What do you like/dislike about Krakoa? (As a concept)

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

Not really, i think about it more abstract in the respect that it would be nice if people could really be in a place where everyone could just see them. But i wouldn't want to have to create a new home or leave my country which i love for it happen. I like that it can exist, even if it really doesn't. if that makes sense.

No, I totally understand!! In fact, I'm 100% in the same boat!

See, my problem as an autistic reader is that I project too much onto these characters; empathising with them is actually how I manage my traumas and make sense of everyday life. I felt like an awful person for feeling disheartened and freaked out that 'this' was the only way. Like, because I was different, I had to go away--I had to give up on what I was fighting for in the first place. Like, "I don't want to leave because, no, this is my home. You don't get to take that away from me." if that makes sense?

You, however, don't see it that way and I'd like to ask how so? How do readers who might not be able to see it as you do...well, see it as you do!

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

Well, we don't hear how mutants are going to extinguish all the time (they will in the future) but for the moment the characters seem to enjoy some tranquility on their lifes, they have a pretty place to live and are a global superpower, they don't even fear death anymore. That would be boring but is the contrast after so many years of extinctions what makes it feel fresh

So what about it being a global super-power do you find important? (And, I promise, I'm not trying to interrogate you, lol! Just to help us all see the other side a bit?)

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

Too much inneuendo and fan baiting. Just come out and say it if monogamy is out the window, there's no comics code to rap us on the knuckles. I HATE ambiguity. It always comes across as a writer being too precious.

I'm exactly the same as you! I hate ambiguity; I like natural, organic progression that doesn't feel contrived.

What else about ambiguity bothers you?

[phoenixzero23]

If you don't mind me asking (for the benefit of conversation and to help others see your point of view) what about these things in my quote frustrates you so? Or is it pretty much that?

In general those things make me feel like these characters are trying to be something different than humans, which is what they essentially are just with superpowers.

[phoenixzero23]

So what about it being a global super-power do you find important? (And, I promise, I'm not trying to interrogate you, lol! Just to help us all see the other side a bit?)

It is not important (to me). It is just a refreshing change after more than a decade of being underdogs.
Misery gets boring after a while.

[Handsome men don't lose fights]

So you're frustrated that it feels a bit hypocritical, is probably fair to say? Do you think Charles should have been a bit more mindful of that, considering, as you've pointed out, what he's lived through?

Well, that's the thing: He hasn't lived long enough. For that matter, neither has Apocalypse. Humanity is 500,000 years old. It's laughable to think these comparative twerps have all the answers. Xavier is a really clever philosopher, but he' s also got the philosopher's disease: Presumption.

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

In general those things make me feel like these characters are trying to be something different than humans, which is what they essentially are just with superpowers.

So you feel like they aren't really practicing what they preach? Like, they want to be better than humans but don't seem to be showing an example of how to do so? You feel that mutants and humans just aren't so different?

[jwatson]

No, I totally understand!! In fact, I'm 100% in the same boat!

See, my problem as an autistic reader is that I project too much onto these characters; empathising with them is actually how I manage my traumas and make sense of everyday life. I felt like an awful person for feeling disheartened and freaked out that 'this' was the only way. Like, because I was different, I had to go away--I had to give up on what I was fighting for in the first place. Like, "I don't want to leave because, no, this is my home. You don't get to take that away from me." if that makes sense?

You, however, don't see it that way and I'd like to ask how so? How do readers who might not be able to see it as you do...well, see it as you do!

I think they have to ask themselves very real questions. And yes you make perfect sense to me. Why do i feel this way about someone i have never met? Why would i stand back and watch someone be hurt just for being different? What if it were me? What if it was my son, daughter, mother, father? There can be no understanding imo without empathy? How can you love one human but see another who has done nothing to you as something completely foreign? How can you have such strong feelings about a group you may have never seen or met? Why is one form of weapon seen as more dangerous than the other? Where is the common ground? If not but for this one thing could we be in each other shoes? Why can't i see this person for who or what they are? What makes me different? What makes me think i'm different? Where are we the same? I don't think we can get there without self realization. Why do i like to harm but i don't like pain?

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

Well, that's the thing: He hasn't lived long enough. For that matter, neither has Apocalypse. Humanity is 500,000 years old. It's laughable to think these comparative twerps have all the answers. Xavier is a really clever philosopher, but he' s also got the philosopher's disease: Presumption.

Ah, I can understand that. It feels a bit pompous? You wonder what exactly makes it so that they, definitely have all the answers? You aren't convinced that they do and that it needs a bit more proving before they start bragging about it?

[phoenixzero23]

So you feel like they aren't really practicing what they preach? Like, they want to be better than humans but don't seem to be showing an example of how to do so? You feel that mutants and humans just aren't so different?

They are the same thing to me. If mutants start seeing themselves as something different to normal people (or worse, something superior) they lose their charm to me and feel exclusive instead of inclusive.

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

I think they have to ask themselves very real questions. And yes you make perfect sense to me. Why do i feel this way about someone i have never met? Why would i stand back and watch someone be hurt just for being different? What if it were me? What if it was my son, daughter, mother, father? There can be no understanding imo opinion without empathy? How can you love one human but see another who has done nothing to you as something completely foreign? How can you have such strong feelings about a group you may have never seen or met? Why is one form of weapon seen as more dangerous than the other? Where is the common ground? If not but for this one thing could we be in each other shoes? Why can't i see this person for who or what they are? What makes me different? What makes me think i'm different? Where are we the same? I don't think we can get there without self realization. Why do i like to harm but i don't like pain?

Now, see, yes! You and I are definitely on the same page in that respect!! Those are exactly the questions that keep flooding into my head when I read and, I must be honest, sometimes its' a bit frustrating to see in-narrative.

For example; how can you love one human but see another who has done nothing to you as something completely foreign? --I don't understand this at all! And it bothers me in narrative, actually!

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

They are the same thing to me. If mutants start seeing themselves as something different to normal people (or worse, something superior) they lose their charm to me and feel exclusive instead of inclusive.

I definitely see what you mean. It's like seeing the tables flipped for the worse without, maybe, understanding how they could get there so suddenly? Or, maybe, like me, you're struggling to see where the empathy these characters once had comes across? Why does the reversal of the situation do that, do you think? Is it because they don't feel 'normal' anymore? What makes it feel so detached?

[Handsome men don't lose fights]

Personally, I think the real enemy is whoever infected the world community with the idea that for mutants to thrive, humans had to go extinct. It's such an obvious lie to turn them against each other, and it's working like gangbusters.

[U.N. Owen]

One of my friends says that he likes Krakoa, but he does see why people don't like it. The idea of building a nation has some rather negative connotations nowadays because building nation states in history were not pretty. Even before the rise of fascism which is nationalism on steroids, we had some pretty disturbing nation building in our history: German Unification, Italian Unification, Japanese homogenizing their culture, the United States and their bloody history with Native Americans, Chinese culture basically being written by Mao.

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

One of my friends says that he likes Krakoa, but he does see why people don't like it. The idea of building a nation has some rather negative connotations nowadays because building nation states in history were not pretty. Even before the rise of fascism which is nationalism on steroids, we had some pretty disturbing nation building in our history: German Unification, Italian Unification, Japanese homogenizing their culture, the United States and their bloody history with Native Americans, Chinese culture basically being written by Mao.

Now those are fascinating! How do you relate those to Krakoa, if you don't mind me asking? Or, what exactly about Krakoa as a concept brings up those connotations?