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  1. #841
    Wily Veteran cc008's Avatar
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    I don't believe Soule's run was a gimmick. He introduced quite a few new characters that had nothing to do with the series, including a really awesome new villain. I really don't see many parallels b/w his run and the show at all. If anything, DEFENDERS by Bendis was a gimmick to cash in on the Netflix shows.

  2. #842
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    Quote Originally Posted by cc008 View Post
    I don't believe Soule's run was a gimmick. He introduced quite a few new characters that had nothing to do with the series, including a really awesome new villain. I really don't see many parallels b/w his run and the show at all. If anything, DEFENDERS by Bendis was a gimmick to cash in on the Netflix shows.
    Sorry, when I say gimmick, I particularly mean the first half of his run (which I thought was his weakest), which just felt like it wanted to be dark for no reason other than to line up with the Netflix show. The fact we had gone from a wonderful, happier ending of Matt being in San Francisco, with his identity revealed and in a relationship with Kirsten, to Soule's run of 6 months later, he's put his identity back in the closet, him and Kirsten are broken up, and he isn't friends with Foggy anymore. It just felt cheap to me personally.

  3. #843
    Extraordinary Member Raffi Ol D'Arcy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hcmarvel View Post
    I may have missed a thread or chain of discussion on this topic in this thread but what do people think of Zdarsky making Daredevil "guilty" of killing the guy at the beginning of the run? Did you buy the slight retcon that all the street heroes have done it before? Do you think this fact, and the mother absolving Matt of the guilt, is enough for the readers to forgive him?

    Who has Matt killed before? He has tried, technically, with Bullyeye a few times. And there was that woman he kicked out a window but she became Typhoid Mary right? Is that still canon?


    Anyway, where do people stand on this plot point of Chip's run?
    I think it's an interesting and controversial issue that I believe has been rarely covered in depth much elsewhere. I noticed that "slight" retcon, subtly snuck in and I think it is a good thing talking about it. I believe the readers in general do forgive him. It was all about Matt realising where he was and above all putting his "arrogance" in check.

    Matt has killed before:
    Bullseye in Shadowland, although he wasn't in his right mind;
    Larks, Kingpin's assassin and Fisk's men in the TMWF mini-series;
    The prostitute in TMWF, but this was retconned as Typhoid Mary (from what I understand, this is still canon);
    Nuke's pilot in Daredevil #232.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack The Tripper View Post
    Personally, I love it. In my opinion it was the only way to keep doing "dark" DD stories. I've always felt that Soule's run was a gimmick to promote the Netflix series after Waid's great and considerably brighter run on the character. Matt accidentally killing a criminal whilst trying to do the right thing is interesting. The fact that Zdarsky has used the aftermath of that action as his focus for his run makes it even more interesting. If he sticks the landing, it'll be a great character piece.

    Overall, I've liked this run so far, mainly for that main focus I've mentioned. I think some of the dialogue has come across as clunky, and I haven't been a massive fan of the Stromwyns as villains so far. But that could change. I'm enjoying the book for what it is, but I don't think it's on the level of Bendis or Waid for me yet.

    Art wise, the constant rotation of artists is a bit aggravating, and I don't know if I think of Checchetto as a DD artist, but it's got some great stuff in there.
    I would also disagree that Soule's run was a gimmick. It's actually one of my favourites and I believe one of the most creative runs. Waid's run was "only" bright due to the art and Matt's "false" happiness (he was trying to cover a lot of hurt and unresolved issues) but the run was as heavy as you get

    I'm also not a big fan of the Stromwyns but we'll see where they go. Checchetto is fantastic but he obviously can't keep up on a regular basis. It kind of reminds me of Ron Garney on Soule's run. He was supposed to be the regular artist (also very good) but there were other fill-in artists.

    Quote Originally Posted by cc008 View Post
    I don't believe Soule's run was a gimmick. He introduced quite a few new characters that had nothing to do with the series, including a really awesome new villain. I really don't see many parallels b/w his run and the show at all. If anything, DEFENDERS by Bendis was a gimmick to cash in on the Netflix shows.
    Absolutely agree. The Defenders was quite enjoyable but was catered towards the Netflix series and Bendis was not great with continuity.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack The Tripper View Post
    Sorry, when I say gimmick, I particularly mean the first half of his run (which I thought was his weakest), which just felt like it wanted to be dark for no reason other than to line up with the Netflix show. The fact we had gone from a wonderful, happier ending of Matt being in San Francisco, with his identity revealed and in a relationship with Kirsten, to Soule's run of 6 months later, he's put his identity back in the closet, him and Kirsten are broken up, and he isn't friends with Foggy anymore. It just felt cheap to me personally.
    I thought his identity being put back in the box was a stroke of genius by Soule. I agree the first few issues were unnecessarily trying to be too dark and slightly dragged on but the payback later was very very good. I wasn't a fan of him breaking up with Kirsten but I'm glad she's back in Zdarsky's run.
    Last edited by Raffi Ol D'Arcy; 10-15-2020 at 02:20 AM.

  4. #844
    Extraordinary Member Raffi Ol D'Arcy's Avatar
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    Daredevil, Elektra and Hercules vs Medusa commission by Frank Brunner:

  5. #845
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raffi Ol D'Arcy View Post
    I think it's an interesting and controversial issue that I believe has been rarely covered in depth much elsewhere. I noticed that "slight" retcon, subtly snuck in and I think it is a good thing talking about it. I believe the readers in general do forgive him. It was all about Matt realising where he was and above all putting his "arrogance" in check.

    Matt has killed before:
    Bullseye in Shadowland, although he wasn't in his right mind;
    Larks, Kingpin's assassin and Fisk's men in the TMWF mini-series;
    The prostitute in TMWF, but this was retconned as Typhoid Mary (from what I understand, this is still canon);
    Nuke's pilot in Daredevil #232.



    I would also disagree that Soule's run was a gimmick. It's actually one of my favourites and I believe one of the most creative runs. Waid's run was "only" bright due to the art and Matt's "false" happiness (he was trying to cover a lot of hurt and unresolved issues) but the run was as heavy as you get

    I'm also not a big fan of the Stromwyns but we'll see where they go. Checchetto is fantastic but he obviously can't keep up on a regular basis. It kind of reminds me of Ron Garney on Soule's run. He was supposed to be the regular artist (also very good) but there were other fill-in artists.



    Absolutely agree. The Defenders was quite enjoyable but was catered towards the Netflix series and Bendis was not great with continuity.



    I thought his identity being put back in the box was a stroke of genius by Soule. I agree the first few issues were unnecessarily trying to be too dark and slightly dragged on but the payback later was very very good. I wasn't a fan of him breaking up with Kirsten but I'm glad she's back in Zdarsky's run.
    When I say bright regarding Waid's run, it's .ore to do with the kind of swashbuckling feel, and definitely the San Fran issues - that run balanced Matt's mental health, his attempt to be better and the darkness of Daredevil in a way that's rarely been done before or since.

    Regarding Soule's run, I don't know of it was an editorial mandate or anything, but I just thought it regressed the character. It just didn't hit points with me! I'm glad other fans enjoyed it though.

  6. #846
    Spectacular Member macjr33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack The Tripper View Post
    Personally, I love it. In my opinion it was the only way to keep doing "dark" DD stories. I've always felt that Soule's run was a gimmick to promote the Netflix series after Waid's great and considerably brighter run on the character. Matt accidentally killing a criminal whilst trying to do the right thing is interesting. The fact that Zdarsky has used the aftermath of that action as his focus for his run makes it even more interesting. If he sticks the landing, it'll be a great character piece.

    Overall, I've liked this run so far, mainly for that main focus I've mentioned. I think some of the dialogue has come across as clunky, and I haven't been a massive fan of the Stromwyns as villains so far. But that could change. I'm enjoying the book for what it is, but I don't think it's on the level of Bendis or Waid for me yet.

    Art wise, the constant rotation of artists is a bit aggravating, and I don't know if I think of Checchetto as a DD artist, but it's got some great stuff in there.
    Overall, I thought Soule's run was solid; however, a step below the likes of Bendis, Brubaker, Waid and Miller. The bar is just set so high when it comes to Daredevil.

    There were many things he did that I liked such as the arc with the Purple Man and his children and Muse was a terrifying new villain. However, I wasn't particularly fond of Blindspot and didn't really like the lack of Foggy in the book. Seemed like a regression following how well Waid represented their friendship. Also, while I appreciate him not killing Kirsten or putting her in a mental institution, I thought her exit was weak as the whole "Matt trying to protect her" thing was already addressed in the Waid run. So overall, it was solid but I don't go back to it the same way I do with the other runs that I mentioned.

    Zdarsky's run so far has been stellar in my opinion, now he still needs to stick the landing; however, if he can, I could certainly see it right up there with the other great Daredevil runs. I wish Checchetto could be on this book full time because, if he was, he would be right there with Maleev and Samnee as the best artists on Daredevil.

    Quote Originally Posted by cc008 View Post
    I don't believe Soule's run was a gimmick. He introduced quite a few new characters that had nothing to do with the series, including a really awesome new villain. I really don't see many parallels b/w his run and the show at all. If anything, DEFENDERS by Bendis was a gimmick to cash in on the Netflix shows.
    I actually liked the Defenders book though I certainly acknowledge that it was done to capitilize on the Netflix series. Marquez's art was so amazing in that book particularly Iron Fist vs. Diamondback and Iron Fist vs. Elektra.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack The Tripper View Post
    When I say bright regarding Waid's run, it's .ore to do with the kind of swashbuckling feel, and definitely the San Fran issues - that run balanced Matt's mental health, his attempt to be better and the darkness of Daredevil in a way that's rarely been done before or since.

    Regarding Soule's run, I don't know of it was an editorial mandate or anything, but I just thought it regressed the character. It just didn't hit points with me! I'm glad other fans enjoyed it though.
    Completely agree on Waid's run! While I can certainly understand some not liking it as much towards the end, overall I thought the run was stellar, very much needed after Shadowland and to your point the way he was able to balance all those themes was fantastic. Plus Matt's interactions with all the different characters was so much fun.
    Last edited by macjr33; 10-15-2020 at 08:42 AM.

  7. #847
    Wily Veteran cc008's Avatar
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    Too many posts to quote and I don't have that kind of energy right now lol..

    I enjoyed Soule's run a lot and like I said above, he gave us a few new cool characters and villains. Blindspot was a fun addition. Made Matt realize he's more of an inspiration to street level heroes than he may think. Because "that's Spider-Man's job," (my quote, not Matt's). Ten Fingers was interesting to me and while the story may not have hit every single note, he was a compelling villain. But Muse was the big one. And I really hope he isn't dead because he could be Daredevil's 'Joker, Riddler, Green Goblin' type foe. Instead of always being up against Fisk and his politicking.

    I was glad we got the DEFENDERS book too, even if it was a cash grab. I was even happy to have Bendis writing it because he is traditionally very solid with Marvel's street heroes. Daredevil in particular. He was just at the point in his career where he didn't really care about any other continuity anymore lol.

  8. #848
    Extraordinary Member Raffi Ol D'Arcy's Avatar
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    The Man Without Fear by Dan Panosian:


  9. #849
    Extraordinary Member Raffi Ol D'Arcy's Avatar
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    Daredevil sample pages by Rafael T. Pimentel:




  10. #850
    Extraordinary Member Raffi Ol D'Arcy's Avatar
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    Daredevil by Shane Clester:


  11. #851
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    Read Daredevil Yellow the other day, thought it was pretty nice.
    As soon as I opened it up I was taken aback by the art style. I'm not really sure why, because I am familiar with Sale's art and I should have expected it. In short, I'm okay with his art, but it's not my preferred for when it comes to DD.
    It was nice to revisit those early adventures of him again as I remembered from way back when reading my Essential DD books.

    All in all, it's a nice read.

  12. #852
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    Started up on Brubaker's run, and just finished #94.

    the feeling I get from seeing other people talk about Daredevil comics is that this run isn't quite as lauded as previous ones, but so far I think the general quality from Bendis to now has been very healthily maintained.

    Brubaker takes the mess Matt is left in and uses it to continue showing how the "hell" of Matt's life is contagious and infects the supporting cast.

    And it's not just the writing. Michael Lark & Stefano Gaudiano do a great job of being consistent with the dirty and rugged vibe that Maleev laid down, and making some of the most "cinematic" art I've ever seen. The art in this book is good, but there are random moments where I'm kinda blown away by how good it looks.

    The issue where the Hand helps Foggy has some pages that made me feel like I was watching film.

    I'm about 1/4 of the way through, it could crash and burn from here on, but I kinda love this run so far.

  13. #853
    Extraordinary Member Raffi Ol D'Arcy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gohei_ View Post
    Read Daredevil Yellow the other day, thought it was pretty nice.
    As soon as I opened it up I was taken aback by the art style. I'm not really sure why, because I am familiar with Sale's art and I should have expected it. In short, I'm okay with his art, but it's not my preferred for when it comes to DD.
    It was nice to revisit those early adventures of him again as I remembered from way back when reading my Essential DD books.

    All in all, it's a nice read.
    Yes, it's just that, a nice read. Out of the four "colours", I think the Hulk Gray is my favourite.

  14. #854
    Spectacular Member macjr33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gohei_ View Post
    Read Daredevil Yellow the other day, thought it was pretty nice.
    As soon as I opened it up I was taken aback by the art style. I'm not really sure why, because I am familiar with Sale's art and I should have expected it. In short, I'm okay with his art, but it's not my preferred for when it comes to DD.
    It was nice to revisit those early adventures of him again as I remembered from way back when reading my Essential DD books.

    All in all, it's a nice read.
    I liked Daredevil: Yellow a lot and much prefer it as a retelling of Matt's origin story compared to MWOF.


    Quote Originally Posted by Crossfist View Post
    Started up on Brubaker's run, and just finished #94.

    the feeling I get from seeing other people talk about Daredevil comics is that this run isn't quite as lauded as previous ones, but so far I think the general quality from Bendis to now has been very healthily maintained.

    Brubaker takes the mess Matt is left in and uses it to continue showing how the "hell" of Matt's life is contagious and infects the supporting cast.

    And it's not just the writing. Michael Lark & Stefano Gaudiano do a great job of being consistent with the dirty and rugged vibe that Maleev laid down, and making some of the most "cinematic" art I've ever seen. The art in this book is good, but there are random moments where I'm kinda blown away by how good it looks.

    The issue where the Hand helps Foggy has some pages that made me feel like I was watching film.

    I'm about 1/4 of the way through, it could crash and burn from here on, but I kinda love this run so far.
    I think Brubaker's run is fantastic and really you can view the entire Bendis/Brubaker run as one long story; however, I do prefer Bendis' run a bit more for reasons I could share after you are done with the Brubaker run as to not spoil anything. Still a fantastic run in its own right that belongs on the same tier as Miller, Bendis and Wade.

  15. #855
    Astonishing Member K7P5V's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raffi Ol D'Arcy View Post
    Yes, it's just that, a nice read.
    In agreement with you about DD: Yellow being a nice read (especially, the artwork ):

    Quote Originally Posted by Raffi Ol D'Arcy View Post
    Out of the four "colours", I think the Hulk Gray is my favourite.
    Probably not a popular choice, but my personal favorite is Captain America: White

    Last edited by K7P5V; 10-19-2020 at 09:32 PM. Reason: Made Adjustments.

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