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  1. #1
    BAMF!!!!! KurtW95's Avatar
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    Default The Original Gwen Stacy Appreciation 2020

    This is the place to go to share your appreciation for the true love of Peter Parker who did not deserve the fate she received in 1973.

    Gwen was a strong, intelligent, and independent character who cared for the man under the mask rather than the mask itself. I hope Marvel eventually gets the common sense to bring her back to the land of the living in the Marvel Universe.



    NOTE: This is not a Spider-Gwen thread. Here, we’ll focus our on the original 616 Gwen and her several adaptions that do not include spider powers.
    Good Marvel characters- Bring Them Back!!!

  2. #2
    Astonishing Member KangMiRae's Avatar
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    I love Gwen, but she should never be brought back. It’ll do nothing but damage the Spider-Man lore. What would she do besides stunt the years of development between Peter and MJ?

    They’d just ship her off to some other guy and that’ll just destroy her role as Peter’s first true love.
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  3. #3
    BAMF!!!!! KurtW95's Avatar
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    Though didn’t MJ stunt the development between him and Gwen? Seriously I think Gwen is a much better character to be Peter’s main love interest and it would only be putting it back to the way Stan Lee wanted.
    Good Marvel characters- Bring Them Back!!!

  4. #4
    Really Feeling It! Kevinroc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KurtW95 View Post
    Though didn’t MJ stunt the development between him and Gwen? Seriously I think Gwen is a much better character to be Peter’s main love interest and it would only be putting it back to the way Stan Lee wanted.
    This seems to imply Stan hated Peter/MJ when it should be clear that he absolutely did not. He wouldn't have made them canon to his newspaper strip if he did.

  5. #5
    Astonishing Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KurtW95 View Post
    Though didn’t MJ stunt the development between him and Gwen?
    Indirectly yes. Lee kept rewriting and redoing the character of Gwen to make fans who preferred MJ to transfer that to Gwen. It just didn't work no matter what Lee and Romita did and it ultimately stunted Gwen as a character, making her disposable.

    Seriously I think Gwen is a much better character to be Peter’s main love interest and it would only be putting it back to the way Stan Lee wanted.
    "The trouble with wanting something is getting what you once wanted" -- Neil Gaiman, The Sandman.

    Lee wanted Peter/Gwen for a few years in the '60s and '70s and after that, he just went with MJ and literally never looked back.

  6. #6
    Extraordinary Member Celgress's Avatar
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    Thank you KurtW95 for starting this thread. I for one have always been a fan of OG Gwen and feel she deserved far better. Let's show 616 Gwen some love folks.

    Here is my contribution a What If Gwen Stacy Lived? story which has become rather popular (if I do say so myself) on the site where I've posted it. If so inclined, enjoy -

    https://www.fanfiction.net/s/1276833...wined-Destines

    FYI While everyone thinks the title is a misspelling it is not. By "Entwined Destines" rather than "Entwined Destinies" I mean a group of interconnected individuals each of whom is destined for great things (thus entwined destines).
    Last edited by Conn Seanery; 01-10-2020 at 04:56 PM.
    "So you've come to the end now alive but dead inside."

  7. #7

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    Truthfully Gwen was never written well by Lee and from my understanding hated by Conway, MJ has had writers not do her justice both can be good partners for Peter.
    However for me the story of MJ has been done and done well for many years I don't think its silly that Gwen has a chance, but it is a issue with the Fandom.
    Its what we like for so long and everything else sucks

    Truthfully sorry Kurt but I personally think you were wrong to imply that MJ isn't a great match for Peter because I think
    she is however she has had her story told i can't think of anything else to do that Marvel refuse to do which is marriage and kids however Gwen hasnt had a extended relationship with Peter
    where she knows who is under the mask. Bringing back Gwen isn't common sense but it could be very good creatively however i'm not sure Spencer is the one to do it which is a shame.
    Last edited by Conn Seanery; 01-10-2020 at 04:58 PM.
    Truth is the best policy

  8. #8
    Incredible Member Ozymandias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    Lee kept rewriting and redoing the character
    Lee wasn't any good at characterization, so saying that he showed us different versions of a given character, isn't saying much about the character but rather about the writer or, more precisely, about the Marvel Method.

  9. #9
    Astonishing Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
    Lee wasn't any good at characterization, so saying that he showed us different versions of a given character, isn't saying much about the character but rather about the writer or, more precisely, about the Marvel Method.
    Lee was good at characterization for some (men mostly), and was good at differentiation. Like the fact that each character looks and sounds different.

    In the case of Gwen, when Ditko was around, Gwen had a distinct personality that was overwritten by Lee. He didn't try and stay consistent with Ditko's take and develop that.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    Lee was good at characterization for some (men mostly), and was good at differentiation. Like the fact that each character looks and sounds different.

    In the case of Gwen, when Ditko was around, Gwen had a distinct personality that was overwritten by Lee. He didn't try and stay consistent with Ditko's take and develop that.
    Yeah...she came off rather feisty and easy to anger
    she also came off like she could get any man's attention and would get irritated that Peter ignored her
    I created a thread about Dick Grayson/Nightwing and Koriand'r/Starfire.
    It is to acknowledge and honor their iconic and popular relationship.
    https://comicvine.gamespot.com/teen-...rfire-1975639/

    I created a fan page about Peter Parker/Spider-Man and Mary Jane Watson.
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    http://www.facebook.com/SpiderManMaryJane/

  11. #11
    Incredible Member Ozymandias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    Lee was good at characterization for some (men mostly), and was good at differentiation. Like the fact that each character looks and sounds different.

    In the case of Gwen, when Ditko was around, Gwen had a distinct personality that was overwritten by Lee. He didn't try and stay consistent with Ditko's take and develop that.
    Well, the women were appallingly written, so in that respect, you can say that men were better written, but not up to a "good" degree. The only exception to this rule, would be the characters developed "in collaboration" with Ditko.

    Lee instructed Romita to follow in his predecessor's footsteps. Romita said that much when talking about Peter, and it describes an attitude on the writer's part, that's too laissez-faire to think Lee tried anything very much. This is in line with the Marvel Method, where a writer (insert Lee here) wasn't required to give a detailed script to the artist.

  12. #12
    Astonishing Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
    Well, the women were appallingly written, so in that respect, you can say that men were better written, but not up to a "good" degree. The only exception to this rule, would be the characters developed "in collaboration" with Ditko.

    Lee instructed Romita to follow in his predecessor's footsteps. Romita said that much when talking about Peter, and it describes an attitude on the writer's part, that's too laissez-faire to think Lee tried anything very much. This is in line with the Marvel Method, where a writer (insert Lee here) wasn't required to give a detailed script to the artist.
    If you look at Lee's writing...Sue and Reed, Jane Foster and Thor (that appalling issue where Odin banishes her), Hank and Janet (which was admittedly one of the better couples that Stan wrote, arguably better than when Roy Thomas got hold of the characters)...it's not the best. Marvel's great romances, Scott/Jean, and Peter/MJ, and when Frank Miller wrote Daredevil -- Matt/Elektra and Matt/Karen developed under the pen of writers who followed Lee.
    Last edited by Conn Seanery; 01-10-2020 at 04:59 PM.

  13. #13
    Incredible Member Ozymandias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    If you look at Lee's writing...Sue and Reed, Jane Foster and Thor (that appalling issue where Odin banishes her), Hank and Janet (which was admittedly one of the better couples that Stan wrote, arguably better than when Roy Thomas got hold of the characters)...it's not the best.
    No, it certainly isn't. Not only where the female characters slight variations of the same empty shell, there always seemed to be a reason for them to postpone getting it on. I'm still finishing 65' and the only characters that even date, are Peter and Johnny. I'll leave The Thing out of the conversation, not to risk a Mallrats-ish comment. The adults took it ridiculously serious, the reason for remaining single clearly entering in the realm of the excuse. If that wasn't enough, in one case, they even copied the situation entirely from the triangle Tony/Pepper/Happy to Matt/Karen/Foggy. I guess Lee just run out of excuses.

    In this context, Ditko's take on the subject was as refreshing as the rest of the mag. His female characters had personality and even a background (in Betty's case), they didn't remain static (Liz didn't turn out to be the dumb blonde you'd think) and the relationships weren't predicated on unconditional love at first sight.

  14. #14
    Astonishing Member jetengine's Avatar
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    I'd be interested if a writer found a logical way to tie all the different takes on her in 616 and tie them all together.

  15. #15
    Spam Hunter Conn Seanery's Avatar
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    Contact each other privately or move on from the what is or isn't appropriate for the thread stuff, folks. If you're here to appreciate Gwen Stacy, great. If you're not, seeya.
    Conn Seanery
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