #503

  9. #504
    Astonishing Member Lucyinthesky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by teapartyofthedead View Post
    The lack of coordination and at times outright rivalry between the writers of the Avengers and the X-Men have largely colored how they are depicted as a family, rather than how they might actually behave. Children’s Crusade was the closest to showing the potential in their family interactions, and treating Wanda, Pietro, and Magneto with sympathy and compassion. If Lorna and Luna had been included, and no Doom, it would have been perfect.
    Agreed completely the Avengers and X-men office need less rivalry and more coordination. HoM made a story about the family but it was Chindrenīs Crusade the story that showed itīs potential and it would have been so much better with ALL members of the family.


    Thank you Juan

    Quote Originally Posted by salarta View Post
    I agree on basically all of this. It shouldn't require a separate oversight or middle ground office, everyone should be professional enough that it's not needed, but sadly what should be and what is are often very far apart.

    And a definite agree about sensitivity readers. One case where this would've helped vastly immediately comes to mind, Rosenberg writing Wolfsbane as a trans allegory. I wish I could say the same about Secret Empire but I honestly think they knew the problems with that and went ahead anyway thinking "outrage boosts sales."
    Agreed


    I'm not entirely sure that Hickman required cooperation from the Avengers office to use Wanda. Marvel made a huge deal a year ago about how HoX/PoX/DoX was all supposed to be this huge important return for the X-Men franchise, and that kind of talk sometimes comes with an abundance of resources and newfound authority. I can see a scenario where Hickman says "I wanna write Wanda," and either the Avengers office says yes to not rock the boat with the higher-ups, or the Avengers office says no but the higher-ups overrule them.

    Not saying that's what happened. Maybe there's even something out there I don't know of that said it was cooperative with the Avengers book. I'm just saying I could see it work out that way.

    As for Uncanny Avengers, I question how much of that behavior was writer and how much was editorial. Or if it was equal parts. Comments from both basically fed the issue.

    I could be wrong but from what I have read from Tom Brevoort and Jordan White, when characters from different frachises are going to interact during a crossover, a shared title or an story, thereīs a level of coordination between the offices of each character. Sure right now Hickman has a lot of freedom on the X-office, enough for X-crossovers and arcs for the X-men thatīs why he was given such freedom to change so many things with HoX/Pox, not all X-writers have enjoyed this level of freedom, thatīs correct but this doesnīt mean he has that same level of freedoom on the Avengers, the FF, Spider-man, etc. If he wants to use a character from those other franchises he needs to coordinate with the editors and writers of those offices and Wanda is definitely an Avengers character. At least thatīs how I understand itīs done.
    "To the X-men then, who donīt die the old fashioned way and no matter how hard we try, none of us die forever" Uncanny X-Men #270, Jean and Ororo

    Magneto: The master of magnetism Appreciation 2022
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  10. #505

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    Cross-post

    Quote Originally Posted by salarta View Post
    On the vein of Lorna and Wanda interest, here's a piece by ZoeHackmann, who thinks they're great for an 80s style look.

    I can also be reached on BlueSky and Tumblr. Avatar by kahlart.

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  11. #506
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    lorna and a random meet and greet fan!

  12. #507

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferro View Post
    lorna and a random meet and greet fan!
    Can’t be, Marvel’s decided that absolutely nobody in the entire universe remembers either time she was called and considered the Queen of Mutants, when she was the sovereign princess of Genosha, or when she led Serval’s version of X-Factor and held press conferences for it.
    I can also be reached on BlueSky and Tumblr. Avatar by kahlart.

    Ghosts of Genosha minicomic focused on Polaris, written by me and drawn by Fin_NoMore.

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  13. #508
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    I’m more interested to see if Zaladane returns.

  14. #509
    Astonishing Member DarkMagnus's Avatar
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    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCnOiBTjygY

    Presented by Citizen, A powerful mutant sorceress, Wanda Maximoff has been a master of the mystical arts for both the X-Men and the Avengers. With the help of her chaos magic and new friends, she goes from outcast to Avenger.


    What is Marvel planing?

  15. #510

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    I find it interesting that the actual video doesn't say she's a mutant or mention the X-Men. It's only in the description.

    Another thing I'm curious about, that description implies she's been a member of the X-Men. Has she? I don't know of any cases where she has, and her entry on wikia doesn't say it's one of her affiliations. My assumption is that the description is attempting to say she has a history with the X-Men franchise but didn't word it in a way that's accurate.
    I can also be reached on BlueSky and Tumblr. Avatar by kahlart.

    Ghosts of Genosha minicomic focused on Polaris, written by me and drawn by Fin_NoMore.

    Polaris 50th anniversary minicomic written by me and drawn by Mlad!

    Gallery of Polaris commissions (without NSFW or minicomics)

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