X-Force #5 Review: The reunification of one James "Logan" Howlett

[JB]

Who said anything about it being ethically fine? And really? This is the same Jean Grey that mentally assaulted Emma Frost and that was only because she was sleeping with her husband psychically. Now imagine what she would do to a trained mercenary who was going around torturing her friends shooting, her father figure and killing other members in her community? A little psychic interrogation is well within reason here in order to find out who these people work for and how to stop the next attack.

And killing other humans that have allied with the mutants.

[JB]

Well, I mean, considering Beast is a former Avenger...if they haven't before, they technically have now.

Haha Logan too.

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

Haha Logan too.

Oh shit, you're right! Lol, how'd I forget that??

[Prof. Warren]

Excuse me? Have you seen the stellar review I've given this issue? The data pages are an ongoing element that I see to be a flaw--I agreed with another user's opinion of such and explained my reasoning.

Ok, I should make things clearer then:

Your ongoing complaints about the data pages and your perception of them as a "flaw" is completely silly and, as criticism, is nothing but an empty stretch.

Which is exactly my criticism; they are easily skipped, but shouldn't be if they do bear such relevant character developments. It's one thing to offer extra information, such as Forge's notebook, but events like what was described for Black Tom should not be considered as such.

The data page on Black Tom in this issue falls under the category of "extra information."

It is if it's meant to be as a set-up for Black Tom's own arc. That's where it'll have started; but those who skip it will be scratching their heads thinking "Where the hell did this come from?" Even more-so if it continues only on data pages and then, bam, Black Tom gets some kind of epic moment at the end of the story that we're all just thinking "Alright, what the fuck?" at.

I'm sure any continuation of material on the data page regarding Black Tom will account for the possibility that not everyone will have read the data page material - or even the previous issues, for that matter - and be written in such a way that will be perfectly understandable to all. Don't worry about storylines that haven't happened yet or how these yet-to-be-told tales will be presented.

Which is why it should be reserved for interesting facts about say, weapons or such. Not what characters are up to in the background.

That's actually a perfect use of the data page - filling in background detail not pertinent to action driving the main plot.

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

Ok, I should make things clearer then:

Your ongoing complaints about the data pages and your perception of them as a "flaw" is completely silly and, as criticism, is nothing but an empty stretch.

Well unfortunately dude, until they fix it those ain't going anywhere. It's my right to say and I'm gonna say it. It's how I engage with the medium.

The data page on Black Tom in this issue falls under the category of "extra information."

Even if it depicts a rather important development in a character's life? You think such a drastic power shift is really alright to be declared 'extra information' over, say, an expositionary spiel about what the content stolen does?

I'm sure any continuation of material on the data page regarding Black Tom will account for the possibility that not everyone will have read the data page material - or even the previous issues, for that matter - and be written in such a way that will be perfectly understandable to all. Don't worry about storylines that haven't happened yet or how these yet-to-be-told tales will be presented.

Alright, but don't be shocked if people start complaining that it feels out of nowhere or somehow forced.

That's actually a perfect use of the data page - filling in background detail not pertinent to action driving the main plot.

Exactly, which I argue characters should not be considered as such.

[Mr. White]

Great issue. Loving this entire "CIA" angle. We can already see where the conflicts of the Intelligence Team and the Field Team will be arising though I guess Dom's responses were a direct result of the trauma. Sage's looks/expressions were also interesting and think are worthy of note. Should keep an eye on her...

Just to chime in on the data pages discussion:

I personally think they are great and a novel way (don't think they have been done before) to flesh out the story or in this case, a character, while keeping within the [22]-page limit. Reminds me of Fraction's Immortal Fist that introduced the names of the fighting styles/ moves; something that was picked up by other writers in various manners.

While I appreciate comics are a visual medium, I for one don't find the data pages offensive (especially in consideration of the above). In addition, I don't particularly think the whole Dawn of X (approach) is written for people that will "skip data pages"; something an earlier post mentioned. Think one needs to apply a bit more cerebral effort these days than what is expected from "traditional" comics simply involving good guys punching bad guys. Point is, I'm not sure the writer's expect readers to skip the data pages. Disclaimer - only reading this and X-Men religiously while scanning friends copies of Maruders so my comment on the generality of the DoX approach should be taken with a pinch of salt.

Of course all this is just my $0.02...

[Prof. Warren]

Well unfortunately dude, until they fix it those ain't going anywhere. It's my right to say and I'm gonna say it. It's how I engage with the medium.

Well, sure.

I guess some people could also "engage" with closed doors by trying to run through them rather than opening them or "engage" with their food by throwing it against the wall rather than actually eating it. Some might say those people are doing it wrong - like, really wrong - but, you know, it's their right and everybody makes choices.

Just to chime in on the data pages discussion:

I personally think they are great and a novel way (don't think they have been done before) to flesh out the story or in this case, a character, while keeping within the [22]-page limit. Reminds me of Fraction's Immortal Fist that introduced the names of the fighting styles/ moves; something that was picked up by other writers in various manners.

While I appreciate comics are a visual medium, I for one don't find the data pages offensive (especially in consideration of the above). In addition, I don't particularly think the whole Dawn of X (approach) is written for people that will "skip data pages"; something an earlier post mentioned. Think one needs to apply a bit more cerebral effort these days than what is expected from "traditional" comics simply involving good guys punching bad guys. Point is, I'm not sure the writer's expect readers to skip the data pages.

I also don't think the data pages are written with the expectations that readers will choose to skip them. There's too much care and creativity put into them for that. But it is clear that the books are structured in such a way that one could skip them and still understand the story.

[Omnipitus]

When working with a large casts you just have to prioritize some characters over others but overall Percy has done an amazing job at balancing the cast so far. Like I honestly can't pick out one character that's the main POV character for this book unlike Marauders with Kate and Emma which is great makes it feel like a true team book.

They've all had their moments in the past 5 issues sans Colossus.

As a Colossus fan, I am a bit apprehensive about the moments Peter will get.

I am a cynic, though. He may not be the "sleeper", turn villian again, or die. Again.

[The Thunderbird]

And killing other humans that have allied with the mutants.

I wonder this is why Jean was so brutal to the merc. I remember Jean always being averse to civilian casualties and she might get angry if people end up dying.

I think it's deliberate that the merc was humanized by having him talk about his dog and his memories. One question though. Why would he have to call his neighbor about his dog if he knowingly took a job where he could be captured or killed? He should of had a contingency plan in case he gets incapacitated. Maybe that's why Hank wasn't buying into his request for a phone call.

[Glio]

Well, I mean, considering Beast is a former Avenger...if they haven't before, they technically have now.

Beast was a secret avenger and a Illuminati. He has done unethical things before.

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

I wonder this is why Jean was so brutal to the merc. I remember Jean always being averse to civilian casualties and she might get angry if people end up dying.

I think it's deliberate that the merc was humanized by having him talk about his dog and his memories. One question though. Why would he have to call his neighbor about his dog if he knowingly took a job where he could be captured or killed? He should of had a contingency plan in case he gets incapacitated. Maybe that's why Hank wasn't buying into his request for a phone call.

Both really good points!

And you do have to consider this, despite how humanised Bill was allowed to be: Is it genuine or is it a scam? But that's exactly the complexity of that narrative so far, more-so if it's never answered! It puts it on us to trust whether or not Bill was lying.

[JB]

I wonder this is why Jean was so brutal to the merc. I remember Jean always being averse to civilian casualties and she might get angry if people end up dying.

I think it's deliberate that the merc was humanized by having him talk about his dog and his memories. One question though. Why would he have to call his neighbor about his dog if he knowingly took a job where he could be captured or killed? He should of had a contingency plan in case he gets incapacitated. Maybe that's why Hank wasn't buying into his request for a phone call.

Agreed. I don't trust Bill at the moment considering he had no problem shooting up Greenspace. But I'm looking forward to seeing what happens next and that's a lovely thing to feel.

[AbnormallyNormal]

It just keeps making what happened with Creed all the more blatantly absurd

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

It just keeps making what happened with Creed all the more blatantly absurd

I feel bad for Creed...like all this has actually turned me from the type to be "Ah fuck off Sabretooth" to "No, actually, I wanna delve further into what you're about..."

[AbnormallyNormal]

I feel bad for Creed...like all this has actually turned me from the type to be "Ah fuck off Sabretooth" to "No, actually, I wanna delve further into what you're about..."

That's cuz you have a kind soul lol....

But yeah I was enjoying the more reformed Sabretooth in Bunn's Uncanny and then in Pak's Weapon X. He was enjoyable as heck. Reverting him into "MONSTER" is boring IMO. And then we have tons of fans not only justifying but saying it's GREAT when their favorites act just as viciously if not worse. Rolls eyes