Mary Jane Watson-Parker Appreciation 2020

[Prime]

I'm seriously laughing, this is fun, I could do this all night but I don't want everyone to hate Peter and start wondering why we want the marriage back.

Because it also has its great moments. Mary Jane and Peter are so great together man.This is just Peter being an *******.which he was to everyone. Harry, Flash, Felicia, Gwen, ect

[Vortex85]

Because it also has its great moments. Mary Jane and Peter are so great together man.This is just Peter being an *******.which he was to everyone. Harry, Flash, Felicia, Gwen, ect

That's true, for all the horrible moments there are also beautiful happy and fulfilling moments as well. This is why Peter and MJ's marriage means so much to me. It was never boring, it always added a lot of drama and personal stakes that elevated the book! I also have this weird thing how I like how MJ's red hair matches the red on Peter's costume. It's like a sign they should be together to me. LOL

[Prime]

How did MJ usurped Gwen as the love of Peter's life? Besides being an actual character

[PCN24454]

How did MJ usurped Gwen as the love of Peter's life? Besides being an actual character

Readers were tired of blondes, so a red head was nice to see.

[Celgress]

Readers were tired of blondes, so a red head was nice to see.

very nice

Edit - It is easy to win by default when your primary competition is dead, just saying. Sorry MJ fans.

[Vortex85]

Readers were tired of blondes, so a red head was nice to see.

LOL, it's funny because on twitter there was a big outcry among Spider-Man fans recently about a quote from Jon Watts in an interview that said that back in early comics female characters "weren't defined by much more than the color of their hair." A ton of people got offended and started talking about the personalities of the characters and defending Mary Jane in particular because that was the girl he was referring to when talking about Michelle Jones in the new movies. I complete disagree with him on it of course, but it's a funny joke, especially since I stated I like how MJ's hair matches Peter's costume which is admittedly a very superficial observation. Of course it's so much more to it than that... I like how they are opposites in many ways, so the whole opposites attract, but then their history and development as a couple to me was so organic and natural. Then we had just perfect amazing moments between the two which really solidified them as my favorite comic couple.

[Vortex85]

How did MJ usurped Gwen as the love of Peter's life? Besides being an actual character

According to Stan Lee in interviews, he always told the story of how MJ seemed to just have all the personality that made readers love her back on the 60s. His plan was for Peter to be with Gwen so he tried to make Gwen more like MJ eventually with the personality but for some reason MJ just always had more of an appeal. Then Gerry Conway obviously agreed and had them get together in his run after Gwen's death. It could have ended after they broke up and Peter moved on to Black Cat, but in the 80s Roger Stern brought MJ back and Tom Defalco put in all her backstory which added a ton of depth to her and really set her up to be the #1 love interest again. Also, Stan had her and Peter getting married in his newspaper strip so they made that happen in the comics to match.

So clearly the fact they got married was Stan's fault and wish. Can't argue with Spidey's creator!

[Frontier]

That's true, for all the horrible moments there are also beautiful happy and fulfilling moments as well. This is why Peter and MJ's marriage means so much to me. It was never boring, it always added a lot of drama and personal stakes that elevated the book! I also have this weird thing how I like how MJ's red hair matches the red on Peter's costume. It's like a sign they should be together to me. LOL

And it definitely wasn't the kind of relationship where MJ as the "hot supermodel wife" made things easier for Peter whenever he got home, like some of the BND writers were espousing.

[Lukmendes]

1000% agree with you. MJ deserves the wife of the century award regarding her time in her marriage with Peter.

It really gets to me when I see comments on twitter dissing MJ as selfish bitch and stuff based on her portrayal in Spider-Man 3. I’m always like, “read the comics people!” They have no idea how amazing she is in the source material.

Can't blame those people for having such an impression of MJ, specially considering that checking out comics to see the "real" MJ can be such a chore, what if they read **** like her being a bitch in the 90's or Slott's run? That'd certainly not make her look better.

Clone Saga (1990s) Era 616 Peter Parker was atrocious to MJ and other people (to a lesser degree). I vividly recall as a kid hating him which is never good for a franchise when fans start to dislike the hero. I think Marvel Editorial was doing this so they could later say "look the true Spider-Man would NEVER act in such a way" when they revealed Peter was indeed the clone and Ben was the "real one" (apparently the original plan that they wanted to stick with until sales tanked on Ben's solo run as Spidey). So, some good old fashioned character assassination.

It's rather obvious they did this on purpose when Ben bitches at Peter for making a deal with Venom, 'cause Spider-Man would never do something like that, in other words, Ben was the "real" Spider-Man there, yeah...

How did MJ usurped Gwen as the love of Peter's life? Besides being an actual character

To be fair, MJ had as little character as Gwen before Conway came around.

While Gwen was little more than "Generic love interest", MJ was little more than "Airhead party girl", both were rather flat characters, MJ became more popular because she was actually a fun character, while Gwen brought more drama than anything else, and only drama makes the relationship look bad because why should those two be together if they hardly are happy with each other? And that's how MJ won the ridiculous shipping war that was going on at Marvel, her becoming an actual character only happened later because Conway liked the redhead waifu more and then gave her actual depth.

According to Stan Lee in interviews, he always told the story of how MJ seemed to just have all the personality that made readers love her back on the 60s. His plan was for Peter to be with Gwen so he tried to make Gwen more like MJ eventually with the personality but for some reason MJ just always had more of an appeal. Then Gerry Conway obviously agreed and had them get together in his run after Gwen's death. It could have ended after they broke up and Peter moved on to Black Cat, but in the 80s Roger Stern brought MJ back and Tom Defalco put in all her backstory which added a ton of depth to her and really set her up to be the #1 love interest again.

Fun fact: MJ getting that background story rather blatantly not made for Peter and MJ to get together:



(ASM#259)

It was made for them to become better friends, which Peter points out earlier that they really weren't friends before.

Hell, we even have this moment from Spider-Man vs Wolverine:





These moments, alongside the talk about MJ's past from ASM#259, were supposed to show that they're good friends now, that's obviously the intention, but I guess old writers didn't really understand the current youth of the time, and what it actually looks like is that MJ and Peter want each other but are denying it...

MJ has a lot of **** like that, she's a brilliant character by accident, a bunch of happy little accidents made her such a compelling love interest, when that wasn't the intention.

And it definitely wasn't the kind of relationship where MJ as the "hot supermodel wife" made things easier for Peter whenever he got home, like some of the BND writers were espousing.

I mean, she did make things easier for Peter, not "whenever he got home", but her being so supportive could lessen the burden, if he was willing to talk to her, so yeah, she made it easier by being a caring person, not a damn cumdump like it's implied with that "Hot supermodel wife" way they used to describe her.

[Prime]

You are right, she wasn't the compelling character she is right now but she was more fun than Gwen. Even if it was al a facade. Also, those scans you posted...I really don't know what Peter and MJ were during they time. It makes it look like you said, they like each other but deny it. Peter was with Felicia during this time but the way he interacted with MJ makes it look like she was his gf.

[NC_Yankee]

very nice

Edit - It is easy to win by default when your primary competition is dead, just saying. Sorry MJ fans.

That is not true. First off she beats Felicia and Felicia is NOT dead. Second, MJ was designed to be the one ( even going back to Ditko ( although she did not appear until after he left the book)). I said it before and I will say it again she was Aunt Mays choice for Peter not Betty or Gwen ( and prior to MJ no one knew Peter better). The biggest problem Marvel had with MJ and for that matter Peter ( see Clone Saga for Ben and the Gwen clone) is what do we do with them? The biggest thing in MJ’s favor is despite Quesada, Slott and those who tried to write her out of the book , is the readers love her and it is because she is a great character ( I think the best female character in Marvel), NOT because she is a redhead.

[Prime]

According to Stan Lee in interviews, he always told the story of how MJ seemed to just have all the personality that made readers love her back on the 60s. His plan was for Peter to be with Gwen so he tried to make Gwen more like MJ eventually with the personality but for some reason MJ just always had more of an appeal. Then Gerry Conway obviously agreed and had them get together in his run after Gwen's death. It could have ended after they broke up and Peter moved on to Black Cat, but in the 80s Roger Stern brought MJ back and Tom Defalco put in all her backstory which added a ton of depth to her and really set her up to be the #1 love interest again. Also, Stan had her and Peter getting married in his newspaper strip so they made that happen in the comics to match.

So clearly the fact they got married was Stan's fault and wish. Can't argue with Spidey's creator!

What year was this?

[Frontier]

To be fair, MJ had as little character as Gwen before Conway came around.

While Gwen was little more than "Generic love interest", MJ was little more than "Airhead party girl", both were rather flat characters, MJ became more popular because she was actually a fun character, while Gwen brought more drama than anything else, and only drama makes the relationship look bad because why should those two be together if they hardly are happy with each other? And that's how MJ won the ridiculous shipping war that was going on at Marvel, her becoming an actual character only happened later because Conway liked the redhead waifu more and then gave her actual depth.

I think red hair + bombshell body + fun personality helped a lot. These traits are kind of more shallow but it made the contrast to when they started adding more depth and get into MJ's hidden character traits all the more significant. It's part of what makes her a well-rounded character.

These moments, alongside the talk about MJ's past from ASM#259, were supposed to show that they're good friends now, that's obviously the intention, but I guess old writers didn't really understand the current youth of the time, and what it actually looks like is that MJ and Peter want each other but are denying it...

MJ has a lot of **** like that, she's a brilliant character by accident, a bunch of happy little accidents made her such a compelling love interest, when that wasn't the intention.

I feel, taking the out-of-context reasoning behind it, these moments make Peter and MJ look to me like two people who are really close to each other and care about each other immensely but are gun-shy about committing to anything beyond that even when a part of them knows they care about each other beyond just "friends" but just won't admit it for fear of what might happen. So they value and rely on each other's friendship until one of them finally bit the bullet and went for something more again.

I mean, she did make things easier for Peter, not "whenever he got home", but her being so supportive could lessen the burden, if he was willing to talk to her, so yeah, she made it easier by being a caring person, not a damn cumdump like it's implied with that "Hot supermodel wife" way they used to describe her.

I think it's all about the degrees...having a partner and confidante to share the burden with and who can help you lighten up helps a lot, but MJ wasn't some magical fix me up for all of Peter's problems, just like any relationship.

[juan678]

KING IN BLACK: GWENOM VS CARNAGE #2 (OF 3)

SEANAN McGUIRE (W) • FLAVIANO (A) • Cover by KEN LASHLEY
GWEN STACY VS. MARY JANE WATSON!
They’ve been at each other’s throats over the band for years, but not like this. THIS battle of the bands really shreds…

[Vortex85]

What year was this?

1987, same year / time they got married in the comics. Marvel had a public skit before a Mets game of Stan Lee officiating the wedding of Peter and Mary Jane to advertise the event happening in the comics.