Matt Murdock: Daredevil Appreciation 2020

[Crossfist]

Yeah I guess the home was already wrecked, but, like, the poor girl was already driven insane lol. I liked the marriage, even knowing it wouldn't last. Milla was still done dirty though. I can't stop thinking about how she almost got a divorce!

[Steel Inquisitor]

Yeah I guess the home was already wrecked, but, like, the poor girl was already driven insane lol. I liked the marriage, even knowing it wouldn't last. Milla was still done dirty though. I can't stop thinking about how she almost got a divorce!

Could be worse, look what happened to Karen and Elektra.

[Raffi Ol D'Arcy]

Could be worse, look what happened to Karen and Elektra.

Let's not forget about the horrible deaths of Heather Glenn and Glorianna O'Breen .

[macjr33]

Finished Brubaker's run.

A while ago I posted here questioning the general consensus of this run. After having read all of it, I think I agree with that consensus.

Ed Brubaker's run on Daredevil is very good, and I loved my time reading. With that said, there are some problems with it that prevent it from standing shoulder to shoulder with the Miller/Bendis stuff, but not by too much.

For me the cracks started to show in the second half, with the start of the Mr. Fear arc. My experience with Daredevil is Frank Miller, and everything from Kevin Smith to Brubaker, and I'm pretty sure Mr. Fear doesn't show up in any of those books. I know he's a long standing Daredevil character, but once Brubaker brings him in it feels like he kinda shows up out of nowhere. He wants to **** Matt over but we're never really shown why or what his relationship is with Matt. He comes off like a lame Scarecrow.

Next is the introduction of The Hood, who also seemingly comes out of nowhere. He has a quick feud with Mr. Fear ans then just... leaves? My understanding is that he was big Avengers villain at the moment, but everything with him here felt very abrupt.

Then there's arc with the Hand and Lady Bullseye. I like this arc just fine because of the consequences Matt suffers, but it suffers from the same problems as the earlier stories. Some pieces are introduced at strange times and with questionable purpose. Master Izo, Lady Bullseye and her conspirator just kinda sloppily come together. I think this is where the run is a bit separated from Miller/Bendis, as those books just felt tighter with the their later plots.

I don't know how I feel about Dakota North. Kinda hate her because of her homewrecking. Milla Donovan deserved better.

Loved everything else. Brubaker has a good voice for all the characters (Foggy especially I think) Lark and Guadino really create a Season 2 to Maleev's season 1.

8/10

Great overview!

I liked Brubaker's run a lot too and I was one of those that do put it a slight notch below Miller, Bendis and Waid. For me the thing about the run was that it was constant miserary for Matt. There is never a moment, if even briefly, where he is happy. Even Miller and Bendis were able to infuse humor and happiness into their runs if only briefly. In Brubaker's run things go from bad to worse to a living Hell leaving Matt in an even worse place then when Brubaker got him.

I agree about the Mr. Fear arc not exactly sticking the landing and that some of the Hand/Lady Bullseye stuff coming out of nowhere though I liked Lady Bullseye as villain.

As for Dakota and the affair, as the reader I don't think we are supposed to like it; however, narratively it makes perfect sense and is consistent with Matt's character. I thought Brubaker did a nice job foreshadowing it and, as I have said before, when Matt is at particular lows in his life he makes bad decisions particularly when it comes to women. I don't put this one entirely on Dakota. In this case, Dakota represented someone that understood him and accepted him while also not afraid to call him out on his crap. As someone who likes Milla as a character, while her ending is certainly tragic relative to some of Matt's other love interests (Karen and Heather specifically) this certainly wasn't the worst fate. The panels in #500 where Matt says goodbye to Milla and says that he is sorry he loved her and sorry that she loved him were truly heartbreaking. To a previous posters point, maybe things would have been better if they had gotten divorced.

So really great run overall and agree that art was good to, though I still prefer Maleev, and the voice that Brubaker brought to many of the characters was awesome.

[macjr33]

Let's not forget about the horrible deaths of Heather Glenn and Glorianna O'Breen .

Thanks for mentioning this! I feel like this gets lost when discussing Daredevil and I have often argued Matt should feel more guilty about Heather than he has shown at times.

[phonogram12]

Great overview!

I liked Brubaker's run a lot too and I was one of those that do put it a slight notch below Miller, Bendis and Waid. For me the thing about the run was that it was constant miserary for Matt. There is never a moment, if even briefly, where he is happy. Even Miller and Bendis were able to infuse humor and happiness into their runs if only briefly. In Brubaker's run things go from bad to worse to a living Hell leaving Matt in an even worse place then when Brubaker got him.

I agree about the Mr. Fear arc not exactly sticking the landing and that some of the Hand/Lady Bullseye stuff coming out of nowhere though I liked Lady Bullseye as villain.

While I felt (for the most part) Matt's life being in a constant state of turmoil creates some of his best stories, the whole Mr. Fear arc just ran far too long, IMHO (and I say this as a HUGE Brubaker fan). While I picked up each and every issue that came out, I kinda lost interest, quite frankly. Everything around that arc, though, was absolute gold, from the prison arc, to his European vacation, to getting Big Ben Donovan cleared of a murder (an arc I just reread last night, btw), to The Hand.

As for Dakota and the affair, as the reader I don't think we are supposed to like it; however, narratively it makes perfect sense and is consistent with Matt's character. I thought Brubaker did a nice job foreshadowing it and, as I have said before, when Matt is at particular lows in his life he makes bad decisions particularly when it comes to women. I don't put this one entirely on Dakota. In this case, Dakota represented someone that understood him and accepted him while also not afraid to call him out on his crap. As someone who likes Milla as a character, while her ending is certainly tragic relative to some of Matt's other love interests (Karen and Heather specifically) this certainly wasn't the worst fate. The panels in #500 where Matt says goodbye to Milla and says that he is sorry he loved her and sorry that she loved him were truly heartbreaking. To a previous posters point, maybe things would have been better if they had gotten divorced.

The thing that was heartbreaking to me about the Matt/Milla/Dakota thing was given another set of circumstances, Dakota would've been absolutely perfect for Matt. She was down-to-earth, capable and could take care of herself, had a sense of humor, and didn't put up with any of his bs. It really sounds like someone Matt really needs in his life because lord knows no one else fits the bill, romantic interest or otherwise. I really with they would've been given a chance to get together, but alas...

[macjr33]

While I felt (for the most part) Matt's life being in a constant state of turmoil creates some of his best stories, the whole Mr. Fear arc just ran far too long, IMHO (and I say this as a HUGE Brubaker fan). While I picked up each and every issue that came out, I kinda lost interest, quite frankly. Everything around that arc, though, was absolute gold, from the prison arc, to his European vacation, to getting Big Ben Donovan cleared of a murder (an arc I just reread last night, btw), to The Hand.

Agree with Matt's life being in a constant turmoil is often the best stories, but it has to pause even for a second. I think Bendis did a better job of this where he had the brief time with Milla where they were happy or even Miller in Born Again with Matt and Karen being happy together at the end. Don't get me wrong though it is a great run!

The thing that was heartbreaking to me about the Matt/Milla/Dakota thing was given another set of circumstances, Dakota would've been absolutely perfect for Matt. She was down-to-earth, capable and could take care of herself, had a sense of humor, and didn't put up with any of his bs. It really sounds like someone Matt really needs in his life because lord knows no one else fits the bill, romantic interest or otherwise. I really with they would've been given a chance to get together, but alas...

I can certainly see that and would agree with it though that I would suggest that Kirsten is very much that as well and I am excited for her to be back in the book!

[Raffi Ol D'Arcy]

DAREDEVIL #25 "Knullified" variant cover by Jerome Opeña:

[Batman Begins 2005]

I'd like some Daredevil storylines/arcs to read please. I've read Daredevil: Born Again, Daredevil: The Man Without Fire, a handful of issues by Mark Waid and a chunk of Chip Zdarsky's current Daredevil run. That's about it. Thanks in advance.

[gohei_]

DAREDEVIL #25 "Knullified" variant cover by Jerome Opeña:

FYI, Knull means f*ck here in Sweden. I'm sure a lot of People here are having a laugh about that.

[Raffi Ol D'Arcy]

FYI, Knull means f*ck here in Sweden. I'm sure a lot of People here are having a laugh about that.

I wonder if Donny Cates snuck that in under Marvel's nose?

[Raffi Ol D'Arcy]

I'd like some Daredevil storylines/arcs to read please. I've read Daredevil: Born Again, Daredevil: The Man Without Fire, a handful of issues by Mark Waid and a chunk of Chip Zdarsky's current Daredevil run. That's about it. Again, storylines and arcs. Thanks in advance.

Ok, well for starters I would read the following:

The first 11 or so issues from 1964;
Miller's original run from #165-191;
Guardian Devil (Vol. 2 #1-8) by Smith & Quesada;
Parts of a Hole (Vol. 2 #9-15) by Mack & Quesada;
All of Bendis' run (Vol. 2 #16-19, 26-50, 56-81);
All of Brubaker's run (Vol. 2 #82-119,500)
Dark Nights #1-3 by Lee Weeks'

Afterwards you could always read other runs by Denny 0'Neill, Ann Nocenti, Mark Waid and Charles Soule.

On the first page of this thread, there's a comprehensive list of Daredevil trades.

[gohei_]

I wonder if Donny Cates snuck that in under Marvel's nose?

Who knows?

I though Dark Knights was 8 issues long, or do you only recommend the first 3?

[Raffi Ol D'Arcy]

Who knows?

I though Dark Knights was 8 issues long, or do you only recommend the first 3?

Yes it was 8 issues long and yes I only recommend the first 3 issues. The first arc by Lee Weeks' is fantastic. The second story by David Lapham is not bad but nothing amazing. The last story by Jimmy Palmiotti is just awful - very very bad.

[Batman Begins 2005]

Ok, well for starters I would read the following:

The first 11 or so issues from 1964;
Miller's original run from #165-191;
Guardian Devil (Vol. 2 #1-8) by Smith & Quesada;
Parts of a Hole (Vol. 2 #9-15) by Mack & Quesada;
All of Bendis' run (Vol. 2 #16-19, 26-50, 56-81);
All of Brubaker's run (Vol. 2 #82-119,500)
Dark Nights #1-3 by Lee Weeks'

Afterwards you could always read other runs by Denny 0'Neill, Ann Nocenti, Mark Waid and Charles Soule.

On the first page of this thread, there's a comprehensive list of Daredevil trades.

Thank you!