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  1. #46
    Extraordinary Member Winterboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Absolutely gorgeous .
    Schmidt really knows how to draw gorgeous ladies.
    "Who wouldn't go out with the Black Widow? I'd strangle a litter of kittens for one dinner with her!"
    Adrian Toomes aka the Vulture


    "Natasha Romanoff, A.K.A. Black Widow - ex-KGB, formerly with S.H.I.E.L.D...Probably the brains of this operation.I have followed her career, and she has been consistently UNDERRATED."

  2. #47
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Winterboy View Post
    Schmidt really knows how to draw gorgeous ladies.
    No argument there .

  3. #48
    Extraordinary Member Winterboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    No argument there .
    Otto says Dinah and Helena.
    I see Bobbi and Jessica.

    ladies.jpg
    "Who wouldn't go out with the Black Widow? I'd strangle a litter of kittens for one dinner with her!"
    Adrian Toomes aka the Vulture


    "Natasha Romanoff, A.K.A. Black Widow - ex-KGB, formerly with S.H.I.E.L.D...Probably the brains of this operation.I have followed her career, and she has been consistently UNDERRATED."

  4. #49
    Astonishing Member Soulsword323's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Winterboy View Post
    Bobbi by Otto Schmidt...

    Attachment 93485
    Nice! Bobbi looks great.

    Quote Originally Posted by Winterboy View Post
    I'm excited. Really looking forward to this one.

  5. #50
    Fantastic Member OOTCS's Avatar
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    Bobbi in EMPYRE: AVENGERS by Jim Zub and Carlos Magno:

    ERjlPOSXYAABNZT.jpg

  6. #51
    Fantastic Member OOTCS's Avatar
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    Don't forget to pick up Force Works 2020 #1 today!

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by OOTCS View Post
    Don't forget to pick up Force Works 2020 #1 today!
    Got it, loved it!

    We get some nice Mockingbird moments here, although of the four lead characters Bobbi may just have the least panel time in this particular issue. That should change going forward though -- this issue was bringing the cast together, and now that they are together the spotlight should spread a bit more evenly I think.

    I enjoyed the Bobbi/USAgent reunion. She is the one member of the group who seems to be able to tolerate him, which I am glad to see. The two of them got along well enough back in the WCA days (at least better than Walker tended to get along with the rest of the team), so I'm glad that is still the case.

    USAgent might have been mildly flirty with Bobbi, but its hard to tell since he is referring to every woman character with pet names like "doll" and "sweetheart", etc. It fits with both Walker's tendency to be rude and condescending as well as his Southern "good ol' boy" background, but I do hope Rosenberg dials it down a bit for the rest of the mini. I've never known the Agent to do it so often as he was doing here so it started to feel a bit much by the end of the issue, imo.

    We see that the Force Works organization has more members beyond the 4 that are starring in this mini. the IRON MAN 2020 book already showed The Gauntlet as a member, and he gets a brief appearance here too. We also see spoilers:
    Maria Hill in a leadership role in the organization. How the heck did SHE get back into a position of authority with the government? She was fired as head of SHIELD for repeated serious lapses in judgement, abuses of power, and illegal operations, and last I knew was staying off the grid in civilian life. With her record why on Earth would the government ever re-hire her for a position of authority? Exploit her skills as an off-the-books agent in the field? Sure. But a command position of an agency? Come on!
    end of spoilers

    The mini is off to a good start and I am very much looking forward to the next issue! I'm just sorry the mini is only three issues - it hardly seems like there will be enough time for the fun character dynamics among this group along with the actual story of their mission against the Robot Revolution.

  8. #53
    Invincible Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Maria wasn't off the grid. She was with the CIA when she showed up in Invisible Woman.
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  9. #54
    Fantastic Member OOTCS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dermie View Post
    Got it, loved it!

    We get some nice Mockingbird moments here, although of the four lead characters Bobbi may just have the least panel time in this particular issue. That should change going forward though -- this issue was bringing the cast together, and now that they are together the spotlight should spread a bit more evenly I think.

    I enjoyed the Bobbi/USAgent reunion. She is the one member of the group who seems to be able to tolerate him, which I am glad to see. The two of them got along well enough back in the WCA days (at least better than Walker tended to get along with the rest of the team), so I'm glad that is still the case.

    USAgent might have been mildly flirty with Bobbi, but its hard to tell since he is referring to every woman character with pet names like "doll" and "sweetheart", etc. It fits with both Walker's tendency to be rude and condescending as well as his Southern "good ol' boy" background, but I do hope Rosenberg dials it down a bit for the rest of the mini. I've never known the Agent to do it so often as he was doing here so it started to feel a bit much by the end of the issue, imo.

    We see that the Force Works organization has more members beyond the 4 that are starring in this mini. the IRON MAN 2020 book already showed The Gauntlet as a member, and he gets a brief appearance here too. We also see spoilers:
    Maria Hill in a leadership role in the organization. How the heck did SHE get back into a position of authority with the government? She was fired as head of SHIELD for repeated serious lapses in judgement, abuses of power, and illegal operations, and last I knew was staying off the grid in civilian life. With her record why on Earth would the government ever re-hire her for a position of authority? Exploit her skills as an off-the-books agent in the field? Sure. But a command position of an agency? Come on!
    end of spoilers

    The mini is off to a good start and I am very much looking forward to the next issue! I'm just sorry the mini is only three issues - it hardly seems like there will be enough time for the fun character dynamics among this group along with the actual story of their mission against the Robot Revolution.
    As usual, great analysis and I agree with almost everything you wrote. I do disagree regarding US Agent. I think he and Bobbi got along for a little while until he admitted that he only thought of her as eye candy, which killed any goodwill she had towards him. She warmed up to him a little bit in the few issues before her death, but with the Skrull retcon, there goes that. Anyway, I don't see Bobbi (with her long history as a feminist and who, in her first appearance as Mockingbird, warned a bunch of SHIELD agents not to call her Baby, and told them off for underestimating her because she was a woman) letting him call her nicknames like Doll and Darling no matter how long she's known him. I'm okay with her tolerating him in general, but that doesn't mean she should let his sexism slide.

    I also don't see how Maria Hill keeps bouncing back. What she did with Pleasant Hill was arguably worse from a moral perspective than Fury's Secret War, and from a practical point of view it was at least as dangerous. Someone suggested to me that her anti-superhero biases might line up with the biases of the feelings of people with power (in-universe), and that's the reason she keeps her slate wiped clean.

    And yes, I don't see how three issues is going to be able to contain all of this fast-paced action as well as any decent character moments! It's just too short.

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    Maria wasn't off the grid. She was with the CIA when she showed up in Invisible Woman.
    Ah, right - I'd forgotten that she'd turned up again recently. Her most recent appearance that I could remember was in JESSICA JONES where she was still off the grid.

    The CIA thing makes sense to me though - its using her skills in the field, but not putting her in a position of authority.

    Quote Originally Posted by OOTCS View Post
    As usual, great analysis and I agree with almost everything you wrote. I do disagree regarding US Agent. I think he and Bobbi got along for a little while until he admitted that he only thought of her as eye candy, which killed any goodwill she had towards him. She warmed up to him a little bit in the few issues before her death, but with the Skrull retcon, there goes that.
    True, most of the friendlier Bobbi and the Agents interactions are now the Skrull. I don't know if that entirely erases what it says about Bobbi's attitude to the Agent though. These Skrull sleeper agents were not just assuming the heroes' appearances--they were also matching brain patterns and such to be able to avoid detection by telepaths, etc. One of the Skrulls posing as Hank Pym was so absorbed in the role that he turned against the Skrulls. The Mockingbird Skrull got herself killed by protecting Clint (and rescuing Wanda) -- a risk she didn't need to take but was in-character for Bobbi.

    I don't think USAgent's comment about her looks destroyed any goodwill towards him though. She kicked his butt to prove her point, but she didn't seem to hold any grudge against him over it.

    Quote Originally Posted by OOTCS View Post
    Anyway, I don't see Bobbi (with her long history as a feminist and who, in her first appearance as Mockingbird, warned a bunch of SHIELD agents not to call her Baby, and told them off for underestimating her because she was a woman) letting him call her nicknames like Doll and Darling no matter how long she's known him. I'm okay with her tolerating him in general, but that doesn't mean she should let his sexism slide.
    Yeah, it bothered me too. I can see Bobbi allowing it IF their relationship has become friendlier off-panel at some point, to a point where she's decided to allow it. But that's a big IF, and so far there's nothing to suggest it.

    Quote Originally Posted by OOTCS View Post
    I also don't see how Maria Hill keeps bouncing back. What she did with Pleasant Hill was arguably worse from a moral perspective than Fury's Secret War, and from a practical point of view it was at least as dangerous. Someone suggested to me that her anti-superhero biases might line up with the biases of the feelings of people with power (in-universe), and that's the reason she keeps her slate wiped clean.
    That's possible -- it makes as much sense as anything else. She also may have used her SHIELD position to gain secrets and such that she can use to bribe and/or blackmail people into keeping her around. She tried some similar tactics during the tribunal to have her removed as head of SHIELD.

  11. #56
    Extraordinary Member Winterboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OOTCS View Post
    Don't forget to pick up Force Works 2020 #1 today!
    bobbi 1.jpg
    bobbi 2.jpg

    "Who wouldn't go out with the Black Widow? I'd strangle a litter of kittens for one dinner with her!"
    Adrian Toomes aka the Vulture


    "Natasha Romanoff, A.K.A. Black Widow - ex-KGB, formerly with S.H.I.E.L.D...Probably the brains of this operation.I have followed her career, and she has been consistently UNDERRATED."

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Winterboy View Post
    "I know nobody ever wants to hear this, but John's right."

  13. #58
    Fantastic Member OOTCS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dermie View Post
    True, most of the friendlier Bobbi and the Agents interactions are now the Skrull. I don't know if that entirely erases what it says about Bobbi's attitude to the Agent though. These Skrull sleeper agents were not just assuming the heroes' appearances--they were also matching brain patterns and such to be able to avoid detection by telepaths, etc. One of the Skrulls posing as Hank Pym was so absorbed in the role that he turned against the Skrulls. The Mockingbird Skrull got herself killed by protecting Clint (and rescuing Wanda) -- a risk she didn't need to take but was in-character for Bobbi.

    I don't think USAgent's comment about her looks destroyed any goodwill towards him though. She kicked his butt to prove her point, but she didn't seem to hold any grudge against him over it.
    I guess it's up for interpretation, because they get knocked out by the Kree at the end of the scene, and then Bobbi's gone for a few issues, and they don't really interact before Bobbi gets replaced, but it does seem like those few interactions are cooler in tone. In her entrance in issue #87 she's sarcastic to both him and Hawkeye, and then early on after [Skrull] Mockingbird and Hawkeye get back together, he complains about their PDA and [Skrull] Bobbi suggests to Hawkeye that they go find somewhere private and leave US Agent to "play with his rocks." You could always say that it's just her sense of humor and not meant to be taken personally, but I interpreted it as dislike because I think his offense was severe enough that it makes sense that she'd stop liking him altogether because of it.

    Skrull Mockingbird adapting to real Bobbi's personality and acting in ways that Bobbi would means to me that the real Bobbi could eventually have softened to him again if she had been there, but since wasn't, she didn't live through those experiences, and it never happened. On the other hand, time and distance could have helped her let go of any grudge she may have held against him.

    Yeah, it bothered me too. I can see Bobbi allowing it IF their relationship has become friendlier off-panel at some point, to a point where she's decided to allow it. But that's a big IF, and so far there's nothing to suggest it.
    I think "Darling" could be okay if and only if they've become close (Natasha calling her Darling in Secret Avengers was fine and even endearing), but not "Doll," not ever. Dolls are pretty and ornamental and have no agency--not something that Bobbi wants to be associated with. But since he was throwing around "Sweetheart" with Daisy, it seems like it was more a general case of how he interacts with women than a close relationship with Bobbi.

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by OOTCS View Post
    I guess it's up for interpretation, because they get knocked out by the Kree at the end of the scene, and then Bobbi's gone for a few issues, and they don't really interact before Bobbi gets replaced, but it does seem like those few interactions are cooler in tone. In her entrance in issue #87 she's sarcastic to both him and Hawkeye, and then early on after [Skrull] Mockingbird and Hawkeye get back together, he complains about their PDA and [Skrull] Bobbi suggests to Hawkeye that they go find somewhere private and leave US Agent to "play with his rocks." You could always say that it's just her sense of humor and not meant to be taken personally, but I interpreted it as dislike because I think his offense was severe enough that it makes sense that she'd stop liking him altogether because of it.

    Skrull Mockingbird adapting to real Bobbi's personality and acting in ways that Bobbi would means to me that the real Bobbi could eventually have softened to him again if she had been there, but since wasn't, she didn't live through those experiences, and it never happened. On the other hand, time and distance could have helped her let go of any grudge she may have held against him.
    True enough.

    One hint that they do have a closer relationship at the moment (other than the fact that Bobbi didn't tell him off in this issue) is that she referred to him as "John" rather than "USAgent", "the Agent", or "Walker". Its pretty rare that we see anyone other than his friends call USAgent by his first name.

    Quote Originally Posted by OOTCS View Post
    I think "Darling" could be okay if and only if they've become close (Natasha calling her Darling in Secret Avengers was fine and even endearing), but not "Doll," not ever. Dolls are pretty and ornamental and have no agency--not something that Bobbi wants to be associated with. But since he was throwing around "Sweetheart" with Daisy, it seems like it was more a general case of how he interacts with women than a close relationship with Bobbi.
    I agree. USAgent is a southern "good old boy", so those sorts of pet names would be common enough...usually with no disrespect intended; they just honestly don't realize how condescending it is. And since we're talking about USAgent, who tends to enjoy pissing people off, it would not surprise me at all for him to do it intentionally to Daisy because it annoys her.

  15. #60

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    It'd be interesting to see Bobbi have another solo series again.

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