Matt Murdock: Daredevil Appreciation 2020

[Vordan]

Finished Guardian Devil. Been sitting on it for a while, chewing it over trying to decide how I feel about it. My gut reaction: I like it. Up until the reveal about Mysterio I was not enjoying it. Murdock was being a huge prick in ways that didn’t feel in character at all for him. About halfway through I kept thinking to myself that this was just a rehash of Born Again except not as good. It even had Bullseye killing one of Matt’s loves! Matt winds up recovering in his mother’s church! Least Foggy got framed this time instead of Matt though. But then came the reveal: that Mysterio was behind it all, trying to put on one last performance before he died at the hands of his “archenemy” whom he had chosen because his real arch was replaced by his clone. I loved that Matt just brutally tore Beck a new one, calling him out for being a second rate hack who just ripped off his betters, specifically acknowledging that yes Matt has been through this plot before and he’s better prepared this time. That twist helped put the plot into perspective and I enjoyed it overall.

But there’s two big caveats: I don’t really like that this is how Karen Page went out. It feels cheap to me, that she died in Beck’s second rate Born Again plot. It’s just an excuse for Matt to feel sad and brood again, but Matt really doesn’t need another dead girlfriend to justify doing that. Plus Bullseye does it so nonchalantly, and Karen beforehand had been awful, dumping Matt at the start and considering turning over a baby to be killed. At least Matt had the mind toxin excuse for thinking about killing the baby, but Karen just felt very unsympathetic to me. I liked her less here then I did in Born Again where she does arguably even worse stuff to Matt. I did like that she gave the money from the insurance policy to Matt and he used it so he and Foggy could build a new firm on the spot where his old apartment was destroyed though. That was a great way of “healing the wound”. But yeah the death didn’t really have a big impact emotionally for me.

Second caveat: The mind toxin felt dumb to me. It was used to make Matt act like such a huge prick, but I don’t really get why? Feel like it would’ve been a more effective story if it had been Matt wrestling with whether he was really defending the AntiChrist, but the toxin just makes him act so deranged that it almost makes you not really feel sympathetic for him, and it’s used as sort of a “get out of jail free card” (although I did like Natasha taking Matt to task for his actions in the end). Matt doesn’t even really do that great a job protecting the kid, he pawns her off on Natasha and then on his mother. He did kinda redeem himself by going after Beck to get her back and I loved the last scene where he’s totally unafraid of Beck pointing a gun because he knows Beck’s a hack who is just going to copy Kraven.

So yeah those are my two big caveats, but overall I liked the story. I wonder if anyone ends up bringing the kid back, it would be neat for Karen to meet her “Guardian Devil”. I hope no one did something dumb like making her evil lol. Next up in Daredevil: Yellow and it looks like Loeb is exploring the fallout of the Matt/Karen relationship which sounds good to me. He did great with Peter/MJ in Spider-Man Blue so I’m hoping he can write a good “epilogue” to the relationship here.

[ZeroBG82]

I don’t really like that this is how Karen Page went out. It feels cheap to me, that she died in Beck’s second rate Born Again plot. It’s just an excuse for Matt to feel sad and brood again, but Matt really doesn’t need another dead girlfriend to justify doing that. Plus Bullseye does it so nonchalantly, and Karen beforehand had been awful, dumping Matt at the start and considering turning over a baby to be killed. At least Matt had the mind toxin excuse for thinking about killing the baby, but Karen just felt very unsympathetic to me. I liked her less here then I did in Born Again where she does arguably even worse stuff to Matt. I did like that she gave the money from the insurance policy to Matt and he used it so he and Foggy could build a new firm on the spot where his old apartment was destroyed though. That was a great way of “healing the wound”. But yeah the death didn’t really have a big impact emotionally for me.

I enjoyed Guardian Devil, on the whole, but I would agree with this. Have you read Bendis' run? I always felt like Karen's death doesn't really feel earned until Bendis gets through with his two cents on the subject. It's still not a great way for Karen to exit, but he gives it an appropriately deeply felt follow through and lasting impact that made it feel less like a stunt and more like the tragedy it's intended to be. And he does so by kind of playing on the very reaction you had here, so that may give it even more oomph if you have yet to experience it.

[Vordan]

I enjoyed Guardian Devil, on the whole, but I would agree with this. Have you read Bendis' run? I always felt like Karen's death doesn't really feel earned until Bendis gets through with his two cents on the subject. It's still not a great way for Karen to exit, but he gives it an appropriately deeply felt follow through and lasting impact that made it feel less like a stunt and more like the tragedy it's intended to be. And he does so by kind of playing on the very reaction you had here, so that may give it even more oomph if you have yet to experience it.

Not yet, I’m going to read it after Daredevil Yellow. Really looking forward to it, and I’m glad to hear Bendis does revisit the death.

[Raffi Ol D'Arcy]

"Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays everyone. Be safe, wear a mask, and try to enjoy yourselves" by Hayden "Den" Becton:

[Raffi Ol D'Arcy]

My first foray into DD comics was the Miller run (except Born Again and MWF), and after that I went back to issue nr 1 and read everything all the way back to Miller again and I personally really enjoyed that era. I believe I can count on one hand the number of issues that I honestly thought were boring or bad.

I just watched an overview of Marvels X, and it seemed to feature DD a bit. Anyone read it? Is it any good?

Good to know you're a true Daredevil fan through thick and thin

I haven't yet read Marvel's X, but I plan on doing do so at some point. Will post my thoughts regarding DD once I do.

[Raffi Ol D'Arcy]

Daredevil by Brianne Andan:

[Raffi Ol D'Arcy]

Daredevil commission by Chris Samnee:

[Raffi Ol D'Arcy]

Daredevil by Vincenzo Riccardi:

[Raffi Ol D'Arcy]

DAREDEVIL #25 2nd Print Frankie's Comics Limited Edition Exclusive Variant by KHOI PHAM

[your_name_here]

I enjoyed Guardian Devil, on the whole, but I would agree with this. Have you read Bendis' run? I always felt like Karen's death doesn't really feel earned until Bendis gets through with his two cents on the subject. It's still not a great way for Karen to exit, but he gives it an appropriately deeply felt follow through and lasting impact that made it feel less like a stunt and more like the tragedy it's intended to be. And he does so by kind of playing on the very reaction you had here, so that may give it even more oomph if you have yet to experience it.

Yeah Bendis really did a good job on Karen’s death. So did Brubaker, if I recall.

I can’t remember the exact issue, but in Bendis’ run where he asks Dr Strange if he can makes things how they used to be is really heartbreaking.

[your_name_here]

DAREDEVIL #25 2nd Print Frankie's Comics Limited Edition Exclusive Variant by KHOI PHAM

I really wish this was Maya Lopez. I don’t mind it being Elektra, but seeing as Maya is deaf - itd be nice to see a very opposite DD

[Mike_Murdock]

Story-wise, Elektra makes for something that fits better. But Maya would be a fun Daredevil legacy character, I agree.

[macjr33]

Finished Guardian Devil. Been sitting on it for a while, chewing it over trying to decide how I feel about it. My gut reaction: I like it. Up until the reveal about Mysterio I was not enjoying it. Murdock was being a huge prick in ways that didn’t feel in character at all for him. About halfway through I kept thinking to myself that this was just a rehash of Born Again except not as good. It even had Bullseye killing one of Matt’s loves! Matt winds up recovering in his mother’s church! Least Foggy got framed this time instead of Matt though. But then came the reveal: that Mysterio was behind it all, trying to put on one last performance before he died at the hands of his “archenemy” whom he had chosen because his real arch was replaced by his clone. I loved that Matt just brutally tore Beck a new one, calling him out for being a second rate hack who just ripped off his betters, specifically acknowledging that yes Matt has been through this plot before and he’s better prepared this time. That twist helped put the plot into perspective and I enjoyed it overall.

But there’s two big caveats: I don’t really like that this is how Karen Page went out. It feels cheap to me, that she died in Beck’s second rate Born Again plot. It’s just an excuse for Matt to feel sad and brood again, but Matt really doesn’t need another dead girlfriend to justify doing that. Plus Bullseye does it so nonchalantly, and Karen beforehand had been awful, dumping Matt at the start and considering turning over a baby to be killed. At least Matt had the mind toxin excuse for thinking about killing the baby, but Karen just felt very unsympathetic to me. I liked her less here then I did in Born Again where she does arguably even worse stuff to Matt. I did like that she gave the money from the insurance policy to Matt and he used it so he and Foggy could build a new firm on the spot where his old apartment was destroyed though. That was a great way of “healing the wound”. But yeah the death didn’t really have a big impact emotionally for me.

Second caveat: The mind toxin felt dumb to me. It was used to make Matt act like such a huge prick, but I don’t really get why? Feel like it would’ve been a more effective story if it had been Matt wrestling with whether he was really defending the AntiChrist, but the toxin just makes him act so deranged that it almost makes you not really feel sympathetic for him, and it’s used as sort of a “get out of jail free card” (although I did like Natasha taking Matt to task for his actions in the end). Matt doesn’t even really do that great a job protecting the kid, he pawns her off on Natasha and then on his mother. He did kinda redeem himself by going after Beck to get her back and I loved the last scene where he’s totally unafraid of Beck pointing a gun because he knows Beck’s a hack who is just going to copy Kraven.

So yeah those are my two big caveats, but overall I liked the story. I wonder if anyone ends up bringing the kid back, it would be neat for Karen to meet her “Guardian Devil”. I hope no one did something dumb like making her evil lol. Next up in Daredevil: Yellow and it looks like Loeb is exploring the fallout of the Matt/Karen relationship which sounds good to me. He did great with Peter/MJ in Spider-Man Blue so I’m hoping he can write a good “epilogue” to the relationship here.

Glad you liked it and I agree with you caveats as well. I actually liked it better when initially read it; however, as I went on and read Mack, Bendis, Brubaker and Waid it definitely pales in comparison those runs/stories. I would also add that things just felt a bit "over-the-top" for me too especially when you start reading the grounded, realistic take by Bendis. For example, the whole AIDS thing with Karen seemed completely unnecessary to me. Also, while I love the Catholic component of Matt's character, I feel like Smith went over the top with that as well in a way we haven't seen before or since. I agree too about how Karen is written in this story doesn't put her in the best of light nor is Matt written that well either. The story seemed like a bit of a mess as it was all over the place and I don't think I like Kevin Smith as a comic writer. The only other story I know of that Smith wrote (other than not finishing the Daredevil: Target story) is a Batman story that, correct me if I am wrong, was never finished and ended on a cliffhanger with the villain in the process of killing the love interest of Batman. So there is a bit of trend there with him.

As other posters have pointed out, while the emotional impact of Karen's death isn't felt that greatly in GD (though the flashback panels where Matt and Karen discuss having a baby and Karen tells Matt to never stop being Daredevil I do love as it is extremely powerful), the silver lining is that other writers (particularly Bendis) do give this the impact it deserves. And really the impact of it is still felt to this day which, even though it wasn't executed in the best way, has been something that has lasting impact which isn't always the case in comics.

Hope you enjoy Daredevil: Yellow, I love this story and actually prefer it as a retelling of Matt's origin compared to the MWOF.

[Raffi Ol D'Arcy]

Charlie Cox as Daredevil by Alex Maleev:

[Raffi Ol D'Arcy]

I got the Daredevil Brubaker & Lark Ultimate Collection vol 1 for Christmas. I'm just a casual Daredevil fan, but I thought this was very good.

Hey Panic. I hope you picked up the next volume. If you enjoyed Brubaker, then I recommend Bendis' run if you haven't already read it and later Waid's and Soule's runs.